The Sacred Slope

71. The Religious Left Isn't New. The Spotlight Is. | Rev. Joseph Yoo (Episcopal)

Thu, 05 Nov 2026 23:00:00 -0000

71. The Religious Left Isn't New. The Spotlight Is. | Rev. Joseph Yoo (Episcopal)

After the 2026 midterms, Ezra Klein described the “return of a religious left,” while Vox and NPR have explored progressive Christianity's role in politics. Welcome! We're thrilled this conversation is happening, and we'd love to introduce you to the bigger story.

The religious left isn't new. For generations, pastors, scholars and churches have advocated for justice, challenged Christian nationalism and welcomed people beyond conservative evangelicalism. Christianity is global and diverse. No party or movement owns it.

Recorded the morning after the election, Episcopal priest Rev. Joseph Yoo joins Alexis Rice to discuss progressive Christianity, the Bible, LGBTQ+ inclusion, women in ministry, deconstruction and finding affirming churches. They also explore what journalists, donors and civic leaders can learn from people who've been doing this work for decades.

WHO IS THIS FOR?

Christians, former evangelicals, journalists, seekers and people of any faith or none. You're welcome here.

GUEST + HOST

Rev. Joseph Yoo | @joseph.yoo
Alexis Rice | @thesacredslope

PEOPLE + RESOURCES

Also mentioned: James Talarico, Adam Hamilton, Richard Rohr, Mike Slaughter and Gina Hinojosa.

FIND AN AFFIRMING CHURCH

https://www.gaychurch.org/
https://www.churchclarity.org/

MEDIA + PARTNERSHIPS

Journalists, funders and organizations: for interviews or introductions to progressive Christian pastors, scholars and creators, contact alexis@thesacredslope.com. Explore https://thesacredslope.com/.

Please share this episode with someone discovering progressive Christianity, or a journalist covering faith and politics.

EPISODE CHAPTERS

00:00 Deconstructing and rebuilding
01:55 The religious left isn't new
09:46 Meet Rev. Joseph Yoo
17:32 What progressive Christians believe
24:20 We've been here all along
29:38 Media and the religious left
34:09 Deconstruction and questions
39:32 Finding an affirming church
45:47 Rebuilding faith
54:21 Media and funders

#TheSacredSlope #ReligiousLeft #ProgressiveChristianity

70. Can Christians Vote Democrat? Rethinking MAGA, Evangelicalism & Faith | Carter Brown, Leigh Larson & Alexis Rice

Tue, 03 Nov 2026 01:00:00 -0000

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70. Can Christians Vote Democrat? Rethinking MAGA, Evangelicalism & Faith | Carter Brown, Leigh Larson & Alexis Rice

How fun is this? We were on Leigh Larson's Podcast, Follow the Leighder!

Can you be a faithful Christian and vote Democrat? What happens when your conscience no longer agrees with the politics you were taught were Christian?

Former MAGA supporter Carter Brown, theologian and veteran Leigh Larson, and The Sacred Slope host Alexis Rice come together for an honest conversation about Christianity, abortion, voting, and the courage to change your mind.

Drawing on their different faith journeys, the three women explore conservative evangelicalism, Christian nationalism, the pressure to vote Republican, and why no political candidate perfectly represents our values.

From single-issue voting and reproductive freedom to deconstruction and reclaiming faith, they ask what it means to think critically, respect other people's choices, and vote according to conscience.

WHO IS THIS EPISODE FOR?

Christians questioning the relationship between faith and political identity, former evangelicals, people navigating deconstruction, and anyone reconsidering beliefs they once held with certainty.

GUESTS + FOLLOW

Carter Brown | Former MAGA, former evangelical
Instagram/TikTok: @thisiscarterbrown
Substack: https://growthisaspiral.substack.com/

Leigh Larson | Theologian, veteran, host of Follow the Leighder
Instagram: @followtheleighder
Podcast: https://www.followtheleighder.com/
Substack: https://followtheleighder.substack.com/

Alexis Rice | Host, The Sacred Slope
Instagram: @thesacredslope
Website: https://thesacredslope.com/

MENTIONED + RESOURCES

Dan McClellan | @maklelan
Monte Mader | @montemader
Tim Whitaker / The New Evangelicals | @thenewevangelicals
Deconstructicon: https://deconstructicon.com/
After Jesus Before Christianity | Westar Institute scholars

Also discussed: James Talarico, Raphael Warnock, James Dobson, and Adam Clark.

EXPLORE AFFIRMING CHRISTIANITY

Discover conversations with Christian leaders, scholars, clergy, and people rethinking inherited beliefs at https://thesacredslope.com/

Books: https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope

EPISODE CHAPTERS

04:25 Meet Carter Brown, Leigh Larson & Alexis Rice
06:14 Christianity, Politics & Hope
10:55 Abortion, Voting & Political Identity
21:58 Growing Up Conservative Evangelical
26:56 Single-Issue Voting & Changing Your Mind
35:16 Deconstruction & Challenging Religious Authority
43:10 Faith, Reason & Christian Traditions
51:26 What Does Deconstruction Mean?
56:08 Voting, Conscience & Community
1:00:24 Making Progressive Christian Voices Visible
1:08:52 Reexamining Early Christianity
1:12:15 Where to Follow Carter Brown

#TheSacredSlope #Christianity #Deconstruction #ChristianNationalism

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About The Sacred Slope
thesacredslope.com

Where the slippery slope becomes sacred ground.
For the spiritually tender - raised in or rooted in Christianity.
Come explore our global, diverse, inclusive Christian faith, deconstruction, and spiritual identity in a rapidly changing world. Through conversations with clergy, scholars, and cultural voices, the show creates space for people navigating faith after certainty, church harm, or political co-option of religion.

🎧 WATCH: YouTube / Spotify
LISTEN: Apple Podcasts + everywhere
FOLLOW: @thesacredslope (IG, FB, Threads, TikTok, YouTube, Bluesky)

🔗 Connect
🎧 Explore episodes & community: linktr.ee/TheSacredSlope
🎙 Hosted by Alexis Rice
🎵 Music by Brett Rutledge, Eddie Irvin & Sean Spence
📬 Nominate a guest: alexis@thesacredslope.com

🌿 Community Guidelines 🌿
Fruit of the Spirit: ❤️ love • 💫 joy • ☮️ peace • 🕊 patience • 💝 kindness • 🌿 goodness • 🙏 faithfulness • 🤲 gentleness • 💪 self-control

69. Robert G. Callahan II (Christian, Former Evangelical) | Fire in the Whole: Righteous Anger & Reclaiming Faith

Mon, 02 Nov 2026 00:00:00 -0000

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69. Robert G. Callahan II (Christian, Former Evangelical) | Fire in the Whole: Righteous Anger & Reclaiming Faith

What if your anger at the Christianity you inherited isn't evidence that you've lost your faith, but evidence that you still care about what Jesus taught? Can you reject harmful Christianity without rejecting Jesus?

Attorney, author, and Christian advocate Robert G. Callahan II joins Alexis Rice to discuss Fire in the Whole: Embracing Our Righteous Anger with White Christianity and Reclaiming Our Wholeness.

After nearly a decade deeply involved in a conservative church community, Robert confronted racism, political idolatry, and the contradictions between the gospel he believed and the Christianity he experienced.

Alexis and Robert explore righteous anger, spiritual trauma, Christian nationalism, Black Lives Matter, LGBTQ+ inclusion, and the cost of leaving a church community. They discuss why white Christianity isn't synonymous with global Christianity, the importance of listening to marginalized voices, and how to reconstruct faith without abandoning Jesus.

Robert offers encouragement to anyone feeling spiritually homeless: give yourself permission to question, grieve, rest, and heal.

WHO IS THIS EPISODE FOR?

Christians, exvangelicals, pastors, people deconstructing or reconstructing faith, and anyone concerned about racism, religious trauma, justice, and belonging.

GUEST + FOLLOW

Robert G. Callahan II | @rcallahan_waco
RobertGCallahan.com
Friday Fire | Robert's Substack
Callahan & King | Waco, Texas

MENTIONED + RESOURCES

The Sacred Slope Guest Reccos Bookshop:
https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope

EXPLORE AFFIRMING CHRISTIANITY

Hear from guests around the world

TheSacredSlope.com | Episodes, guests & resources

EPISODE CHAPTERS

#Deconstruction #WhiteChristianity #ChristianNationalism #Christianity

Support the show

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LISTEN: Apple Podcasts + everywhere
FOLLOW: @thesacredslope (IG, FB, Threads, TikTok, YouTube, Bluesky)

HIGHLIGHTS #1 | Kristin Kobes Du Mez (Christian) | Live Laugh Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made

Tue, 27 Oct 2026 18:00:00 -0000

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Introducing The Sacred Slope Highlights! 🎙️

We're launching our new Highlights series with the most popular episode in The Sacred Slope's history!

Our conversation with historian and New York Times bestselling author Kristin Kobes Du Mez (@kkdumez) is resonating with more of you than any other episode. And now, here is the snackable edition.

Some of you love an hour-plus deep dive. Others want 20 minutes for your commute, your run, or while cooking dinner. Now you can have both!

What if the Christianity you were taught wasn't simply inherited, but deliberately constructed?

Who decided what Christians should believe, which books they should read, what music they could listen to, and what roles women were allowed to play?

And what happens when the people who faithfully upheld those rules begin questioning the system itself?

In this Highlights edition, Kristin, author of Jesus and John Wayne and Live Laugh Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made, joins Alexis Rice to explore the history behind the evangelical world so many of us grew up in.

In this Highlights edition, we explore:

The system: How American evangelicalism developed a self-contained culture of approved books, music, beliefs, and authorities
The women: Why well-intentioned Christian women became defenders of systems that could also harm them
The forgotten history: Christian feminists who fought for women's rights and interpreted Scripture as a message of liberation
Purity culture: The promises of marriage, happiness, and blessing that left so many women carrying shame
Beth Moore (@bethmoorelpm): What happened when one of evangelicalism's most influential women challenged abuse, misogyny, and Christian nationalism
The bigger question: Why leaving or challenging a religious system can feel like abandoning Christianity itself

Kristin reminds us that evangelical Christianity has never been one uniform tradition. There have always been women who questioned authority, challenged injustice, and imagined another way.

"Real women's lives just do not fit in the neat boxes that fundamentalists draw."

And perhaps the most liberating realization of all?

The Christianity you inherited is not the only Christianity available to you.

🎧 Check out The Sacred Slope Highlights on YouTube, Apple Podcasts, Substack, and Spotify!

Want the entire conversation? Listen to Episode 56: Kristin Kobes Du Mez | Live Laugh Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made.

https://youtu.be/mb5j_wGpMbY?si=kCWjH-IqNz_AQJDt

We'd love to hear from you: What resonated most about this conversation? Why do you think it connected with so many people? And which episode should we highlight next?

⏱️ Highlights Chapters

00:05 The Closed System of Evangelical Culture
01:19 Personal Reflections on Faith and Regret
03:31 Understanding Power Dynamics in Evangelicalism
04:18 The Role of Women in Shaping Evangelical History
06:07 Concluding Thoughts on the Future of Christianity
07:12 The Totalizing System of Evangelicalism
10:08 Purity Culture and Its Impact
14:43 Beth Moore: A Voice of Change
21:51 Nomination Process for Clergy Members

✨ Guest + Books

Kristin Kobes Du Mez | @kkdumez
Live Laugh Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made
Jesus and John Wayne
A New Gospel for Women
Publisher: Liveright Publishing, an imprint of W. W. Norton & Company

📚 People & Resources Mentioned

Beth Moore | @bethmoorelpm
Sarah Bessey | @sarahbessey

#KristinKobesDuMez #LiveLaughLove #Christianity #Evangelicalism #Deconstruction #ChristianNationalism #PurityCulture #WomenInChurch

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LISTEN: Apple Podcasts + everywhere
FOLLOW: @thesacredslope (IG, FB, Threads, TikTok, YouTube, Bluesky)

68. Robert P. Jones, PhD (PRRI) | Backslide: Christian Nationalism, Trump & America's Moral Reckoning

Fri, 23 Oct 2026 18:00:00 -0000

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68. Robert P. Jones, PhD (PRRI) | Backslide: Christian Nationalism, Trump & America's Moral Reckoning

What happens when Christians are taught that one political party speaks for God? What happens to democracy when faith becomes a tool for political power? And how do we reclaim our moral conscience?

Just before the 2026 U.S. midterm elections, Dr. Robert P. Jones (Robby), founder and president of the Public Religion Research Institute (PRRI), joins Alexis Rice to discuss his book Backslide: Reclaiming a Faith and a Nation after the Christian Turn Against Democracy.

I believe Backslide is one of the most important books of our time. Whether you're in America or elsewhere, it offers a way to understand the history, research, and choices shaping this moment.

Tim Whitaker of The New Evangelicals has a cameo joins the episode to reflect on some findings from PRRI's new American Values Survey.

Alexis and Robby discuss Christian nationalism, white evangelical support for Trump, biblical authority, religious formation, and what happens when Christians hand their moral conscience to a party or pastor. They explore the stakes of the midterms, democratic checks and balances, protest, civic engagement, and why American Christian nationalism affects people far beyond U.S. borders. Amid the troubling data, where can we find hope?

WHO IS THIS EPISODE FOR?
Christians, exvangelicals, pastors, scholars, voters, and anyone concerned about faith, democracy, religious nationalism, and human rights worldwide.

MENTIONED + RESOURCES
Backslide; White Too Long; The End of White Christian America | Robert P. Jones
Get it on The Sacred Slope Guest Reccos Bookshop: https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope
PRRI American Values Survey | PRRI & Brookings
Diana Butler Bass | @dianabutlerbass
Kristin Kobes Du Mez | @kkdumez
Jemar Tisby | @jemartisby

EXPLORE AFFIRMING CHRISTIANITY
Hear from guests around the world
TheSacredSlope.com | Episodes, guests & resources

#ChristianNationalism #Backslide #RobertPJones #Democracy #Deconstruction #christianity

Support the show

🎧 WATCH: YouTube / Spotify
LISTEN: Apple Podcasts + everywhere
FOLLOW: @thesacredslope (IG, FB, Threads, TikTok, YouTube, Bluesky)

67. Tracy E. Gilchrist | Holding Space in Hollywood: Queer Media, Advocacy & the Power of Human Connection

Tue, 20 Oct 2026 02:00:00 -0000

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67. Tracy E. Gilchrist | Holding Space in Hollywood: Queer Media, Advocacy & the Power of Human Connection

What does it take to make some of Hollywood's biggest stars feel truly seen?

For Tracy E. Gilchrist, it starts with a simple question, genuine curiosity, and the willingness to hold space for another human being.

The longtime LGBTQ+ entertainment journalist and former editor-in-chief of The Advocate became a viral sensation after her unforgettable "holding space" interview with Wicked stars Cynthia Erivo and Ariana Grande. But there's so much more to Tracy than one viral moment.

After decades of interviewing Hollywood's biggest names and amplifying LGBTQ+ voices, Tracy is bringing her distinctive warmth, empathy, and love of storytelling to Holding Space with Tracy E. Gilchrist.

In this episode of The Sacred Slope, Tracy joins Alexis Rice for a heartfelt conversation about Hollywood, queer representation, the importance of independent LGBTQ+ journalism, and what it means to create genuine human connection in a world that too often divides us.

Tracy shares her coming-out journey, reflects on the importance of The Advocate and the It Gets Better Project, and explores why visibility and authentic storytelling matter - especially when LGBTQ+ communities face growing hostility.

They also discuss Christianity, the impact of Christian Nationalism on queer lives, meaningful allyship, and where Tracy finds joy, courage, and hope.

Beyond the viral moments and celebrity interviews is a woman who has spent her career helping people feel seen, heard, and valued. This is her story.

In this episode

The viral Wicked interview and the meaning of "holding space"
Hollywood, celebrity interviews, and the art of human connection
Tracy's new show, Holding Space with Tracy E. Gilchrist
Her journey through LGBTQ+ entertainment journalism
The Advocate and the importance of queer media
The It Gets Better Project and uplifting LGBTQ+ youth
Tracy's personal coming-out story
Queer identity, Christianity, and Christian nationalism
Threats to LGBTQ+ representation in entertainment
Finding hope, joy, and community in challenging times

Explore more

The Sacred Slope: https://thesacredslope.com

Explore searchable conversations with pastors, scholars, artists, and cultural voices about faith, identity, belonging, and the world we're creating together.

Chapters

00:19 Introduction to Tracy E. Gilchrist
01:33 The Art of Holding Space
03:26 Getting to Know Tracy E. Gilchrist
09:53 The Impact of "Defying Gravity"
12:30 Tracy's Journey in Queer Media
19:53 It Gets Better: Uplifting Queer Youth
22:19 Holding Space as a Personal Ethos
23:43 Tracy's Coming-Out Story
26:09 The Advocate: A Lifeline for the Community
35:49 Why Queer Media Matters
39:41 Navigating Queer Identity and Christianity
39:52 Christian Nationalism and Its Impact on Queer Lives
41:55 What Meaningful Allyship Looks Like
43:56 Threats to Queer Representation in Media
46:12 Hope and Resilience in Queer Communities
47:04 The Role of Money in Church Dynamics
47:18 Finding Joy and Hope in Public Figures
52:26 Community Support and Personal Resilience
56:04 The Sacred Slope and Clergy Nominations

Media Credits: Photos courtesy of Tracy E. Gilchrist’s press kit. Additional video and images sourced from Tracy E. Gilchrist’s Instagram and original media publishers. All rights belong to their respective owners.

#LGBTQ #QueerMedia #deconstruction

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66. Meghan Tschanz (Exvangelical) | How Purity Culture Fuels **pe Culture & Silences Women

Fri, 16 Oct 2026 07:00:00 -0000

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66. Meghan Tschanz (Exvangelical) | How Purity Culture Fuels **pe Culture & Silences Women

What happens when Christianity teaches girls that their bodies are dangerous—and men's behavior is their responsibility?
What if purity culture doesn't protect women, but helps create the conditions for abuse?
And what happens when Christian women trust their own voices?

Meghan Tschanz, author of Women Rising and host of Faith and Feminism, joins Alexis Rice to explore purity culture, rape culture, patriarchy, sexual violence, consent, and Christian feminism.

Raised evangelical, Meghan learned that a good Christian girl should be modest, submissive, obedient, and responsible for men's desires.

Together, Alexis and Meghan examine how purity culture can normalize victim-blaming, protect male power, and teach women to distrust their intuition. They challenge biblical patriarchy, the manosphere, tradwife ideology, and the claim that male dominance defines Christianity.

They also discuss feminist theology, seminary, diverse Christian traditions, and replacing purity culture with consent culture.

What if questioning harmful teachings isn't abandoning Jesus—but following him more faithfully?

And what if girls never had to shrink themselves to please God?

The slippery slope doesn't have to lead to hell. Sometimes it leads to sacred ground.

WHO IS THIS EPISODE FOR?
Women healing from purity culture, sexual shame, or religious trauma; evangelicals and exvangelicals questioning patriarchy; survivors; and parents, pastors, and men seeking healthier conversations about consent, equality, and power.

✨ GUEST + FOLLOW
Meghan Tschanz | IG: @meghantschanz
Faith and Feminism | meghantschanz.com

📚 MENTIONED + RESOURCES
Women Rising | Meghan Tschanz
Jesus and John Wayne | Kristin Kobes Du Mez
John Fugelsang | Jesus and Women
Mattie Mae Motl | Feminist Theology
Amy Moses | Pelvic Floor Physical Therapy
Mark Driscoll | Biblical Patriarchy Discussion
Matthew 5 | Jesus on Lust and Responsibility
Sacred Slope Book Reccos: https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope

#PurityCulture #RapeCulture #ChristianFeminism #ReligiousTrauma #Exvangelical

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LISTEN: Apple Podcasts + everywhere
FOLLOW: @thesacredslope (IG, FB, Threads, TikTok, YouTube, Bluesky)

65. Rev. Darrell Hamilton II (Baptist) | Healing Religious Trauma: Tending to Open Wounds

Tue, 13 Oct 2026 21:00:00 -0000

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65. Rev. Darrell Hamilton II (Baptist) | Healing Religious Trauma: Tending to Open Wounds

What happens when the Christianity that was supposed to heal you is what wounded you?

What if questioning your faith isn't a slippery slope to hell, but the beginning of liberation?

And what if the image of God you inherited shapes how you see women, LGBTQ+ people, race, and power?

Rev. Darrell R. Hamilton II is an ordained Baptist minister, preacher, writer, and advocate for faith-rooted justice. A graduate of Wake Forest University School of Divinity, he has served at Middle Collegiate Church and worked with Repairers of the Breach and the Poor People's Campaign.

Rev. Darrell joins Alexis Rice for a powerful conversation about religious trauma, deconstruction, Black liberation theology, decolonizing Christianity, Christian nationalism, and what it really takes to heal from harmful Christianity.

Raised in Oklahoma, Rev. Darrell grew up believing that questioning certain Christian teachings could threaten his salvation.

Then he met a gay Christian whose church wouldn't allow him to sing in the choir.

How could a church silence someone's praise to God?

That question changed everything.

At Wake Forest University School of Divinity, Rev. Darrell discovered an enormous Christian theological world he had never been introduced to. Black liberation theology. Queer theology. Feminine images of God. Perspectives that challenged everything he had been taught about who God is and who belongs.

Together, Alexis and Rev. Darrell explore why so many Christians never encounter these perspectives, how white-centered theology became normalized, and what happens when Christians imagine God exclusively as a white man.

They discuss James Cone, the power of Black preaching and worship, and why liberation theology invites us to understand Christianity through the experiences of people who have been oppressed.

If the way we imagine God shapes how we treat one another, what happens when we change our understanding of God?

And then there's the question of healing.

Some people have scars from harmful Christianity. Others are still carrying open wounds. Not everyone is ready to reconstruct their faith, return to church, or even talk about God.

How can pastors, churches, and those who understand multiple Christian traditions help people heal without causing more harm?

Rev. Darrell also shares his hope for his daughter and the next generation: a Christianity rooted in love, justice, dignity, belonging, and the beloved community rather than fear and domination.

The slippery slope doesn't have to lead to hell.

Sometimes it leads to sacred ground.

WHO IS THIS EPISODE FOR?

Evangelicals in distress, exvangelicals, and anyone navigating religious trauma, deconstruction, or disillusionment.

Christians who still love Jesus but are questioning the theology, politics, and power structures they inherited.

LGBTQ+ Christians, women in ministry, and people who have been told they don't belong.

White Christians seeking to learn from Black liberation theology, decolonization, and Christian traditions beyond their own.

Cradle mainliners and progressive Christians who want to better understand the experiences of those leaving fundamentalist Christianity.

People of any faith or none seeking healing, justice, and hope.

Pastors, seminarians, scholars, bishops, and church leaders who want to create communities where people can question, heal, and belong.

✨ GUEST + FOLLOW

Rev. Darrell R. Hamilton II (Baptist) | IG: @blackandeducatedpreacher
Wake Forest University School of Divinity | IG: @wakedivinity
Middle Collegiate Church | IG: @middlechurch

📚 MENTIONED + RESOURCES

Rev. Dr. James H. Cone | Black Liberation Theology
A Black Theology of Liberation | James H. Cone
The Cross and the Lynching Tree | James H. Cone
Rev. Dr. Kelly Brown Douglas | Womanist Theology
Stand Your Ground: Black Bodies and the Justice of God | Kelly Brown Douglas
Gustavo Gutiérrez | Liberation Theology
Rev. Dr. Jacqui Lewis | IG: @revjacquilewis
Rev. Dr. Otis Moss III | Trinity United Church of Christ
Bishop William J. Barber II | Repairers of the Breach
Repairers of the Breach | breachrepairers.org
Poor People's Campaign | poorpeoplescampaign.org
Rev. Dr. Bill Leonard | Wake Forest University
John Mark Comer | IG: @johnmarkcomer
Practicing the Way | John Mark Comer
Diana Butler Bass | IG: @dianabutlerbass

Find these books and more on The Sacred Slope Book Reccos List: https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope

⛪ EXPLORE AFFIRMING CHRISTIANITY

⏱️ EPISODE CHAPTERS

#ReligiousTrauma #Deconstruction #LiberationTheology #BlackLiberationTheology #DecolonizingChristianity

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64. Healing After Evangelicalism & Finding a Beautiful Faith | Diana Butler Bass (Methodist → Evangelical → Episcopal)

Thu, 08 Oct 2026 19:00:00 -0000

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64. Healing After Evangelicalism & Finding a Beautiful Faith | Diana Butler Bass (Methodist → Evangelical → Episcopal)

What if the Christianity you were taught was never the only Christianity that existed?

What if leaving evangelicalism didn't mean leaving Jesus?

And what if the people best positioned to help heal Christianity are those who understand more than one Christian world?

Dr. Diana Butler Bass, historian, theologian, and bestselling author, joins Alexis Rice for a conversation about religious trauma, deconstruction, Christian nationalism, and finding beauty and belonging beyond evangelical fundamentalism.

Diana shares her journey from a Methodist childhood through evangelicalism and into the Episcopal Church. Together, they explore the theological diversity many Christians never knew existed and why mainline churches can offer an alternative to the faith systems people are leaving.

At the heart of this conversation is the urgent need for TRANSLATORS.

People who understand evangelical culture AND mainline Christianity. People who can explain evangelical beliefs, fears, and wounds to progressive Christians, pastors, and scholars, while helping those leaving high-control religion discover other ways of following Jesus.

WHO IS THIS EPISODE FOR?

For evangelicals in distress and exvangelicals seeking healing.

For cradle mainliners and progressive Christians who want to understand the evangelical world.

For people of any faith or none who are carrying religious wounds and longing for hope.

And especially for seminarians, scholars, pastors, bishops, and church leaders who want to welcome people shaped by religious trauma and learn from those who can translate between Christian traditions.

Diana reminds us:

"Mainline theology is not a Jenga Tower. Mainline theology is a mosaic."

We also explore her new book, A Beautiful Year: 52 Meditations on Faith, Wisdom, and Perseverance, the Christian calendar, and the beauty of quiet faith.

There are other ways to follow Jesus. There is still beauty to be found.

✨ GUEST + BOOKS

Diana Butler Bass | @dianabutlerbass
A Beautiful Year bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope
The Cottage | dianabutlerbass.substack.com

⛪ EXPLORE MAINLINE CHRISTIANITY

🎙️ PEOPLE + COMMUNITIES

⏱️ CHAPTERS

#DianaButlerBass #ABeautifulYear #Deconstruction #ReligiousTrauma #MainlineChristianity

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63. The Vote is Sacred: Faith, Christian Nationalism & the Fight for Democracy | Rev. Paul Brandeis Raushenbush

Tue, 06 Oct 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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63. The Vote is Sacred: Faith, Christian Nationalism & the Fight for Democracy | Rev. Paul Brandeis Raushenbush

What happens when a form of Christianity is used to decide who belongs in America?

Christian nationalism. Religious freedom. A democracy under extraordinary strain. And Christians, Jews, Muslims, Sikhs, Buddhists, Hindus, people of many faiths and people of no faith choosing to stand together.

What could interfaith solidarity teach us about protecting democracy?

Rev. Paul Brandeis Raushenbush is an ordained American Baptist minister, President and CEO of Interfaith Alliance, host of State of Belief, and former founding executive editor of HuffPost Religion.

And right now, he’s taking that work on the road with Vote Is Sacred, a nonpartisan, multi-faith campaign traveling across America ahead of the midterm elections.

Paul joins Alexis for an urgent but hopeful conversation about the state of American democracy, the rise of Christian nationalism, separation of church and state, and why no political movement gets to “own” Jesus or religion.

They explore what Jimmy Carter understood about faith and government, why some Christians feel politically homeless, what some politicians can learn about trying to engage with faith communities, and what Jesus actually taught about feeding the hungry, welcoming the stranger and loving our neighbors.

Rev. Paul also shares what decades of interfaith work have taught him about something increasingly difficult:

How do we deeply disagree with someone and still show up for them?

From Jewish-Muslim dialogue to solidarity across religious traditions, Rev. Paul makes the case that protecting our neighbors does not require agreeing with them.

Our futures are intertwined.

And for anyone wondering whether one vote really matters, Rev. Paul has a message:

“We are democracy.”

🗳️ THE VOTE IS SACRED

Go to VoteIsSacred.org to learn about the Vote Is Sacred bus tour, trainings and resources.

If you’re eligible to vote in the United States, make sure you’re registered to vote and know your state’s voting requirements at Vote.gov.

✨ GUEST + FOLLOW

Rev. Paul Brandeis Raushenbush @raushenbush
President & CEO, Interfaith Alliance
Ordained American Baptist minister
Host, State of Belief

Interfaith Alliance | IG: @interfaithalliance

📚 MENTIONED + RESOURCES

⏱️ EPISODE CHAPTERS

#InterfaithAlliance #VoteIsSacred #ChristianNationalism #ReligiousFreedom #Interfaith #Democracy #MidtermElections #TheSacredSlope

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62. Kathy Baldock (Evangelical) | The 1946 Bible Mistranslation Behind Anti-Gay Theology

Fri, 02 Oct 2026 05:00:00 -0000

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62. Kathy Baldock (Evangelical) | The 1946 Bible Mistranslation Behind Anti-Gay Theology

What if one of Christianity’s most consequential teachings about LGBTQ people was built on a translation mistake?

Plant sex. A bizarre U.S. Navy sting operation. Nazis burning decades of sexuality research. And a Bible translation decision in 1946 that would reverberate for generations.

What could those things possibly have in common?

Kathy Baldock is an evangelical Christian, author, researcher, LGBTQ advocate, founder of CanyonWalker Connections, and one of the researchers featured in the documentary 1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture.

Her new book, Forging a Sacred Weapon, traces 5,000 years of history to ask a deceptively simple question:

How did the word “homosexual” end up in the Bible?

Kathy takes us from ancient sexual ethics and the medieval Church to emerging sexuality research, the U.S. military, McCarthyism, Bible publishing and the archives at Yale—where researchers uncovered correspondence showing that the head of the Revised Standard Version translation team acknowledged a problem with the translation.

The RSV eventually changed it.

But by then, the language had spread.

We explore how American ideas about homosexuality traveled into Bible translations around the world, why Kathy believes both conservative and progressive Christians sometimes get the 1946 story wrong, and what pastors, parents and LGBTQ Christians need to understand now.

And Kathy has a message for queer people who have been told they must choose between their faith and who they are:

The door to God is open.

⚠️ CONTENT NOTE: This episode includes discussion of suicide, sex and sexuality. Not for littles.

Help is available Speak with someone today
988 Suicide and Crisis Lifeline
Languages: English, Spanish Hours: 24/7

✨ GUEST + FOLLOW

Kathy Baldock — IG: @kathyvbaldock
Founder, CanyonWalker Connections

📚 MENTIONED + RESOURCES

Forging a Sacred Weapon: The 1946 Bible Mistranslation Behind Anti-Gay Theology — Kathy Baldock - get it on The Sacred Slope Book Reccos List: https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope

Walking the Bridgeless Canyon — Kathy Baldock

1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture — IG: @1946themovie
Sharon “Rocky” Roggio — Director of 1946 — IG: @1946themovie
Timothy Schraeder Rodriguez IG: @timothysrodriguez book Conversion Therapy Dropout https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope

🎬 Watch 1946: 1946themovie.com
📚 Kathy + CanyonWalker: canyonwalkerconnections.com

⛪ THE SACRED SLOPE LABS

Three virtual labs, 2 options per lab, open to everyone, everywhere.

LAB 1: I Thought This Was Christianity
📅 October 22 & 23

LAB 2: Who Formed Us?
📅 November 5 & 6

LAB 3: Speaking Across the Faith Divide
📅 November 12 & 13

🎟️ Register: thesacredslope.com

⏱️ EPISODE CHAPTERS

00:00 — Can You Be Queer & Christian?
05:07 — Plant Sex, Nazis & a 1946 Bible
09:56 — Meet Kathy Baldock
17:37 — 5,000 Years of Sexuality & Christianity
26:17 — What Really Happened With the RSV?
37:16 — When the Translators Realized the Problem
45:21 — The Dutch & German Bibles
52:47 — Kathy’s Message to LGBTQ Christians
57:16 — Sex, Pleasure & the Medieval Church
59:03 — The Wild History of Masturbation
1:05:11 — The U.S. Navy Sex Sting
1:11:18 — Why Churches Struggle to Change
1:17:14 — Where Kathy Finds Hope

#KathyBaldock #1946TheMovie #LGBTQChristian #BibleTranslation #QueerChristian #Deconstruction

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61. Lisa Sharon Harper (Episcopal) | White Supremacy, Evangelicalism & Decolonizing Christianity

Tue, 29 Sep 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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61. Lisa Sharon Harper (Episcopal) | White Supremacy, Evangelicalism & Decolonizing Christianity

What if the Christianity many Americans are deconstructing isn’t Christianity itself-but a version shaped by whiteness, empire, and power?

Lisa Sharon Harper is a public theologian, author, activist, playwright, founder and president of FreedomRoad, and is currently discerning ordination in the Episcopal Church.

Lisa traces the complicated history of American evangelicalism—from the Black church and abolitionist movements to fundamentalism, the Southern Baptist Convention, segregation, and the modern political power of white evangelicalism.

Then she challenges one of the central ideas of modern faith deconstruction:

Christianity was never a white faith.

Jesus and the earliest Christians emerged from colonized people in the ancient Near East. Lisa argues that abandoning Christianity because of white Christian racism can leave the supremacy of Western Christianity itself uninterrogated.

She doesn’t call us to deconstruct Christianity.

She calls us to decolonize it.

We explore Acts 2, implicit bias, the Black church, fundamentalism, Christian nationalism, religious certainty-and what happens when we rediscover Jesus outside the version of Christianity we inherited.

Lisa leaves us with three words:

“Seek brown Jesus.”

✨ GUEST + FOLLOW

Lisa Sharon Harper (Episcopal) IG: @lisasharper
Founder & President, FreedomRoad @freedomroad.us

📚 MENTIONED + RESOURCES

Christena Cleveland (PhD) — IG: @christenacleveland
Rev. Dr. David P. Gushee — IG: @d_pgushee
Rev. Dr. Kelly Brown Douglas — IG: @revdrkbd

Sojourners — Independent Christian magazine exploring faith, culture, politics & social justice.

📖 Lisa’s 2015 essay that opens this episode:
“Four Easy Ways to Be a White Supremacist”
https://sojo.net/magazine/septemberoctober-2015/four-easy-ways-be-white-supremacist

📰 Explore Sojourners: @sojogram
https://sojo.net

⛪ THE SACRED SLOPE LABS

Three virtual labs, 2 options per lab, open to everyone, everywhere. Attend one, two, or all three.

LAB 1: I Thought This Was Christianity
📅 October 22 & 23

LAB 2: Who Formed Us?
📅 November 5 & 6

LAB 3: Speaking Across the Faith Divide
📅 November 12 & 13

🎟️ Register: thesacredslope.com

🥚 Listen all the way through for an Easter egg revealing our first guest speaker for Lab 1.

⏱️ EPISODE CHAPTERS

02:42 — White Supremacy: Explicit vs. Implicit Bias
09:56 — Meet Lisa Sharon Harper
12:23 — PhD in Womanist Ethics
18:56 — Evangelical ≠ Republican or Democrat
21:48 — What Does “Evangelical” Mean?
28:00 — The Black Church & Second Great Awakening
32:43 — Slaveholder Faith & American Christianity
36:38 — What’s Behind “Non-Denominational”?
41:36 — Should We Save Evangelicalism?
44:00 — Fundamentalism & Certainty
45:23 — What Happens After Deconstruction?
47:06 — Christianity Was Never a White Faith
52:51 — Decolonizing Acts 2
55:47 — “I’m Not for Deconstructing. I’m for Decolonizing.”
57:13 — “Seek Brown Jesus”
57:20 — Sacred Slope Labs + Easter Egg

#LisaSharonHarper #DecolonizingChristianity #Deconstruction #Evangelicalism #ChristianNationalism

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60. Raised Pentecostal vs. United Methodist | Deconstruction, Doubt & Finding God Again with Colten Barnaby & Rev. Dr. S.C. Williams

Sat, 26 Sep 2026 00:00:00 -0000

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60. Raised Pentecostal vs. United Methodist | Deconstruction, Doubt & Finding God Again with Colten Barnaby & Rev. Dr. S.C. Williams

What happens when two Christians grow up in almost completely different versions of Christianity?

Colten Barnaby grew up in a strict Oneness Holiness Pentecostal world, speaking in tongues at five years old and believing other Christians still needed to be saved.

Rev. Dr. S.C. Williams grew up United Methodist, where he was encouraged to question, evolution wasn’t controversial, hell was rarely discussed, and faith was rooted more in grace than fear.

Same Christianity?

That question opens a fascinating conversation about Pentecostalism, United Methodism, deconstruction, religious trauma, progressive Christianity, evolution, scripture, doubt, Christian nationalism—and whether questioning your faith can actually bring you closer to God.

Colten shares how studying theology and church history at Oral Roberts University complicated the certainty he grew up with. Instead of atheist professors destroying his faith, he encountered serious Christians who accepted evolution, disagreed theologically, and still respected one another.

Today, Colten sometimes describes himself with a sentence that would have terrified his younger self:

“I’m a Christian who doesn’t believe in God.”

What does that even mean?

Together, Colten and S.C. explore what remains when certainty disappears—and why seeking truth may matter more than protecting the theological system you inherited.

They also discuss religious trauma, LGBTQ+ inclusion, harmful theology, the Wesleyan Quadrilateral, Christian nationalism, debating Doug Wilson, progressive Christianity, and one of the hardest questions for people rebuilding faith:

How do you know who to trust again?

And for anyone afraid deconstruction will lead them away from God:

Maybe God is on the other side of your questions too.

✨ GUESTS + FOLLOW

Colten Barnaby — Christian thinker and creator exploring theology, politics, philosophy, and faith after certainty.

Rev. Dr. S.C. Williams — United Methodist pastor and creator exploring scripture, theology, church history, and harmful Christian teachings.

📚 MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE

Brian Recker — IG: @berecker
Tim Whitaker / The New Evangelicals — IG: @thenewevangelicals @timwhitakerspeaks
Tripp Fuller — IG: @trippfuller
Homebrewed Christianity — IG: @theologynerd
Theology Beer Camp — IG: @theologybeercamp
April Ajoy — IG: @aprilajoy

🍺 THEOLOGY BEER CAMP

Alexis, Colten, Tripp Fuller, and other Sacred Slope friends are headed to Theology Beer Camp in Kansas City, Missouri, October 8–10, 2026—a gathering for people willing to ask big questions about God, Christianity, theology, culture, and the world without pretending they already have all the answers.

In-person tickets are sold out, but virtual tickets are still available at theologybeer.camp.

⏱️ EPISODE CHAPTERS

07:29 — Meet Colten Barnaby & Rev. Dr. S.C. Williams
08:24 — Growing Up Oneness Pentecostal
11:45 — When Education Complicates Your Faith
14:20 — Pentecostal vs. United Methodist Christianity
17:15 — Religious Trauma & What the Church Owes People
19:02 — “I’m a Christian Who Doesn’t Believe in God”
23:48 — What Is God?
25:20 — Progressive Christianity & Questions
29:30 — Debating Doug Wilson
33:54 — Why S.C. Williams Does Theology Online
35:34 — Recognizing Harmful Theology
36:42 — Apostasy, Fear & Religious Trauma
43:00 — LGBTQ+ Inclusion & Reading the Bible Differently
44:35 — Reinterpreting Scripture
47:07 — Why Church Tradition Matters
51:34 — Doubt, Truth & Seeking God
01:02:40 — What Deconstruction Actually Looks Like
01:03:24 — Historical Context Changes Theology
01:06:04 — The Wesleyan Quadrilateral
01:09:49 — Reading Scripture Through Jesus
01:16:26 — Who Can You Trust After Religious Trauma?
01:21:40 — Can Doubt Bring You Closer to God?

#Deconstruction #ProgressiveChristianity #Pentecostal #UnitedMethodist #ReligiousTrauma #FaithAndDoubt #Exvangelical #Christianity #TheSacredSlope

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59. Theology Beer Camp Preview (Ilia Delio, Tripp Fuller, Sarah Heath & Josh Patterson) | We Shocked a Theologian With What We Were Taught About Christianity

Thu, 24 Sep 2026 07:00:00 -0000

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59. Theology Beer Camp Preview (Ilia Delio, Tripp Fuller, Sarah Heath & Josh Patterson) | We Shocked a Theologian With What We Were Taught About Christianity

What happens when you tell a theologian what millions of American evangelicals were taught they had to believe in order to be Christian?

Ilia Delio was shocked. She's not the only one. I have done this exercise with several pastors, theologians, scholars around the world outside of conservative fundamentalism and they are almost all shocked. And those in fundamentalism are shocked at the responses outside of conservative evangelicalism. So what's going on here?

In this special Theology Beer Camp preview, Ilia Delio, Tripp Fuller, Sarah Heath, and Josh Patterson join Alexis Rice for a conversation about evangelical fundamentalism, deconstruction, Christian nationalism, science, evolution, curiosity, AI, and what happens when faith becomes bigger than the beliefs we inherited.

The conversation begins with a simple experiment:

Put your finger down if you were taught…

That the snake in Genesis was a literal talking snake.

That you needed to pray the sinner’s prayer to escape eternal conscious torment in hell.

That the rapture could happen at any moment.

That you cannot be gay and Christian.

That women cannot be pastors.

That evolution contradicts the Bible.

That questioning any of this meant questioning God.

Alexis and Josh put every finger down.

Ilia, Tripp, and Sarah largely don’t.

Ilia’s reaction?

“My God… I can’t believe you guys really followed that stuff.”

And then comes the question underneath this entire episode:

“Is this stuff still going on?”

Yes.

And that disconnect matters.

Together, they explore how Christians from different traditions can inherit radically different understandings of the same faith—and why people leaving conservative evangelicalism may have no idea that other faithful expressions of Christianity have been here all along.

Tripp reflects on how 9/11, Islamophobia, war, and militaristic nationalism changed his relationship with the Christian world around him.

Sarah shares what happened when she moved from a questioning Christian home in Canada into conservative evangelical culture in the American South—and why curiosity may be one of the most important things Christians can offer one another.

Josh talks about letting go of theological finality and embracing the idea that being human means always becoming.

And Ilia explores evolution, science, inner freedom, AI, and a God she understands not as a power over us, but as a presence and embrace within us.

By the end, everyone has all ten fingers back up.

They still don’t believe exactly the same things.

They don’t need to.

Because maybe changing your theology doesn’t mean losing your faith.

Maybe asking questions isn’t something Christianity needs to fear.

And maybe people who thought they had to choose between the Christianity they inherited and no Christianity at all need to hear something much simpler:

Christianity is bigger than what you were taught.

✨ GUESTS + FOLLOW

Ilia Delio
Franciscan sister, theologian, scientist, and founder of the Center for Christogenesis
IG: @centerforchristogenesis

Tripp Fuller
Theologian, author, host of Homebrewed Christianity, and founder of Theology Beer Camp
IG: @trippfuller
Homebrewed Christianity: @theologynerd
Theology Beer Camp: @theologybeercamp

Sarah Heath
United Methodist pastor, author, speaker, creator, and professional asker of good questions
IG: @revsarahheath

Josh Patterson
Theologian, podcaster, and host of (Re)thinking Faith
Podcast IG: @rethinking_faith

🍺 THEOLOGY BEER CAMP

Alexis, Ilia, Tripp, Sarah, and Josh are headed to Theology Beer Camp in Kansas City, Missouri, October 8–10, 2026—a gathering for people willing to ask big questions about God, Christianity, culture, science, and the world without pretending they already have all the answers.

In-person tickets are sold out, but virtual tickets are still available at theologybeer.camp.

📚 MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE

Andrew Whitehead — @andrewwhitehead
Sociologist and author whose work examines Christian nationalism in the United States.

⏱️ EPISODE CHAPTERS

06:05 — The Experiment: Were We Even Taught the Same Christianity?
09:58 — Ilia’s Reaction: “You Really Followed That Stuff?”
11:50 — Growing Up Christian in Very Different Worlds
14:33 — When Evangelicalism Becomes the Only Christianity You Know
15:20 — Can Christians Believe Differently and Still Belong?
17:55 — Is God Bigger Than Our Beliefs?
19:59 — Evolution, Genesis & Faith
22:28 — What Happens to Faith After Deconstruction?
24:38 — Curiosity, Freedom & Making Room for Each Other
27:27 — AI, Christianity & What It Means to Be Human
30:02 — Can Science and Religion Learn to Talk to Each Other?
31:21 — After Deconstruction: What Do We Believe Now?

#TheologyBeerCamp #IliaDelio #TrippFuller #SarahHeath #JoshPatterson #Deconstruction #ProgressiveChristianity #FaithAndDoubt #ChristianNationalism #ScienceAndReligion #TheSacredSlope

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58. Interfaith Comedy (Yasmin Elhady, Carmiya Weinraub & PT Bratton) | A Muslim, a Jew, and Two Christians Walk Into a Podcast

Tue, 22 Sep 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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58. Interfaith Comedy (Yasmin Elhady, Carmiya Weinraub & PT Bratton) | A Muslim, a Jew, and Two Christians Walk Into a Podcast

Comedians Yasmin Elhady, Carmiya Weinraub, and P. T. Bratton join Alexis Rice for an interfaith conversation about faith, comedy, stereotypes, friendship, and the questions people are often too nervous to ask out loud.

Together, they are part of Interfaith Comedy, a nationally touring project that brings performers of different faith traditions together to laugh, challenge assumptions, and build real human connection.

Carmiya, an observant Jewish comedian and founder of Interfaith Comedy, shares why she wanted Muslim performers in Jewish spaces - and herself in spaces beyond the Jewish community. Yasmin, an Egyptian American Muslim comedian and attorney, reflects on being welcomed to the United States as an asylum seeker by Catholic charities and on why faith, humility, pain, and comedy belong together. P. T., a Christian comedian, former pastor, and military veteran, brings humor and insight about Christian culture, church guilt, and the many ways people interpret the same sacred text.

This conversation is not about convincing everyone to believe the same thing.

It is about what happens when we stop talking about one another and start talking with one another.

People become much harder to fear - and harder to hate - up close.

✨ Guests + Upcoming Shows

Yasmin Elhady @yasminelhahahady
Egyptian American comedian, attorney, speaker, and storyteller
Known for Hulu’s Muslim Matchmaker and NBC’s True Story with Ed Helms and Randall Park
Performed at the Kennedy Center
Upcoming: Not Exactly a Nun at Woolly Mammoth Theatre Company in Washington, D.C., beginning September 25
Website + tickets | Woolly Mammoth Theatre Company

Carmiya Weinraub @carmiya.w
Observant Jewish comedian, producer, mother of five, and founder of Interfaith Comedy @interfaith.comedy. Creator of a nationally touring comedy project connecting audiences across faith traditions
Interfaith Comedy

PT Bratton @ptbrattoncomedy
Comedian, storyteller, military veteran, and former pastor
Has performed nationally, from comedy clubs to the Kennedy Center and the White House
Website + upcoming shows

#InterfaithComedy #YasminElhady #CarmiyaWeinraub #PTBratton #Interfaith #FaithAndComedy #TheSacredSlope

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57. Dr. Matthew Boedy (Baptist) | The Seven Mountains Mandate: Exposing the Dangerous Plan to Christianize America and Destroy Democracy

Fri, 18 Sep 2026 03:00:00 -0000

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57. Matthew Boedy (Baptist) | The Seven Mountains Mandate: Exposing the Dangerous Plan to Christianize America and Destroy Democracy

What if something many Christians dismiss as fringe is actually an organized framework for changing American culture?

Religion. Family. Education. Government and military. Media. Arts and entertainment. Business.

These are the Seven Mountains.

Dr. Matthew Boedy, Baptist, professor, scholar of religious rhetoric and Christian nationalism, and author of The Seven Mountains Mandate, joins Alexis Rice to explain the history of the Seven Mountains Mandate and why he believes this movement matters far beyond conservative evangelicalism.

Alexis grew up in evangelical Christianity. She knew about Christian schools, Christian media, Christian politics, Campus Crusade, apologetics and the culture wars. But she had never heard anyone explain that there were seven specific areas of culture Christians were supposed to influence or “take.”

Matthew traces the framework back to Bill Bright of Campus Crusade for Christ and Lauren Cunningham of Youth With A Mission, and explains the later influence of Lance Wallnau.

They talk about Turning Point USA, Project 2025, public schools, the Ten Commandments, spiritual warfare, pastors and politics, “marketplace apostles,” conspiracy thinking, social media, Christian media, and the difference between sharing your faith and seeking political or cultural power.

But this conversation is also about Christianity itself.

Matthew is Christian. Alexis is Christian. And the Christianity being discussed here is not all Christianity.

What happens when one expression of Christianity becomes so visible that people begin confusing it with Christianity itself?

And what responsibility do pastors, scholars, professors and other Christians have to make the larger Christian tradition visible?

CHAPTERS

02:56 Introduction
04:12 What Is the Seven Mountains Mandate?
08:37 Understanding Christian Nationalism
17:39 How Large Is This Movement?
23:10 The Global Movement
27:10 Spiritual Warfare & Strategy
30:06 Which Christianity?
32:36 Media & Counterpoints
35:18 Mountain 1: Education
41:41 Ten Commandments in Schools
44:54 The California Narrative
47:21 Mountain 2: Government
49:58 Mountain 3: Religion
53:36 Mountain 4: Family
01:01:51 Mountain 5: Business
01:05:15 Mountain 6: Media
01:09:40 Mountain 7: Arts & Entertainment
01:13:11 Hope & What Comes Next

✨ Guest + Book

Matthew Boedy
The Seven Mountains Mandate: Exposing the Dangerous Plan to Christianize America and Destroy Democracy https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope
Professor, University of North Georgia
Westminster John Knox Press
Thanks to @aprilajoy, author of Star-Spangled Jesus , who makes a cameo in this episode, for alerting me through your book of the Seven Mountains Mandate

#MatthewBoedy #SevenMountainsMandate #ChristianNationalism #Christianity

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56. Kristin Kobes Du Mez (Christian) | Live Laugh Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made

Tue, 15 Sep 2026 03:00:00 -0000

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56. Kristin Kobes Du Mez (Christian) | Live Laugh Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made

What if the Christianity you were taught was never the only way to be Christian?

For millions of women raised in American evangelicalism, the rules felt inseparable from the faith itself.

Be pure. Submit. Don’t question authority. Stay inside the lines. Follow the right leaders. Read the right books. Believe the right things. Shop at the right stores. And if you do it all faithfully enough, you’ll be safe, happy, and blessed.

But who made those rules? Where did they come from? And what happens when you discover that some of what you were taught as timeless biblical truth has a history?

Kristin Kobes Du Mez, historian, scholar, and New York Times bestselling author of Jesus and John Wayne, joins Alexis Rice to uncover that history in her new book, Live Laugh Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made.

For women formed by evangelical Christianity, this one may feel deeply personal.

Purity culture. Biblical womanhood. Submission. Christian bookstores. Megachurches. Beth Moore Bible studies. Political power. Christian nationalism. And the promise underneath so much of it: follow the rules and you will be safe, prosperous, and happy.

But Kristin’s history reveals something many women were never taught. Christian women have also challenged patriarchy, fought for women’s rights, preached, led, questioned authority, and imagined faithful Christianity differently.

Together they explore:

• How evangelicalism became a self-contained cultural ecosystem
• The surprising history of Christian feminism
• Purity culture, shame & the “sexual prosperity gospel”
• Christian consumer culture, belonging & control
• Why questioning the system felt like questioning Christianity
• Beth Moore, abuse, Trump & the cost of speaking out
• Gender, politics, power & Christian nationalism
• Rachel Held Evans, Sarah Bessey & women imagining another way
• Why seeing the system clearly is the first step toward changing it

Kristin is careful to distinguish this history from all Christianity or even all evangelicalism. There have always been dissenters.

“There were always people inside the system who began to see the system for what it was.”

What becomes possible when you realize the Christianity you inherited is not the only Christianity available to you?

✨ Guest + Books

• Kristin Kobes Du Mez, @kkdumez
• Live Laugh Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made
• Jesus and John Wayne
• A New Gospel for Women
• Publisher: Liveright Publishing, an imprint of W. W. Norton & Company

📚 People, Books & Resources Mentioned

• Beth Moore, @bethmoorelpm
• Rachel Held Evans (1981–2019) @rachelheldevans, Evolving in Monkey Town; A Year of Biblical Womanhood
• Sarah Bessey, @sarahbessey, Jesus Feminist
• Jen Hatmaker, @jenhatmaker
• Amy Grant, @amygrantofficial
• LifeWay Christian Resources, @lifeway

05:05 Introduction to the Sacred Slope
06:54 Expanding the Christian Faith
08:44 Understanding Christian Nationalism
09:11 The Movement of Women in Christianity
10:00 Introduction to Kristen Kobes Du Mez and Her Work
11:52 The Impact of 'Jesus and John Wayne' and Cultural Phenomenon
14:53 Exploring White Evangelical Womanhood and Purity Culture
17:46 The Complexity of Evangelicalism and Dissenting Voices
20:35 Historical Context of Christian Women's Involvement in Feminism
23:33 The Closed System of Evangelical Culture
25:59 Personal Reflections on Faith and Regret
28:25 Understanding Power Dynamics in Evangelicalism
31:26 The Role of Women in Shaping Evangelical History
33:51 Concluding Thoughts on the Future of Christianity
41:03 The Totalizing System of Evangelicalism
44:49 Purity Culture and Its Impact
53:13 Beth Moore: A Voice of Change
01:04:01 Hope and Courage in the Face of Adversity
01:15:17 Introduction to The Sacred Slope
01:15:17 Nomination Process for Clergy Members

#KristinKobesDuMez #LiveLaughLove #Christianity #Evangelicalism #Deconstruction #ChristianNationalism #PurityCulture #WomenInChurch

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55. Birdy Mae (Southern Baptist) - When Evangelical Christianity Stops Feeling Like Home

Fri, 11 Sep 2026 05:00:00 -0000

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55. Birdy Mae (Southern Baptist) — When Evangelical Christianity Stops Feeling Like Home

Birdy Mae knew how to be a good Southern Baptist woman.

Know the Bible. Serve constantly. Believe the right things. Raise your kids the right way. And be certain.

“I was desperate to be like her. Because I thought she knew Jesus.”

Eventually, Birdy became her.

Then the certainty started cracking.

Women. LGBTQ+ Christians. Church abuse. Race. Political power. Christian nationalism. And finally, January 6.

For women raised inside conservative evangelical Christianity who still love Jesus but increasingly wonder, How did the faith that formed me become something I barely recognize?—this conversation will feel familiar.

Birdy joins Alexis Rice for a funny, vulnerable conversation about what happens when changing your mind costs you relationships, certainty, and belonging—but not Jesus.

Together they explore:

• Becoming the “good Christian woman” she thought she had to be
• Hell houses, purity culture & fear-based Christianity
• Beth Moore, women preaching & cracks in Southern Baptist certainty
• Church abuse scandals & institutional power
• Realizing she had been wrong about LGBTQ+ Christians
• Travel & discovering Christianity beyond an American lens
• January 6 and Birdy’s breaking point
• Christian nationalism & political identity
• Women, gender roles & what younger women are inheriting
• Losing relationships after publicly changing her mind
• Why questioning your faith doesn’t have to mean losing Jesus
• Why Birdy still attends a Southern Baptist church

Birdy calls her journey “untangling”—pulling the threads of Jesus away from the rules of religion.

Can you grieve what your Christian world has become without giving up the Jesus you found there?

“You have the right to question everything.”

✨ Guest

• Birdy Mae (Mary) — Southern Baptist storyteller & creator — @birdymaesays
• Substack: The Back Row

📚 Books, People & Resources Mentioned

• Kristin Kobes Du Mez — @kkdumez — Live Laugh Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made; Jesus and John Wayne
• Pete Enns — @peteenns — The Sin of Certainty; The Bible Tells Me So
• Beth Allison Barr — @bethallisonbarr — The Making of Biblical Womanhood
• Rachel Held Evans — @rachelheldevans — A Year of Biblical Womanhood
• Sarah Bessey — @sarahbessey — Field Notes for the Wilderness / Braving the Wilderness of Faith
• Beth Moore — @bethmoorelpm
• Andrew Whitehead — @ndrewwhitehead — American Idolatry
• April Ajoy — @aprilajoy — Star-Spangled Jesus
• Cody Deese — @codydeese My Internal Universe
• Kathy Baldock — @forgingasacredweapon1946 Forging a Sacred Weapon
• 1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture — @1946themovie
• Oprah Winfrey — @oprah

📺 Movies, TV & Culture Mentioned

• The Handmaid’s Tale — @handmaidsonhulu
• The Righteous Gemstones — @HBO @therighteousgemstones
• Mrs. America — FX @
mrsamericafx

#Christianity #Deconstruction #Evangelicalism #SouthernBaptist #ChristianNationalism #ChurchHurt #WomenInChurch #LGBTQChristians #Faith

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54. Father Dan Storrs (Old Roman Catholic) When Following Jesus Makes You the 'Wrong Kind of Christian'

Wed, 09 Sep 2026 00:00:00 -0000

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54. Father Dan Storrs (Old Roman Catholic) When Following Jesus Makes You the 'Wrong Kind of Christian'

What happens when a gay Catholic priest keeps following Jesus - even after Christians tell him he doesn’t belong?

Father Dan Storrs is an Old Roman Catholic priest whose journey has taken him through the Assemblies of God, the Baptist church, Eastern Orthodoxy, and eventually the Society of Mercy.

And after all of that?

“My journey has made me certain that certainty is the opposite of faith.”

Father Dan joins Alexis Rice for a conversation about what happens when following Jesus means refusing the boundaries religious institutions have drawn around who belongs.

Together they explore:

• Why becoming more rooted in ancient Christianity made Father Dan more committed to mercy and inclusion - not less
• Being gay, married, and called to the priesthood
• What Protestants often misunderstand about Catholicism
• Old Roman Catholicism and how it differs from Roman Catholicism
• Why Father Dan believes the sacraments are for everyone
• Mary, the Eucharist, and finding Jesus again after church hurt
• Creating spiritual community for LGBTQ+ people wounded by churches
• Why progressive Christian voices need to be more visible
• His work with Endless Mountains Pride and Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro’s LGBTQ+ Advisory Commission
• Why clergy must stand beside survivors of sexual violence and abuse
• What following Jesus this way has cost him

This isn’t a conversation about deciding whether Catholics or Protestants have Christianity right.

It’s an invitation to ask: What beauty might we have missed because we were taught to be suspicious of someone else’s way of following Jesus?

As Father Dan says, “If Jesus could make space for Judas, then we can make space for each other.”

✨ Guest

• Father Dan Storrs - Old Roman Catholic priest, Society of Mercy; Pastor, Holy Name of Mary Catholic Chapel; President, Endless Mountains Pride
• Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, YouTube: @FatherDanStorrs

⛪ Church & Organizations

• Holy Name of Mary Catholic Chapel - Facebook & YouTube: @holynamemary
• Society of Mercy
• Endless Mountains Pride
• Pennsylvania Governor’s Advisory Commission on LGBTQ Affairs - @GovernorShapiro
• Abuse & Rape Crisis Center of Bradford County

⚠️ Content Note

This episode includes discussion of sexual assault, abuse, church trauma, and survivor advocacy.

If you or someone you know has experienced sexual assault or abuse, RAINN’s National Sexual Assault Hotline provides free, confidential support 24/7:

• Call 800-656-HOPE (4673)
• Text HOPE to 64673
• RAINN National Sexual Assault Hotline

⏱️ Chapters

00:00 Ministry for people the Church left behind
07:06 Meet Father Dan Storrs
15:28 “Certainty is the opposite of faith”
20:10 Following Jesus into unexpected places
26:33 Gay, Catholic & making room for everyone
30:02 Finding home in Catholicism
35:56 What is Old Roman Catholicism?
42:49 Communion, Utrecht & Alexis’s Catholic surprise
47:20 Why inclusive priests need to be online
53:42 Mary, church hurt & finding Jesus again
57:40 LGBTQ+ advocacy & Governor Shapiro’s commission
1:06:02 Standing with survivors of sexual violence
1:12:04 “Following Jesus has cost me everything”
1:15:44 A prayer for people wounded by the Church
1:22:07 Antiquing, running & Father Dan beyond ministry

#Christianity #Catholic #OldRomanCatholic #LGBTQChristians #GayChristian #ProgressiveChristianity #ChurchHurt #Deconstruction #Exvangelical #Faith

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53. Dr. Samantha Bise (Lutheran, ELCA) Tongue in Church, a Liberating Primer on Christian Vocabulary

Thu, 03 Sep 2026 13:00:00 -0000

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53. Dr. Samantha Bise (Lutheran, ELCA) Tongue in Church, a Liberating Primer on Christian Vocabulary

What if the Christian words you have heard your entire life do not mean exactly what you were taught?

Dr. Samantha Bise joins Alexis Rice to unpack the history, translation, culture, and power hiding inside familiar words like virgin, salvation, gospel, Savior, and born again.

An author, educator, researcher, and adult convert to Christianity, Samantha studies how language shapes belief. Her new book, Tongue in Church: A Liberating Primer on Christian Vocabulary, asks Christians to slow down and learn what our own words have meant across thousands of years, cultures, empires, and translations.

Together they explore:

• How “young woman” became “virgin” in the story of Mary
• Why questioning Mary’s virginity does not have to unravel your faith
• How salvation became primarily about escaping hell, even though its biblical roots include healing, liberation, safety, and freedom from oppression
• Why Lord, Savior, Son of God, and gospel were politically charged words in the Roman Empire
• How “born again” became an identity marker in American evangelicalism
• What mission trips can teach us about Christianity, colonization, and conversion
• Why churches that control women often disregard the earth too
• The difference between faith that manipulates through fear and faith that makes room for mystery
• Why “the Bible is clear” is rarely as clear as people claim

Samantha also shares her unexpected path from outspoken atheist to ELCA Lutheran, the church that fed Appalachian Trail hikers without trying to convert them, and the painful altar call at her grandmother’s funeral that inspired this book.

This is not a conversation about tearing down scripture. It is an invitation to take scripture and its language seriously, loosen our grip on false certainty, and discover a faith spacious enough for questions.

As Samantha says, “There’s not one pure Christianity.” From the beginning, Christians have debated, negotiated, wrestled, and wondered. That wrestling is part of the tradition.

✨ Guest

• Dr. Samantha Bise: Author, educator, researcher, professor, co-host of Church Chatter, and ELCA Lutheran | IG: @dr.bise

📚 Book & Resources Mentioned

• Tongue in Church: A Liberating Primer on Christian Vocabulary by Dr. Samantha Bise | @thepilgrimpress
https://thepilgrimpress.com/products/tongue-in-church-a-liberating-primer-on-christian-vocabulary

• Evangelical Lutheran Church in America @elca
• The Sin of Certainty by Pete Enns @peteenns
• Don’t Sleep, There Are Snakes by Daniel Everett
• Marcus Borg on salvation

#TongueInChurch #Christianity #Deconstruction #Exvangelical #ProgressiveChristianity #Bible #ELCA #Faith

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52. A Different Side of Miss Peppermint: Growing Up in Church, Activism & Christian Nationalism’s Impact on the Trans Community

Tue, 01 Sep 2026 03:00:00 -0000

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52. A Different Side of Miss Peppermint: Growing Up in Church, Activism & Christian Nationalism’s Impact on the Trans Community

What changes when we simply listen? In this moment in history, listening and empathy are essential.

Miss Peppermint joins Alexis Rice for a joyful, vulnerable conversation about faith, storytelling, tea, Christian nationalism, and what the trans community needs from allies now.

Raised in Presbyterian and Southern Baptist churches, Miss Peppermint remembers the music and community, as well as anti-LGBTQ teachings from the pulpit. Though she is no longer a practicing Christian, she explains why she chose this conversation.

Together they explore:

• How anti-LGBTQ theology affects queer and trans people
• How Christian nationalism weaponizes faith, fear, power, and violence
• What it means for a church to be truly open and affirming
• Why rainbow branding and shared identity are not enough
• Housing, healthcare, food, safety, employment, and workplace protections
• Why churches, labor movements, and LGBTQ+ communities should organize together
• Drag Race, Broadway, Survival of the Thickest, Love Is Blind, scary movies, sports, and mint chocolate chip ice cream

She also shares the story behind Transcendence, the color-changing tea she created with @moody.teas. A portion of every purchase supports @transequalitynow and its work for trans rights and essential resources.

Transcendence: https://shop.moodyteas.co/shop/transcendence-color-changing-joy-blend-with-miss-peppermint-3415

This conversation does not ask Miss Peppermint to defend her humanity. It makes room for Christians to hear how our faith has affected her and decide what love of neighbor requires from us now.

✨ Guest

• Miss Peppermint: Actress, singer, Broadway performer, activist, @glaad and @aclu_nationwide board member, and @nycpride Grand Marshal | IG: @peppermint247

📚 People, Projects & Resources Mentioned

• Moody Teas @moody.teas | Advocates for Trans Equality @transequalitynow
• John Fugelsang, Separation of Church and Hate @johnfugelsang
• Andrew Whitehead, American Idolatry @andrewwhitehead
• The Necessary Conversation @thenecessaryconversationpod
• Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde @mariannbudde | James Talarico @jamestalarico
• Rev. Brandan Robertson, Queer & Christian @brandanrobertson
• Timothy Schraeder Rodriguez, Conversion Therapy Dropout @timothy.s.rodriguez
• Kathy V. Baldock, Forging a Sacred Weapon @kathyvbaldock
• Rocky Roggio, 1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture @1946themovie
• Rev. Jim Keat @revjimruns | Riverside Church @riversidenyc
• Michelle Buteau @michellebuteau | Netflix @netflix Survival of the Thickest
• Lance Bass @lancebass | Joey Fatone @realjoeyfatone | Cocktail Wars @cocktailwarstv
• Zohran Mamdani @zohrankmamdani | AOC @aoc | Kristin Chenoweth @kchenoweth | Don Lemon @donlemonofficial
• RuPaul’s Drag Race @rupaulsdragrace

Footage courtesy of Netflix and E!

#MissPeppermint #TransRights #ChristianNationalism #Christianity #Deconstruction #ProgressiveChristianity #LGBTQ

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51. Same Faith. Different Beliefs. Still Christian. (Part 2) – Rev. Gerlyn Henry (Anglican, Canada), Pastor Paul Drees (ELCA Lutheran, USA) & Pastor Joe Smith (Post-Evangelical, USA)

Thu, 27 Aug 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 51. Same Faith. Different Beliefs. Still Christian. (Part 2) – Rev. Gerlyn Henry (Anglican, Canada), Pastor Paul Drees (ELCA Lutheran, USA) & Pastor Joe Smith (Post-Evangelical, USA)

What were you taught you had to believe in order to be a Christian?

And what happened when you started asking questions?

In Part 2 of this conversation, Alexis Rice returns with Rev. Gerlyn Henry, Pastor Paul Drees, and Pastor Joe Smith to finish the viral “Put Your Finger Down: Christian Edition” experiment that revealed just how differently Christians can be formed—even while following the same Jesus.

This time, the questions move into some of the places where faith, politics, identity, and fear collide.

Together they explore:

• Abortion, reproductive rights & whether there is one “Christian” position
• Evolution, creation & science
• The assumption that Christians should vote Republican
• Christian nationalism, political power & the American Church
• Biblical literalism, inerrancy & how seminaries teach Scripture
• What happens when questioning theology costs you relationships
• Why doubt may not be the opposite of faith
• Purity culture, shame & sexuality
• What Christians from different traditions can learn from one another

Joe shares what happened when he began publicly questioning biblical inerrancy—and friendships with people he had loved for years simply disappeared.

Paul talks about discovering ideas that challenged his politics not by abandoning the Bible, but by reading it more deeply.

And Gerlyn offers another framework entirely: faith was never meant to mean certainty. Doubt, mystery, wrestling, trust, and seeking understanding can all belong inside a faithful Christian life.

The conversation ends with a challenge that may be more important than debating what someone believes today:

Ask what they were taught.

What was church like when they were a child?
What were they told they had to believe?
What were they afraid to question?
What happened if they did?

Because if we want to understand the divisions inside Christianity—and the rise of Christian nationalism—we need to understand how people were formed.

⛪ Guests

• Rev. Gerlyn Henry — Anglican Church of Canada | IG: @gerlynhenry
• Pastor Paul Drees — ELCA Lutheran | IG: @pastorpauldrees
• Pastor Joe Smith — Post-Evangelical / Disciples of Christ | IG: @therealjoe.smith

📚 People & Resources Mentioned

• Andrew Whitehead — American Idolatry | IG: @andrewwhitehead
• John Fugelsang | IG: @johnfugelsang
• C.S. Lewis
• Luther Seminary
• Columbia Theological Seminary

And yes—if you stay until the end, the pastors reveal their celebrity crushes. 😂

A huge thank you to Pastor Paul Drees, Pastor Joe Smith, and Rev. Gerlyn Henry for the vulnerability, humor, pastoral care, and generosity they brought to this two-part conversation.

May we become more curious about one another’s formation—and a little less certain that our version of Christianity is the only one.

#Christianity #Deconstruction #ProgressiveChristianity #ChristianNationalism #Faith #ReligiousTrauma #Bible

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50. Same Faith. Different Beliefs. Still Christian. (Part 1) – Rev. Gerlyn Henry (Anglican, Canada), Pastor Paul Drees (ELCA Lutheran, USA) & Pastor Joe Smith (Raised Evangelical, USA)

Mon, 24 Aug 2026 03:00:00 -0000

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50. Same Faith. Different Beliefs. Still Christian. (Part 1) – Rev. Gerlyn Henry (Anglican, Canada), Pastor Paul Drees (ELCA Lutheran, USA) & Pastor Joe Smith (Raised Evangelical, USA)

What if something you were taught you had to believe to be Christian was something millions of other Christians were never taught at all?

That question exploded after a Sacred Slope “Put Your Finger Down: Christian Edition” video reached more than a million views across platforms. The comments were filled with Christians from different traditions essentially asking one another: Wait…you were taught WHAT?

So Alexis Rice reunites with Rev. Gerlyn Henry, Pastor Paul Drees, and Pastor Joe Smith for the conversation a two-minute video couldn’t hold.

Alexis and Joe were formed in American evangelical and fundamentalist Christianity. Gerlyn is an Anglican priest in Canada. Paul is an ELCA Lutheran pastor in the U.S. They share a faith - but they were formed with remarkably different assumptions about what Christians must believe.

In Part One, they compare notes on Genesis and the talking snake, biblical literalism, evolution, the sinner’s prayer, salvation, hell, baptism, confession, grace, and universalism.

For Alexis and Joe, some of these beliefs once carried enormous stakes: Believe this. Pray this. Get this right. Your salvation may depend on it. For Gerlyn and Paul, some were never requirements at all.

The result isn’t a debate over who is the “right” Christian. It’s an honest, funny, sometimes painful conversation about what happens when we become curious about the Christianity outside the one that formed us - and discover that questioning something we inherited doesn’t necessarily mean abandoning Jesus.

Same faith. Different beliefs. Still Christian.

💬 In This Episode

• “Wait - you weren’t taught that?”
• Genesis, talking snakes & biblical literalism
• Creation, evolution & reading Scripture differently
• Is the sinner’s prayer required for salvation?
• Hell, baptism, confession & grace
• Universalism & hopeful universalism
• Religious trauma & the fear of questioning
• Deconstructing certainty without abandoning Jesus
• Saving people from hell vs. bringing heaven to earth
• Discovering Christianity beyond the version you inherited

⛪ Meet the Pastors

• Rev. Gerlyn Henry - @gerlynhenry - Anglican priest, Canada
• Pastor Paul Drees - @pastorpauldrees - ELCA Lutheran pastor, USA
• Pastor Joe Smith - @therealjoe.smith raised Free Will Baptist/evangelical; Disciples of Christ pastor, USA

📚 People & Resources Mentioned

• Pete Enns - @peteenns - The Sin of Certainty
• Pastor Meredith Anne Miller - @meredithannemiller - Wonder & Woven
• Brian Recker - @berecker - Hell Bent
• Bradley Jersak - @bradley.jersak - A More Christlike God
• C.S. Lewis - “true myth”
• Nadia Bolz-Weber - @sarcasticlutheran
• Dolores Williams
• Brené Brown - @brenebrown
• Church Clarity - @churchclarity
• AllianceQ
• 1946 @1946themovie

🎧 Part One of a special two-part Sacred Slope conversation.

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49. Matthew Paul Turner – (Author, When I Thank God) Giving Our Kids a Faith They Don’t Have to Heal From

Thu, 06 Aug 2026 20:00:00 -0000

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49. Matthew Paul Turner – (Author, When I Thank God) Giving Our Kids a Faith They Don’t Have to Heal From

New York Times bestselling children’s author Matthew Paul Turner joins The Sacred Slope for a conversation about the stories we tell children about God—and the ones many adults are still learning to tell themselves.

Alexis and Matthew explore why children don’t get to choose their first picture of God, how children’s books can become unexpected spaces of healing for adults deconstructing harmful theology, and what it means to raise kids with a faith rooted in love, belonging, gratitude, justice, and the teachings of Jesus.

Matthew shares the story behind his new book, When I Thank God, illustrated by David Catrow, and why gratitude has remained one of the few spiritual practices that stayed with him through fundamentalism, deconstruction, coming out, and rebuilding his faith.

They also talk honestly about Christian nationalism, the Americanization of Christianity, why humility and justice are central to following Jesus, LGBTQ+ inclusion, and what Christians can actually do to make their communities more loving.

And Matthew reflects movingly on his friendship with the late Rachel Held Evans, finishing the children’s books she left behind, and why her legacy continues to change lives.

💬 In This Episode

• Giving children a picture of God they won’t have to heal from
• Why children’s books can help deconstructing adults heal
• When I Thank God and gratitude as a spiritual practice
• Following Jesus in an age of Christian nationalism
• Deconstructing whiteness and Americanized Christianity
• Why humility, justice, compassion, and belonging matter
• LGBTQ+ inclusion and showing up visibly for your neighbors
• The Growing Wall of Love at World Pride Amsterdam
• Matthew’s friendship with Rachel Held Evans
• Finishing Rachel’s children’s books after her death
• What Is God Like? and the upcoming Who Is Jesus?
• Rebuilding a Christianity centered on making things better, more hopeful, and more loving

📚 Matthew Paul Turner

Matthew is the bestselling author of When God Made You, When God Made Light, You Will Always Belong, and the new When I Thank God.

Follow Matthew: @matthewpaulturner

👥 People & Resources Mentioned

• Rachel Held Evans – @rachelheldevans
• Sarah Bessey – @sarahbessey
• Meredith Anne Miller – @meredithannemiller
• Rocky Roggio / 1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture – @rockyroggio
• Jarko de Witte van Leeuwen / The Growing Wall of Love – @thegrowingwalloflove
• David Catrow – @davidcatrow illustrator of When I Thank God
• Danny McBride / The Righteous Gemstones @therighteousgemstones

📖 When I Thank God releases August 18
Pre-Order from The Sacred Slope Book Reccos List: https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope

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48. John Fugelsang – (Aspiring Christian) Separation of Church and Hate: Reclaiming Jesus from Christian Nationalism

Thu, 30 Jul 2026 13:00:00 -0000

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48. John Fugelsang – (Aspiring Christian) Separation of Church and Hate: Reclaiming Jesus from Christian Nationalism

John Fugelsang returns to The Sacred Slope for a deeper conversation about the book Alexis named the very first Sacred Slope Book of the Year: Separation of Church and Hate: A Sane Person’s Guide to Taking Back the Bible from Fundamentalists, Fascists, and Flock-Fleecing Frauds.

Together, they explore why so many Christians and non-Christians alike have embraced the book, what it means to distinguish the teachings of Jesus from Christian nationalism, and why reclaiming Christianity from fear, power, and authoritarianism matters now more than ever.

John reflects on growing up with faith, writing a New York Times bestselling book that speaks to believers and skeptics alike, and why he believes Jesus remains one of history’s most radically compassionate voices. Alexis and John also discuss biblical literacy, Matthew 25, Christian resistance throughout history, and how ordinary Christians can push back against the weaponization of faith without becoming consumed by hatred themselves.

Whether you’re deconstructing, reconstructing, politically exhausted, or simply longing for a Christianity that looks more like Jesus than power, this conversation offers hope, humor, and practical ways to engage difficult conversations with compassion and courage.

📚 Listeners outside the U.S.: Separation of Church and Hate is now available internationally!

💬 In This Episode

• Why Separation of Church and Hate became The Sacred Slope’s first Book of the Year
• What surprised John most after the book became a New York Times bestseller
• Why Christians, atheists, and agnostics are embracing the book
• Christianity versus Christian nationalism
• Following Jesus versus simply following the Bible
• Matthew 25 and the teachings Jesus actually emphasized
• Why Jesus challenged power, wealth, and religious coercion
• Christian resistance throughout history—from the abolitionists to Dietrich Bonhoeffer and Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.
• Christian nationalism, fear, power, and authoritarianism
• How to respond to difficult conversations using scripture with compassion rather than contempt
• Why reclaiming Jesus matters for believers and non-believers alike

Congratulations to This Year’s Book of the Year Nominees!

📖 Braving the Truth – @rachelheldevans & @sarahbessey
📖 Hell Bent – @berecker
📖 We Can Be Brave & I Can Learn to Be Brave – Bishop @mariannbudde
📖 Live Laugh Love – @kkdumez
📖 The Small and the Mighty & We Are Mighty – @sharonsaysso
📖 Separation of Church and Hate – @johnfugelsang
📖 American Idolatry – @ndrewwhitehead
📖 Queer & Christian – Rev. @brandanrobertson
📖 Awake – @jenhatmaker
📖 Wonder – Pastor @meredithannemiller

🏆 The Sacred Slope Book of the Year

John Fugelsang
Separation of Church and Hate

Congratulations, @johnfugelsang, and thank you to every author who shared your wisdom with The Sacred Slope community this year.

👥 People & Resources Mentioned

• Mayor Zohran Mamdani – @zohrankmamdani & @nycmayor
• Simon Moya-Smith – @simonsaidtakeapic
• Julie Francella – @juliefrancella
• Jordan Klepper – @jordanklepper
• The Daily Show – @thedailyshow

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47. Rev. Jim Keat, Rev. Reilly Paige, & Rev. Dr. Chris Davies (United Church of Christ) – Preaching Camp: The Ties That Bind

Tue, 21 Jul 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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47. Rev. Jim Keat, Rev. Reilly Paige, & Rev. Dr. Chris Davies (United Church of Christ) – Preaching Camp: The Ties That Bind

Alexis sits down in person at Project Proclaim Preaching Camp with Rev. Reilly Paige, Rev. Dr. Chris Davies, and Rev. Jim Keat for a funny, moving, and deeply hopeful conversation about the ties that bind us - to Jesus, to one another, and to a faith larger than fear, fundamentalism, or the loudest version of American Christianity.

Together, they explore what keeps them following Jesus and what happens when Christians from evangelical and mainline traditions learn to speak across very different theological languages. Reilly shares what it means to be the pastor they needed growing up and why the word “Christian” now requires follow-up questions. Chris describes Jesus as friend, teacher, organizer, prophet, and a model for resisting empire. Jim reflects on Christianity as the spiritual language he inherited - and how digital ministry can create genuine church community far beyond a sanctuary.

Whether you are deconstructing, rebuilding, missing church, or wondering whether you can fall in love with Jesus again, this conversation offers a vision of Christianity rooted in relationship, curiosity, courage, belonging, and genuinely good news.

💬 In This Episode

• What keeps Rev Reilly, Rev Dr Chris, and Rev Jim following Jesus
• The ties that bind us to faith and one another
• Falling in love with Jesus beyond fear and fundamentalism
• Evangelical and mainline Christian “languages”
• The rapture, hell, Bible literalism, sexuality, and forbidden questions
• Being the pastor you needed growing up
• Queer Christian leadership
• Reclaiming the word “Christian”
• Preaching as the proclamation of good news
• Why progressive pastors need to show up online
• Digital ministry, online communion, and real church community
• A closing prayer for anyone deconstructing, healing, or searching for home

👥 People & Resources Mentioned

• Rev. Reilly Paige – @rangerreilly
• Rev. Dr. Chris Davies – @jesuslovesdinos
• Rev. Jim Keat – @revjimruns
• Project Proclaim – @project_proclaim
• Southern New England Conference UCC – @sneucc
• United Church of Christ – @unitedchurchofchrist
• The Riverside Church – @riversidenyc
• Bible in a Minute – @bibleinamin
• Pastor Cody Deese – @codydeese
• April Ajoy – @aprilajoy
• Rev. Bethany Peerbolte – @rev.bethany
• Rocky Roggio director of 1946 the movie - @rockyroggio
• 1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted A Culture - @1946themovie

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46. Meredith Miller (Non-Denominational Pastor, Author) – Wonder: Talking to Your Kids About God When You're Still Figuring It Out

Mon, 13 Jul 2026 19:00:00 -0000

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46. Meredith Miller (Non-Denominational Pastor, Author) – Wonder: Talking to Your Kids About God When You're Still Figuring It Out

Alexis sits down with non-denominational pastor, author, and children's faith expert Meredith Miller for one of the most practical and hope-filled conversations yet about parenting after deconstruction and teaching the Bible to your kids when you're still figuring out your own faith.

Author of Wonder: A Grown-Up's Guide to Exploring the Bible with Children and Woven: Nurturing a Faith Your Kid Doesn't Have to Heal From, Meredith has spent more than 20 years helping families cultivate emotionally healthy, curiosity-filled Christian faith. Together, Alexis and Meredith explore how to talk with kids about God, Genesis, evolution, Adam and Eve, a talking snake, Revelation, the rapture, hell, and difficult Bible passages without fear, shame, or pretending to have all the answers.

Whether you're rebuilding your faith after evangelical fundamentalism, navigating deconstruction, or simply wondering how to introduce your children to Christianity in a healthier way, this conversation offers practical tools, deep encouragement, and a vision of faith rooted in trust, curiosity, compassion, and the teachings of Jesus.

💬 In This Episode

• Meredith's book Wonder: A Grown-Up's Guide to Exploring the Bible with Children
• Teaching the Bible to kids when you don't have all the answers
• Parenting after deconstruction
• Raising curious kids instead of fearful kids
• Why Genesis is a poem, not a science textbook
• Evolution and Christian faith
• Talking to kids about Adam and Eve
• How to answer difficult Bible questions
• Hell, Revelation, and why the rapture isn't in the Bible
• Bible literalism, curiosity, and healthy faith formation
• Church hurt, evangelicalism, and rebuilding trust
• Learning alongside our children instead of having all the answers
• A beautiful closing prayer for anyone healing from religious trauma

👥 People & Resources Mentioned

• Meredith Miller – @meredithannemiller
• Wonder: A Grown-Up's Guide to Exploring the Bible with Children is available on The Sacred Slope Book Reccos List: https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope
• Woven: Nurturing a Faith Your Kid Doesn't Have to Heal From
• Pastor Kristen Mockler Young – @kristenmockleryoung, Author: The Other Side of Certainty (coming soon!)
• Fuller Youth Institute @fulleryouthinstitute
• Dr. Janet Kellogg Ray @janetkelloggray

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45. Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde (Episcopal) - I Can Learn to Be Brave: Building Courage One Step at a Time

Tue, 07 Jul 2026 05:00:00 -0000

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45. Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde (Episcopal) - I Can Learn to Be Brave: Building Courage One Step at a Time

Alexis welcomes back Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde, Episcopal Bishop of Washington, D.C., for a deeply hopeful conversation about courage, faith, and her beautiful new children's book, I Can Learn to Be Brave- releasing July 7th!

Known around the world for her sermon calling for mercy toward LGBTQ people and immigrants, Bishop Budde reflects on the quieter acts of bravery that prepare us for life's defining moments. Together, Alexis and Bishop Budde explore why courage begins in childhood, why adults need this message just as much as children, how churches can rebuild trust after church hurt, what faithful public witness looks like in a polarized world, and why the future of the Church could depend on ordinary people willing to take one faithful step at a time.

This conversation is an invitation to raise courageous kids, become more courageous ourselves, and imagine a Christianity rooted in humility, inclusion, compassion, hope, and the teachings of Jesus.

💬 In This Episode

• Bishop Budde's new children's book, I Can Learn to Be Brave
• Why courage is something we learn and practice
• Raising courageous kids through faith
• Why adults need bravery too
• Spiritual formation and listening to the Holy Spirit
• Church hurt, deconstruction, and rebuilding trust
• Christian nationalism and loving our neighbors
• Ministry in the digital age
• LGBTQ inclusion and women in ministry
• Why ordinary people change history
• Building the future of the Church one faithful step at a time
• A beautiful closing prayer for anyone needing hope today

👥 People & Resources Mentioned

• Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde – @mariannbudde
• I Can Learn to Be Brave is available for purchase on The Sacred Slope Book Reccos List: https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope
• Illustrated by Holly Hatam – @hollyhatamillustration
• Flamingo Books, an imprint of Penguin Young Readers – @penguinkids
• Rev. Gerlyn Henry - @gerlynhenry
• Pastor Paul Drees - @pastorpauldrees
• Sharon McMahon – @sharonsaysso
• Jonathan Eig - @joneig
• Rich Villodas – @richvillodas
• Adam Hamilton – @revadamhamilton

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44. Leigh Larson (Disciples of Christ) – Christian Nationalism, Patriotism & Reclaiming Church

Thu, 02 Jul 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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44. Leigh Larson (Disciples of Christ) – Christian Nationalism, Patriotism & Reclaiming Church

Alexis sits down with theologian, researcher, public educator, and creator of @followtheleighder, Leigh Larson, for one of the most important conversations yet on Christian nationalism, American identity, and what it means to faithfully follow Jesus in a polarized world.

Raised in the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ) tradition, Leigh draws on her graduate work in theology and military chaplaincy to help Christians better understand the relationship between faith, democracy, power, and patriotism.

Together, Alexis and Leigh explore why Christian nationalism is not the same thing as Christianity, why America has never belonged to one denomination or political movement, and how progressive Christians have helped shape many of our country's greatest moral movements. They also discuss church hurt, deconstruction, rebuilding faith, and why Christians should never surrender either the Bible or the American flag to extremists.

This conversation is an invitation to reclaim hope, compassion, and a vision of Christianity rooted in the teachings of Jesus rather than fear or domination.

💬 In This Episode

• What Christian nationalism is—and what it isn't
• Growing up in the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ)
• Church hurt, institutional harm, and returning to faith
• The relationship between Christianity, democracy, and patriotism
• Why America is not a Christian nation—and why that's good for faith
• Progressive Christians throughout American history
• The role of women in early Christianity
• Reimagining church for a new generation
• Why compassion is a radical act
• Finding common ground across political and religious differences
• Why the future of the church depends on who shows up

👥 People/Resources Mentioned

• Leigh Larson: @followtheleighder
• Sharon McMahon: @sharonsaysso
• Rachel Held Evans: @rachelheldevans
• Sarah Bessey: @sarahbessey
• Kristin Kobes Du Mez: @kkdumez
• Richard Rohr
• Tim Whitaker / The New Evangelicals: @thenewevangelicals
• April Ajoy: @aprilsajoy
• Dan McClellan: @maklelan
• Nadia Bolz-Weber: @nadia_bolzweber
• James Talarico: @jamestalarico
• Andrew Whitehead @ndrewwhitehead

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43. Jarko de Witte van Leeuwen (Gay & Christian in The Netherlands) – A Journey Back to Church Through Love, Marriage & Hope

Mon, 29 Jun 2026 22:00:00 -0000

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43. Jarko de Witte van Leeuwen (Gay & Christian in The Netherlands) – A Journey Back to Church Through Love, Marriage & Hope

Alexis sits down with Jarko de Witte van Leeuwen, Dutch LGBTQ+ advocate and founder of The Growing Wall of Love, for a moving conversation about growing up gay in a conservative Christian environment, surviving years of bullying, finding lifelong love, and discovering that losing trust in the church doesn't have to mean losing God.

Jarko shares his extraordinary journey from Belgium to the Netherlands, meeting his husband Jos, becoming one of the first same-sex couples married after marriage equality became law in the first country to legalize same-sex marriage, and the pastor whose simple act of blessing their wedding became the beginning of healing after years of church hurt.

Together, Alexis and Jarko explore what Christians around the world can learn from one another, why affirming Christians exist in every denomination, and how crossing cultures, languages, and traditions can deepen our faith, expand our empathy, and reveal a much bigger picture of the global Church.

💬 **In This Episode**

• Growing up gay in a conservative Christian environment
• Bullying, shame, and discovering God's unconditional love
• A remarkable love story spanning Belgium and the Netherlands
• Marriage equality in the Netherlands and becoming one of the first same-sex married couples
• Finding faith again after church hurt
• Why affirming Christians exist in every denomination
• Raising children as a same-sex Christian couple
• The difference between welcoming and affirming churches
• Advice for pastors seeking to create safer, more inclusive churches
• The Growing Wall of Love and World Pride Amsterdam

👥 **People/Resources Mentioned**

• Jarko de Witte van Leeuwen: @jarko_de_witte_van_leeuwen
• The Growing Wall of Love: @thegrowingwalloflove
• Rocky Roggio / *1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture*: @rockyroggio • @1946themovie
• Rev. Dr. Chris Davies: @revdrchrisdavies
• Project Proclaim: @project_proclaim
• Southern New England Conference UCC: @sneucc ⁨@uccvideos⁩
• Westerkerk Amsterdam: @westerkerkamsterdam
• WorldPride Amsterdam 2026: @worldpride2026

#Christianity #ProgressiveChristianity #LGBTQChristianity #GayChristian #ChurchHurt #Deconstruction #Reconstruction #TheNetherlands #WorldPride #1946TheMovie #OpenAndAffirming #Faith #TheSacredSlope

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42. Justin Telthorst (Catholic, Empty Chairs) - A Gay Catholic on Faith, the Pope, and the Empty Seats in the Church (Pride Month Reissue)

Sun, 28 Jun 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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42. Justin Telthorst (Catholic, Empty Chairs) - A Gay Catholic on Faith, the Pope, and the Empty Seats in the Church (Pride Month Reissue)

Alexis sits down with Justin Telthorst, a gay Catholic, speaker, and creator of Empty Chairs @emptychairshome for a moving conversation about faith, identity, church hurt, and belonging inside the Catholic tradition.

Justin shares his story of growing up Catholic, surviving conversion therapy, wrestling with conscience and church teaching, and finding his way back to a relationship with God rooted in honesty, love, and truth. Together, Alexis and Justin explore what it means to stay connected to Jesus when institutions wound, and why LGBTQ Christians are still showing up, still praying, and still making room for hope.

💬 In This Episode

• Growing up Catholic and falling in love with the Church
• When faith and identity begin to feel in conflict
• The harm of conversion therapy
• Reclaiming a relationship with God after church hurt
• The meaning behind Empty Chairs
• Why LGBTQ Catholics are still showing up
• Gatekeeping, conscience, belonging, and love of neighbor
• How parents can respond when their child comes out
• Catholics, Protestants, communion, and the tensions we inherit

👥 People/Resources Mentioned

• Justin Telthorst / Empty Chairs: @emptychairshome
• The Pope: @pontifex
• Brené Brown: @brenebrown
• 1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture: @1946themovie
• Colby Martin / UnClobbered: @colbymartin
• Church Clarity: churchclarity.org
• Father James Martin: @jamesmartinsj
• Outreach: @outrchcatholic
• Father James Alison
• Theology for the Unwanted: @theounwanted
• GayExTrad: @gayextrad
• New Ways Ministry: @newwaysministry
• Fortunate Families: fortunatefamilies.com
• Honoring the Gift
• Equip / Pieter Valk
• Building Catholic Futures: @buildingcatholicorg
• Eve Tushnet: @eve_tushnet
• Without Exception / David Palmieri: see outreach.faith and newwaysministry.org
• Dr. Julia Sadusky: @drsadusky

#Catholicism #Christianity #deconstruction #reconstruction #LGBTQChristianity #GayCatholic #ProgressiveChristianity #QueerTheology #ChurchHurt #Catholic #1946TheMovie #LGBT #LGBTQ #emptychairs

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41. Rev. Brandan Robertson (Progressive Pastor) - Queer & Christian: Reclaiming the Bible, Our Faith, and Our Place at the Table (Pride Month Reissue)

Fri, 26 Jun 2026 01:00:00 -0000

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41. Rev. Brandan Robertson (Progressive Pastor) - Queer & Christian: Reclaiming the Bible, Our Faith, and Our Place at the Table (Pride Month Reissue)

What if being queer and Christian was never the contradiction you were taught it was?

Alexis sits down with Rev. Brandan Robertson, pastor, activist, and author of Queer & Christian, to explore how scripture has been misunderstood, weaponized, and reclaimed.

Brandan shares his journey from a fundamentalist Baptist upbringing, through Bible college and conversion therapy, to becoming an openly gay pastor and leading voice in progressive Christianity. Together, they unpack what happens when faith both saves you and harms you, and how deconstruction can lead to something deeper.

They dive into some of the most debated passages in the Bible, including Sodom and Gomorrah and 1 Corinthians 6, challenging long-held assumptions about LGBTQ Christianity and biblical interpretation. Brandan explains how mistranslations, cultural context, and power dynamics, not love, are at the center of many interpretations.

This conversation reframes the Bible not as a rulebook, but as a complex, ancient library inviting curiosity, wrestling, and growth.

They also explore:
• Why progressive Christians must be louder about their faith
• How queer people carry deep spiritual wisdom
• The difference between certainty and truth
• Why interpretation matters
• How harmful theology impacts real lives

The episode closes with a powerful prayer for anyone who has felt rejected, afraid, or cut off from the love of God.

This episode is for anyone exploring:
progressive Christianity, LGBTQ Christianity, queer theology, biblical interpretation, deconstruction, faith after evangelicalism, or healing from church hurt.

💡 Key Takeaways
• The Bible is not univocal and contains diverse voices
• Interpretation is unavoidable and matters deeply
• Many anti-LGBTQ readings ignore historical context
• Deconstruction can lead to deeper faith
• God’s love is not something you can lose

About Our Guest
Rev. Brandan Robertson (@brandanrobertson) is a pastor, activist, and author of Queer & Christian. He is a PhD candidate in New Testament at Drew University (@drewuniversity).

📚 Resources & Voices Mentioned
•Queer & Christian: https://www.brandanrobertson.com/queer-christian-book
• Dan McClellan @maklelan
• Brian McLaren @brianmclaren
• Don Lemon @donlemonofficial
• James Talarico @jamestalarico
• Rocky Roggio @1946themovie
• Rachel Held Evans @rachelheldevans

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40. Sara Cunningham (Free Mom Hugs) & Kelly Mellen (Making Things Right) – Women of Faith Showing Up for the Queer Community

Tue, 23 Jun 2026 03:00:00 -0000

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40. Sara Cunningham (Free Mom Hugs) & Kelly Mellen (Making Things Right) – Women of Faith Showing Up for the Queer Community

What does it look like when women of faith choose love over fear and show up for the queer community?

Alexis sits down with Sara Cunningham, founder of Free Mom Hugs, and Kelly Mellen, Managing Director of Making Things Right, for a joyful, deeply personal conversation about faith, allyship, healing, and learning how to better love and support LGBTQ+ people.

Together, these three women of faith reflect on growing up in Christian traditions that taught homosexuality was a sin, the relationships and experiences that changed their hearts, and why no one should ever have to choose between their faith and being fully known and loved.

Sara shares the story behind Free Mom Hugs, which has become a source of hope and chosen family for countless LGBTQ+ people and parents around the world. Kelly discusses her work with Making Things Right and her "I'm Sorry Pride Tour," inviting Christians to move beyond good intentions and into repentance, repair, and love in action.

They discuss church hurt, Christian nationalism, allyship, apology, belonging, and why showing up with compassion matters now more than ever.

The conversation closes with a blessing for anyone who has ever wondered whether they belong, whether God could still love them, or whether hope is possible after spiritual harm.

This conversation is for anyone exploring progressive Christianity, LGBTQ+ Christianity, allyship, church hurt, deconstruction, healing after evangelicalism, affirming theology, chosen family, Free Mom Hugs, faith after harm, and showing up with love.

💡 Key Takeaways

• Love is bigger than fear
• Relationships change hearts more effectively than arguments
• Christians have a responsibility to repair harm done to LGBTQ+ people
• Apologies matter, but showing up matters even more
• Chosen family is sacred
• LGBTQ+ people deserve to be fully known, loved, and celebrated

About Our Guests

Sara Cunningham (@saraphrased @freemomhugs) is the founder of Free Mom Hugs, a movement empowering people to celebrate the LGBTQIA+ community through visibility, education, and conversation.

Kelly Mellen (@kellymellen_) is the Managing Director of Making Things Right (@makingthingsright_mtr), helping Christians move toward responsibility, repair, and compassionate allyship.

📚 Resources & Voices Mentioned

• Brian Neitzel (@brianneitzel)
Co-founder of Making Things Right and leader of the "I'm Sorry Pride Tour."

• Rocky Roggio (@rockyroggio @1946TheMovie)
Director of 1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture.

• Jamie Lee Curtis (@jamieleecurtis)

• CenterPeace (@centerpeaceinc)

• Q Christian Fellowship (@qchristianorg)

• The Reformation Project (@thereformationproject)

• The Necessary Conversation Podcast (@thenecessaryconversationpod)

• Peppermint (@peppermint247)

🏳️‍🌈 Looking for an affirming church?

Church Clarity (@churchclarity)

Enter your ZIP code at ChurchClarity.org to find churches that are clear (and unclear) about:

• LGBTQ+ affirmation
• Same-sex weddings
• Women in leadership
• Queer leadership and belonging

🤗 Looking for your people?

Free Mom Hugs (@freemomhugs)

Find a local chapter, volunteer, or simply know that there are people looking for you, too.

As Sara reminds us:

"There's nothing you have done, nothing you will do, and nothing you can do that can separate you from the love of God."

And as Kelly says:

"I'm sorry you've been fed a narrative that you are less than. You are fearfully and wonderfully made, just the way you are."

If this episode resonates with you, consider sharing it with someone navigating faith, sexuality, belonging, or healing from church hurt.

Sometimes the most sacred thing we can do is simply show up with love.

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39. Rev. Roberto Che Espinoza, PhD (Baptist) – Becoming Human With One Another (Pride Month Reissue)

Fri, 19 Jun 2026 03:00:00 -0000

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39. Rev. Roberto Che Espinoza (Baptist) – Becoming Human With One Another (Pride Month Reissue)

This week, Alexis Rice welcomes Rev. Dr. Roberto Che Espinoza, PhD (@drrobertoche), pastor, scholar, and founder of Activist Theology and Our Collective Becoming.

Roberto’s life and ministry embody a theology rooted in interdependence, tenderness, and justice. A Latinx trans man, theologian, and ordained Baptist minister, Roberto has devoted his work to spiritual formation, collective liberation, and radical ethics. He invites us to rediscover the practices of Jesus—not as abstractions, but as embodied acts of eating, walking, storytelling, and living in community. Song: Stay Safe provided by singer-songwriter and ally, Derek Webb @derekwebb.

Alexis and Roberto explore:

Why oppositional politics fuels polarization—and how interdependence offers a better way
How embodiment and presence can reshape theology and ethics
Roberto’s call story: growing up in poverty and violence, finding home in the church, surviving abuse, and reclaiming his call to ministry
The painful reality of being pushed out of churches for living prophetically, and the hope of interspiritual community
What it means to become a stone catcher in a world of violence toward queer and trans people
How proximity, care, and hospitality can disrupt cycles of fear and build true solidarity

💡 Key Takeaways

Embodied presence is the starting point for repair
The fruit of the Spirit—not fear or exclusion—must guide Christian community
To follow Jesus is to risk proximity, solidarity, and radical love
Flourishing requires more than inclusion—it demands spaces where difference blooms

⛪ About Our Guest
Rev. Dr. Roberto Che Espinoza is a pastor, visiting professor, activist, and scholar. A Latinx trans man, Roberto works at the intersections of embodiment, decolonial thought, moral imagination, and justice-rooted theology. He holds a BA in Bible, an MTS in Ethics, and a PhD in Constructive Philosophical Theology. He founded Activist Theology and Our Collective Becoming, is a visiting professor at Duke Divinity, and speaks nationally and internationally on gender justice, faith, and politics. Roberto lives in upstate New York.

📚 Resources Mentioned

Activist Theology & Body Becoming — @drrobertoche
Queer Virtue — @elizabethedman
Survival Songs album — @derekwebb
Homebrewed Christianity — @theologynerd
Exvangelical — @brchastain
Straight White American Jesus — @straightwhitejc & @bbonishi
Work by Sarah Heath — @revsarahheath
The Bible for Normal People — @thebiblefornormalpeople

May you find sacred ground, may the fruit of the Spirit guide you. If you’re longing for community, may you be encouraged to find one that embraces your full, questioning, beautiful selves.

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About The Sacred Slope
Where the slippery slope becomes sacred ground.
For the spiritually tender—raised in or rooted in Christianity.
Come explore our global, diverse, inclusive Christian faith, deconstruction, and spiritual identity in a rapidly changing world. Through conversations with clergy, scholars, and cultural voices, the show creates space for people navigating faith after certainty, church harm, or political co-option of religion.

🎧 WATCH: YouTube / Spotify
LISTEN: Apple Podcasts + everywhere
FOLLOW: @thesacredslope (IG, FB, Threads, TikTok, YouTube, Bluesky)

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38. Timothy Schraeder Rodriguez (Non-Denominational Megachurch Culture) - Conversion Therapy Dropout

Tue, 16 Jun 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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38. Timothy Schraeder Rodriguez (Non-Denominational Megachurch Culture) - Conversion Therapy Dropout

What if the choice between being gay and being Christian was never a choice at all?

Alexis sits down with Timothy Schrader Rodriguez, author of Conversion Therapy Dropout, for a deeply personal conversation about surviving eight years of conversion therapy, working behind the scenes at some of the most influential evangelical megachurches in America, and discovering that faith and queerness do not have to be enemies.

Tim shares his journey from growing up in evangelical megachurch culture to entering conversion therapy in pursuit of what he believed God required of him. Together, Alexis and Tim explore the devastating impact of spiritual abuse, the false binary many LGBTQ+ Christians are taught, and the healing that becomes possible when people are fully seen, loved, and affirmed.

They discuss the rise of Christian nationalism, the continued attacks on LGBTQ+ rights, and why visibility, honesty, and relationships remain some of the most powerful tools for change.

Tim also shares the story behind Church Clarity, the organization he helped launch to help people find churches that are honest about where they stand on LGBTQ+ inclusion and women in leadership.

The conversation closes with a powerful benediction for anyone who has ever wondered whether they belong, whether God could love them as they are, or whether faith is still possible after spiritual harm.

This conversation is for anyone exploring:
progressive Christianity, LGBTQ+ Christianity, queer theology, deconstruction, church hurt, conversion therapy, Christian nationalism, faith after evangelicalism, and healing from spiritual abuse.

💡 Key Takeaways

• Conversion therapy is harmful and does not work
• Being gay and Christian is not a contradiction
• Many LGBTQ+ people leave faith because of rejection, not because they stop seeking God
• Relationships and stories change hearts more effectively than arguments
• Churches should be clear about where they stand on LGBTQ+ inclusion and women in leadership
• Healing is not becoming someone else - it's returning to who you've always been

About Our Guest

Timothy Schrader Rodriguez (@timothy.s.rodriguez) is an author, speaker, church communications strategist, LGBTQ+ advocate, and one of the founders of Church Clarity. His memoir, Conversion Therapy Dropout, chronicles his experience surviving eight years of conversion therapy and finding a path toward healing, authenticity, and faith.

📚 Resources & Voices Mentioned

• Jonathan Van Ness @jvn
• Getting Better with JVN: @gettingbetterwithJVN
• NBC News interview featuring Timothy Schrader Rodriguez: https://www.instagram.com/reel/DYDZuzrsZ8L/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
• Church Clarity @churchclarity
• Q Christian Fellowship @qchristianorg https://www.qchristian.org/
• Rev. Brandan Robertson @brandanrobertson
• Matthew Vines @matthewvines
• Justin Telthorst @emptycharishome
• Rev. Dr. Ginny Brown Daniel https://ginnybrowndaniel.substack.com/
• Brené Brown @brenebrown

🏳️‍🌈 Looking for a church?

Visit ChurchClarity.org

Is there a church near you that is clear about how they welcome and affirm LGBTQ+ people? Are queer people allowed in leadership? Will the church perform same-sex weddings? Do they affirm women in leadership? Enter your ZIP code and see what's around you.

As Tim channels @BrenéBrown in this episode: "Clarity is kindness. Ambiguity can be harmful."

Grab Conversion Therapy Dropout (I love Tim reading the audiobook!) Grab a copy https://bookshop.org/shop/thesacredslope

If this episode resonates with you, consider sharing it with someone navigating questions around faith, sexuality, belonging, or healing from church hurt.

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37. Bishop Guðrún (Church of Iceland) – A Nation Led by Women, and a Bishop Who Says Queer People Should Be Safe in Christianity (Pride Month Reissue)

Fri, 12 Jun 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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37. Bishop Guðrún Karls Helgudóttir (Church of Iceland) – A Nation Led by Women, and a Bishop Who Says Queer People Should Be Safe in Christianity

When a nation is led by women at the highest levels - the President, the Prime Minister, the Mayor of Reykjavík, the National Police Commissioner, the Minister of Foreign Affairs, and the Bishop of Iceland - something becomes visible: women in power isn’t an exception, it’s normal. Into that context steps Bishop Guðrún - the second woman ever to serve as Bishop of Iceland - who tells LGBTQ+ people that God’s creation is good — and that we are holy creations of God.

Together, Alexis & Bishop Guðrún dive into:

• Iceland’s 1975 Women’s Strike & gender equality milestones
• From harm to repair - why churches MUST affirm LGBTQ+ people
• The Bishop’s civic role - national funerals, ceremonies, moral voice
• Mental health, suicide, and walking with people in suffering
• A prayer in Icelandic for listeners who left church but not God

💡 Key Takeaways

🌈 Safety, dignity, and belonging for queer people is Christian discipleship - not deviation.
👩‍⚖️ When women lead at every level of national life, equality becomes ordinary - not symbolic.
🧭 The Bishop’s role is not partisan power - it is moral presence and public courage.
🕊️ True pastoral leadership walks with people in suffering, not above them.

⛪ About Our Guest

Bishop Guðrún Karls Helgudóttir (@gudrun.biskup_) is the Bishop of Iceland - the spiritual head of the Church of Iceland (@kirkjan.is), a national Lutheran church interwoven into Icelandic cultural life, history, and state ceremonies. The Bishop’s office carries both sacred and civic weight: accompanying presidents and prime ministers at moments of national significance, offering moral clarity in public crises, and serving as a pastoral presence when the country gathers in grief, remembrance, or celebration.

Bishop Guðrún is the second woman ever to serve as Bishop of Iceland. Her pathway includes parish leadership in Sweden and Iceland, and theological formation at the University of Iceland and the Lutheran School of Theology in Chicago. Known internationally for her clear advocacy for LGBTQ+ inclusion, Bishop Guðrún represents a model of Christian leadership rooted not in fear or exclusion, but in dignity, equality, and the conviction that God’s creation is good.

📚 Resources Mentioned

Iceland Church Pride clip:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DNBnMnFMtN8/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Bishop Guðrún Trans rights clip:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DFvNaZ8tKeN/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Suicide-awareness clip:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DPCd44njMXo/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Women’s Strike (BBC):
https://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/articles/cy0ky4e4kzwo

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36. Rev. Dr. Caleb J. Lines (Disciples of Christ/UCC) - The Progressive, Open & Affirming Pastor Evangelicals Warned You About

Tue, 09 Jun 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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Pride Month Series- 🌈 Happy Pride!

36. Rev. Dr. Caleb J. Lines (Disciples of Christ/UCC) - The Progressive, Open & Affirming Pastor Evangelicals Warned You About

What does a conversation with a progressive, open and affirming pastor actually sound like?

For many people raised in evangelical spaces, progressive pastors were often presented as people who had compromised biblical faith or wandered too far from Christianity. But what happens when you actually listen and decide for yourself?

Alexis sits down with Rev. Dr. Caleb J. Lines, pastor, author, scholar, Co-Executive Director of the Center for Progressive Christianity, and one of the most visible progressive Christian voices online, for a wide-ranging conversation about faith, deconstruction, LGBTQ+ inclusion, Christian nationalism, biblical interpretation, raising children with a healthy faith, and why so many people are reimagining Christianity today.

Caleb serves an open and affirming church in San Diego. Open and Affirming (ONA) churches fully welcome LGBTQ+ people into the life and leadership of the church. In many ONA churches, this includes marriage, ordination, leadership, and participation at every level.

Together, Alexis and Caleb explore whether progressive Christianity is really as scary as many people were taught, why faith doesn't have to be rooted in certainty, and how Christianity can be a force for justice, compassion, curiosity, and human flourishing.

💬 In This Episode

• What progressive Christianity actually is
• What "Open and Affirming" means
• Growing up progressive in the Bible Belt
• Deconstruction, reconstruction, and resilient faith
• Raising children who can ask hard questions
• Christian nationalism and the politics of fear
• LGBTQ+ inclusion in the church
• How to find a safe, affirming church
• Why people are leaving harmful religious spaces
• Why some people are reclaiming Christianity instead of abandoning it
• Interfaith relationships and finding common ground
• Faith, doubt, mystery, and living without certainty

👥 People & Resources Mentioned

• Rev. Dr. Caleb J. Lines: @revcalebjlines
• The Center for Progressive Christianity: @progressivechristianity
• Church Clarity: @churchclarity | churchclarity.org
• GayChurch.org
• Rev. Dr. Mark Sandlin: @marksandlin
• Marcus Borg
• Barbara Brown Taylor: @barbarabrowntaylor
• Holy Envy
• Phyllis Tickle
• Jerome Berryman / Godly Play
• Imam Taha Hassane
• Petra Costa: @petracostal
• Apocalypse in the Tropics (Netflix)
• The Moonshine Jesus Show: @moonshinejesusshow

📚 Books by Caleb

• Awakened: A Path to Courageous Faith in an Uncertain World
• The Great Digital Commission: Embracing Social Media for Church Growth and Transformation
Website: calebjlines.com

#ProgressiveChristianity #OpenAndAffirming #PrideMonth #Christianity #Deconstruction #Reconstruction #LGBTQChristianity #ChristianNationalism #Faith #ProgressiveFaith #ChurchHurt #InclusiveChurch #TheSacredSlope #CalebJLines #Pride 🌈

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35. Rocky Roggio (Director, 1946: The Movie): The Year the Word “Homosexual” Entered the Bible (Pride Month Reissue)

Fri, 05 Jun 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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HAPPY PRIDE!

🎙️ 35. Rocky Roggio (Director, 1946: The Movie) - 1946: The Year the Word “Homosexual” Entered the Bible (Pride Month Reissue)

One mistranslation changed theology, policy, families, and the lives of millions of LGBTQ people.

Alexis sits down with Rocky Roggio @rockyroggio, director of the award-winning documentary 1946: The Movie @1946themovie, to explore the year the word “homosexual” first appeared in an English Bible and how that translation decision reshaped theology, culture, and public policy for generations.

They unpack the historical research behind the film, including discoveries in the Yale archives surrounding the 1946 Revised Standard Version Bible translation. Rocky explains how one translation decision helped shape decades of church teaching and influence modern debates around LGBTQ Christianity and Bible translation.

Rocky also shares the personal story behind the film, including the decision to include her own father, a minister, in the documentary. Their conversations reveal how theology is never abstract - it shows up in families, churches, and real relationships.

Alexis and Rocky discuss why the film resonates with audiences across the political and theological spectrum and why understanding Bible translation history, queer theology, progressive Christianity, and Christian nationalism matters right now.

This episode is for anyone - Christian or not, queer or not - who cares about truth, history, and how sacred texts are interpreted and sometimes weaponized.

💡 Key Takeaways

• The word “homosexual” first appeared in an English Bible in 1946
• Bible translation decisions can shape theology and culture for generations
• Scripture can inspire justice or be used to justify harm
• Biblical literacy matters in conversations about Christian nationalism and LGBTQ inclusion

About Our Guest

Rocky Roggio is the director of 1946: The Movie, an award-winning documentary investigating how the word “homosexual” first entered the English Bible and how that translation shaped modern debates around LGBTQ Christianity.

🎬 Watch the film

Best way to support the filmmakers (independent streaming platform):
https://watch.eventive.org/1946themovie

🌍 Projects & Organizations Mentioned

The Living Wall of Love - Jarko’s project featured at World Pride Amsterdam
https://growingwalloflove.com

Making Things Right (LGBTQ Christian reconciliation resource)
https://makingthingsright.org

#Christianity #deconstruction #OpenAndAffirming #1946TheMovie

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34. Science & Faith Part 2 - Pastor Will Rose (ELCA Lutheran) - The False Choice Between Faith and Science

Tue, 02 Jun 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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34. Science & Faith Part 2 - Pastor Will Rose (ELCA Lutheran) - The False Choice Between Faith and Science

Alexis Rice sits down with Pastor Will Rose, ELCA Lutheran pastor in Chapel Hill, North Carolina, co-host of Systematic Geekology, and creator of the faith and science podcast Your Matter Matters, for a deeply compassionate conversation about curiosity, science, deconstruction, and why asking honest questions should never make someone feel spiritually unsafe.

Together, Alexis and Will unpack the false binary so many Christians were handed between faith and science - and the shame many people carry after being taught that questioning Genesis, evolution, the Big Bang, healthcare, vaccines, or scientific expertise somehow meant they were “falling away from God.”

Will shares how many progressive and mainline Christian spaces approach scripture, theology, and science very differently than fundamentalist environments, and why intellectual humility, wonder, and curiosity can actually deepen faith instead of destroy it.

At the center of this conversation is one powerful idea:

“If that’s how the universe operates - growing, evolving, shifting - I think our faith can be like that too.”

This episode is an invitation for anyone who has ever felt spiritually trapped, intellectually unsafe, or afraid that asking honest questions could cost them belonging.

💬 In This Episode

• Why many Christians were taught faith and science cannot coexist
• Curiosity vs “doubt culture” in evangelical spaces
• Why asking questions should not be treated as rebellion against God
• The danger of certainty culture in Christianity
• Genesis, evolution, Adam & Eve, and biblical interpretation
• “God of the gaps” theology and why it creates fear
• Why many pastors feel pressure to have all the answers
• The importance of intellectual humility in faith communities
• How science and theology ask different kinds of questions
• COVID, vaccines, healthcare, and anti-science narratives in churches
• Christian nationalism and the weaponization of faith
• The erosion of trust in institutions, experts, and scientists
• Why progressive pastors and churches need more visibility
• Theology Beer Camp and creating safe spaces for spiritual exploration
• Why people do not need to abandon science in order to love God
• The healing power of realizing “I’m not the only one asking this”

📚 Books & Resources Mentioned

• Pastor Will Rose: @willnrose
• Your Matter Matters Podcast: @yourmattermatters
• Fish with Feet: Human Evolution and the Image of God - Dr. Janet Kellogg Ray @janetkelloggray from @eerdmans
• The Sin of Certainty - Pete Enns @thebiblefornormalpeople
• The Great Emergence - Phyllis Tickle
• Systematic Geekology @systematicgeekology
• Theology Beer Camp @theologybeercamp
• Homebrewed Christianity with Tripp Fulelr @theologynerd @trippfuller
• Dr. Janet Kellogg Ray: @janetkelloggray
• Tripp Fuller: @trippfuller
• Pete Enns: @thebiblefornormalpeople
• Ted Peters
• Joshua Noel
• Francis Collins
• Neil deGrasse Tyson: @neildegrassetyson

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33. Science & Faith Part 1 - Dr. Janet Kellogg Ray (Science Educator & Christian) - Science Asks How & When. Faith Asks Who & Why.

Tue, 26 May 2026 01:00:00 -0000

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33. Science & Faith Part 1 - Dr. Janet Kellogg Ray (Science Educator & Christian) - Science Asks How & When. Faith Asks Who & Why

Alexis Rice sits down with Dr. Janet Kellogg Ray, science educator, university lecturer, Christian, and author of Fish with Feet: Human Evolution and the Image of God, for a deeply honest conversation about evolution, evangelicalism, scientific literacy, and the false choice so many Christians were handed between faith and science.

Raised in conservative Christianity and young earth creationist culture herself, Janet shares how studying biology transformed her understanding of both science and God - not by destroying her faith, but by expanding it.

Together, Alexis and Janet unpack the deep distrust of science embedded in many American evangelical spaces, why evolution was framed as spiritually dangerous, and how generations of Christians were taught that accepting evolution, climate science, vaccines, or scientific expertise itself could somehow threaten their relationship with God.

At the center of this conversation is one of Janet’s most powerful insights:

“Science asks questions of how and when. Faith asks questions of who and why.”

Science cannot answer every meaningful question in human life. And faith and science are not enemies competing for the same territory - they are often answering entirely different kinds of questions.

💬 In This Episode

• Growing up in young earth creationism
• Why evolution became linked to “moral decline” in evangelical culture
• The rise of anti-evolution apologetics in America
• How churches built alternative Christian media and education ecosystems
• Why many Christians distrust scientists and experts
• COVID, vaccines, public health, and evangelical fear of science
• What scientists actually mean by “theory”
• Adam and Eve, Genesis, and the tension between theology and biology
• The Big Bang, the Cambrian explosion, and misconceptions about evolution
• Why curiosity should not be treated as rebellion against God
• Galileo, science denial, and refusing to “look through the telescope”
• Authority vs expertise and the danger of scientific illiteracy
• Why science and faith can coexist without conflict
• How asking questions can actually deepen faith rather than destroy it

Janet offers a compassionate invitation for Christians who feel trapped between intellectual honesty and spiritual belonging:
you do not have to reject science to love God.

📚 Books & Resources Mentioned

• Fish with Feet: Human Evolution and the Image of God (@Eerdmans)
• The God of Monkey Science (@Eerdmans)
• Baby Dinosaurs on the Ark

👥 People & Accounts Mentioned

• Janet Kellogg Ray: @janetkelloggray
• Neil deGrasse Tyson: @neildegrassetyson
• Hasan Minhaj - IG: @hasanminhaj @hmdk
• Francis Collins
• Kenneth Miller

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32. Sharon McMahon (We Are Mighty) - & We Are the Ones We’ve Been Waiting For

Tue, 19 May 2026 10:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 32. Sharon McMahon (We Are Mighty) & We Are the Ones We’ve Been Waiting For

Alexis Rice sits down with Sharon McMahon, bestselling author, educator, and creator of “@SharonSaysSo,” for a deeply moving conversation about history, democracy, courage, faith, and the ordinary people who shape the world around us.

As Sharon releases her new children’s book, We Are Mighty: 12 Ordinary Americans Who Did the Next Needed Thing, Alexis and Sharon explore figures of American history, some famous, some not, about the power of education, and what it means to continue doing good with no assurance of success. Together, they discuss Martin Luther King Jr., Maria de Lopez, Abraham Lincoln, Rosa Parks, Septima Clark, Clara Brown, and the everyday people whose unseen acts of courage changed generations.

This episode is a reminder that history is not only shaped by presidents, billionaires, or celebrities - but by teachers, neighbors, parents, organizers, and ordinary people willing to do the next needed thing.

💬 In This Episode

• Why “doing the next needed thing” can change history
• Stories behind We Are Mighty and The Small and the Mighty
• Martin Luther King Jr.’s struggle with depression and self-doubt
• Rosa Parks, Septima Clark, and the unseen roots of the Civil Rights Movement
• Clara Brown, faith, forgiveness, and resistance
• Why education is liberation
• The danger of Christian nationalism and authoritarianism
• The difference between performative religion and living compassionately
• Sharon’s canceled commencement speech, the political backlash, and how she's doing the next needed thing
• Why history gives hope during difficult times
• What teachers and ordinary citizens need to hear right now about the power of community
• Why courage rarely comes with assurance of success

Sharon reminds us that the people who change the world are rarely the loudest or the most powerful. More often, they are ordinary people choosing courage, compassion, education, and hope in moments when success is far from guaranteed.

And maybe that moment is ours now.

We Are Mighty for Kids, illustrated by @susannachapman, from @penguinrandomhouse is out May 19 https://sharonmcmahon.com/book

👥 People Mentioned

• Sarah Bessey: @sarahbessey
• Kate Bowler: @katecbowler
• Nadia Bolz-Weber: @sarcasticlutheran

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31. Jeremy Steele (United Methodist, Skeptic Pastor) - Stop Ceding Faith: Democrats & Media Need Progressive Pastors Now

Tue, 12 May 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 31. Jeremy Steele (United Methodist, Skeptic Pastor) - Stop Ceding Faith: Democrats and Media Need Progressive Pastors Now

Alexis sits down with Jeremy Steele (@skeptic.pastor), a United Methodist pastor, author, and self-described “deep skeptic,” for a bold, unfiltered conversation about faith, politics, and the stories shaping Christianity in America today.

Jeremy returns to The Sacred Slope to challenge some of the most widely held beliefs in evangelical spaces - including the rapture - and to name what’s really happening when extreme voices dominate the narrative. Together, Alexis and Jeremy unpack Christian nationalism, the absence of progressive faith voices in media and politics, and why that silence is creating a dangerous vacuum.

This episode is both a wake-up call and a clear invitation: if Democrats and media want to reach people of faith, they cannot keep ignoring progressive pastors. The voices exist. The audience is there. The moment is now.

💬 In This Episode

• Why the rapture isn’t supported by serious biblical scholarship
• How fear-based theology stays in our bodies even after deconstruction
• Christian nationalism and the “shock jock” effect in media
• Why Democrats and progressive media have ceded the language of faith
• A direct call: put progressive pastors and faith leaders on stage
• The gap between evangelical narratives and global Christianity
• Letting go of all-or-nothing faith frameworks
• Reclaiming spiritual practices and rituals after church hurt
• Why compassion is central to the teachings of Jesus

👥 People/Resources Mentioned

• Jeremy Steele: @skepticpastor | https://skepticpastor.com
• Rituals for Heretics: https://skepticpastor.com/rituals
• How to Not Suck as a Christian https://jeremy-steele.com/suck-book

• Dan McClellan: @maklelan
• Jennifer Garcia Bashaw: @jgbashaw
• The Bible for Normal People: @thebiblefornormalpeople
• Senator Raphael Warnock: @raphaelwarnock

• Jimmy Kimmel: @jimmykimmel
• Stephen Colbert: @stephenathome

• MSNow: @msnbc
• CNN: @cnn

• Don Lemon Show: @donlemonofficial

From calling out harmful theology to naming the silence in progressive spaces, Jeremy makes a compelling case: the rapture isn’t real, but the consequences of bad theology are. And if we don’t elevate better voices, we leave the loudest ones unchecked.

#Christianity #deconstruction #progressiveChristianity #ChristianNationalism #faithandpolitics #exvangelical #OpenAndAffirming #MentalHealth

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30. Christina Zini (United Methodist/Lutheran) - This Is What Christianity Looks Like When It’s Not About Control & The Sacred Slope turns 1!

Fri, 01 May 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 30. Christina Zini (United Methodist/Lutheran) - This Is What Christianity Looks Like When It’s Not About Control & The Sacred Slope Turns 1!!!!! With music by Derek Webb!

Alexis Rice sits down with Christina Zini, a friend of 20+ years, a leadership coach, Christian woman, global citizen, for a deeply personal and reflective conversation marking one year of The Sacred Slope.

Christina shares her journey of faith from growing up Lutheran in a small town in the US to living across the world and discovering a Christianity rooted not in control or coercion, but in love, openness, and deep respect for others. Together, Alexis and Christina explore what it actually looks like to follow Jesus in a complex and divided world.

They reflect on friendship, church, and culture, and what this past year of The Sacred Slope has revealed: that faith is far more expansive than many were taught, that people across religions are not enemies but neighbors, and that people are drawn to Jesus not by force, but by how we show up.

At the heart of this conversation is a powerful message: they are to know us by our love.

💬 In This Episode

• Celebrating one year of The Sacred Slope
• Growing up in Lutheran and Methodist traditions
• Faith shaped by global experiences and travel
• Church shopping and finding aligned community
• Why love matters more than conversion
• Respecting other religions while following Jesus
• Women’s leadership and agency in faith and life
• IVF, health decisions, and bodily autonomy
• Letting go of control and learning to trust God
• Navigating faith in a time of division
• Friendship as a spiritual anchor
• What it means to live out the fruit of the Spirit

💛 Thank you Derek Webb

A special thank you to Derek Webb @DerekWebb and his team for allowing me to use his music in this anniversary episode from his album, Survival Songs: https://www.derekwebb.com/dwdwdw/p/survival-songs-cd-digital-download

Derek was one of my first interviews and it was so healing: https://youtu.be/Gr-lWvMLj9A?si=GQR4mlKygpRMMf3U

💛 Support The Sacred Slope

If this podcast has meant something to you and you want to see more conversations like this:

☕ Buy Me a Coffee: https://buymeacoffee.com/thesacredslope
💛 Linktree to Venmo: https://linktr.ee/TheSacredSlope

Your support helps amplify voices, expand this community, and continue these conversations around the world.

#Christianity #deconstruction #OpenAndAffirming #MentalHealth

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29. Part 2. Reproductive Rights - Rev. jessica young chang (UCC): Faith, Freedom, and Who Gets to Decide

Sat, 25 Apr 2026 23:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 29. Part 2. Reproductive Rights - Rev. jessica young chang (UCC): Faith, Freedom, and Who Gets to Decide

A note:
This is so hard to talk about.

I was raised to believe this was the issue.
The line you could never cross.

And if you did… you were wrong.
You were evil.

So I get it. I really do.

But after listening to real stories…
and sitting with real people…
I realized this isn’t simple. It never was.

There’s more nuance here than we were told.

Alexis Rice sits down with rev. jessica young chang, a UCC minister and reproductive chaplain, for a compassionate conversation about faith, reproductive justice, and what it means to follow Jesus in complex, real-world situations.

Following Part 1 with Alexis’s childhood friend Valerie - a story of pregnancy, cancer, and survival - this episode moves into the pastoral and theological realities behind reproductive decisions.

This is a deeply emotional topic. For many Christians in the United States, this has been the defining political issue for over 40 years. Many have been taught that to think differently is to be wrong, sinful, or beyond redemption.

If you feel tension, grief, or resistance as you listen, you are not alone.

This episode does not tell you what to think.
It invites you to listen.

Together, they explore how faith, power, and the body intersect - and create space for those who have felt judged, silenced, or pushed out of the conversation.

At the heart of this episode is a grounding truth: nothing separates you from the love of God.

💬 In This Episode

• Reproductive chaplaincy & spiritual care
• Why this issue is not simple or binary
• What the Bible does/doesn't say about abortion
• Life begins at breath & personhood
• Power, politics, & Christian nationalism
• Pro-life vs anti-choice
• Why access reduces abortion rates
• Real-world consequences when care is restricted
• Grief, relief, & lived experiences
• Deconstructing faith while holding onto Jesus
• Navigating shame & inherited beliefs
• A prayer for healing & freedom

👥 THANK YOU to the following folks who allowed me to include their social media clips in this episode:

• Dan McClellan: @maklelan
• Tim Whitaker: @timwhitakerspeaks / @thenewevangelicals
• Mark Sandlin: @marksandlin / @progressivechristianity / @the_christian_left
• John Fugelsang: @johnfugelsang
• Jeremy Steele: @skeptic.pastor
• Heather Gardner: @heathergtv

📚 Organizations
Faith Aloud | Faith Choice Ohio @faithchoiceohio
Planned Parenthood @plannedparenthood

#Christianity #deconstruction #reproductiverights

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28. Part 1. Reproductive Rights: Valerie's Story - Pregnancy, Cancer, and a Life-or-Death Choice

Fri, 24 Apr 2026 03:00:00 -0000

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28. Part 1. Reproductive Rights: Valerie's Story - Pregnancy, Cancer, and a Life-or-Death Choice

Alexis sits down with her childhood friend Valerie Ruschke for a deeply personal and emotional conversation about reproductive rights, faith, and medical reality.

At 16 weeks pregnant, Valerie was diagnosed with aggressive Stage 3 HER2-positive breast cancer. Doctors told her she had less than a 10% chance of survival unless she terminated the pregnancy immediately to begin life-saving treatment.

This is Part 1 of a two-part series exploring reproductive rights, faith, and nuance.

Valerie shares what it was like to face that decision in real time - the physical pain, the emotional weight, and the lasting impact. She opens up about what followed: chemotherapy, loss, survival, recurrence, and ultimately building her family through surrogacy.

This episode moves beyond political talking points and into lived experience. It challenges assumptions about abortion, highlights the realities of maternal health, and reminds us that these decisions are not theoretical - they are deeply human.

💬 In This Episode

• How Judaism teaches that the life and well-being of the mother takes precedence in pregnancy

• A real story of abortion and cancer during pregnancy
• What happens when treatment cannot wait
• The physical and emotional reality of termination
• How faith and personal values shape complex decisions
• The medical realities often missing from public conversations
• Why this issue is not simple within Christianity or any faith
• How policy decisions impact real families and outcomes

@valroosh

🎧 Coming in Part 2

In Part 2, Alexis speaks with Reverend jessica young chang and shares perspectives from clergy, theologians, and leaders wrestling with reproductive rights, faith, and care in their communities.

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27. Mattie Mae Motl (Bible Scholar, Christian) - Loving Jesus Too Much to Let Him Be Weaponized

Sat, 18 Apr 2026 21:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 27. Mattie Mae Motl (Bible Scholar) - Loving Jesus Too Much to Let Him Be Weaponized

Alexis Rice sits down with Mattie Mae Motl, a Bible scholar, theologian, and PhD candidate studying the New Testament (with a focus on Romans), for a powerful and deeply clarifying conversation about biblical scholarship, deconstruction, and reclaiming faith.

Mattie Mae Motl shares her story of growing up Southern Baptist, falling in love with Scripture, and pursuing rigorous academic study not to dismantle faith—but to protect it. Together, they explore the gap between academia and the church, the misuse of Scripture in modern culture, and why asking better questions doesn’t weaken faith - it deepens it.

At the heart of this conversation is a bold truth: loving Jesus deeply means refusing to let Him be used as a tool for harm.

💬 In This Episode

• Growing up in conservative Christianity and loving the Bible deeply
• What biblical scholars actually do (and what they don’t do)
• Why context matters when reading Scripture
• The difference between theologians and Bible scholars
• Disputed vs. undisputed Pauline letters
• Women in the early church and leadership in Romans 16
• Why 1 Timothy conflicts with Paul’s authentic voice
• The gap between academia and the church
• Elitism vs. anti-intellectualism in faith spaces
• Why doubt and questions are essential to faith
• The rise of toxic masculinity and the manosphere
• How Scripture is misused to support patriarchy
• What Jesus and Paul actually model about power and humility
• Encouragement for women navigating faith and dating today
• Finding healing in liturgical and inclusive church spaces
• Why representation matters more than having all the answers

👥 People/Resources Mentioned

• Mattie Mae Motl: @mattiemaemotl
• Rachel Held Evans: @rachelheldevans
• R. F. Kuang: @kuangrf

📚 Topics to Explore Further

• Biblical scholarship vs theology
• How to read the Bible in historical context
• Women in early Christianity
• LGBTQ Christianity
• Toxic masculinity and Christianity
• Progressive Christianity
• Queer theology
• Christian nationalism

#Christianity #deconstruction #ProgressiveChristianity #BibleScholar #BiblicalLiteracy #QueerTheology #WomenInMinistry #FaithAfterEvangelicalism #ChurchHurt #Reconstruction

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26. Justin Telthorst (Catholic, Empty Chairs) - A Gay Catholic on Faith, the Pope, and the Empty Seats in the Church

Mon, 13 Apr 2026 13:00:00 -0000

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26. Justin Telthorst (Catholic, Empty Chairs) - A Gay Catholic on Faith, the Pope, and the Empty Seats in the Church

💬 In This Episode

👥 People/Resources Mentioned

#Catholicism #Christianity #deconstruction #reconstruction #LGBTQChristianity #GayCatholic #ProgressiveChristianity #QueerTheology #ChurchHurt #Catholic #1946TheMovie #LGBT #LGBTQ #emptychairs

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25. Andrew Whitehead (Sociologist, Author, Christian) - American Idolatry: How Christian Nationalism Betrays the Gospel and Threatens the Church

Fri, 10 Apr 2026 20:00:00 -0000

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25. Andrew Whitehead (Sociologist, Author, Christian) - American Idolatry: How Christian Nationalism Betrays the Gospel and Threatens the Church

Andrew Whitehead joins Alexis Rice for a powerful conversation on Christian nationalism and the ways it shapes faith, identity, and public life.

Alexis and Andrew explore what Christian nationalism actually is (and isn’t), how it shows up in everyday spaces, and why it can be so difficult to recognize - even for those inside the church.

Drawing from American Idolatry, Andrew names the deeper forces at work and invites listeners to examine how power, fear, and identity can distort faith.

American Idolatry: How Christian Nationalism Betrays the Gospel and Threatens the Church
https://a.co/d/02lo2xUn

💬 In This Episode

• What Christian nationalism is - and why it’s often misunderstood
• The “American flag in the sanctuary” test
• Power, fear, and violence as central forces
• Why Christian nationalism isn’t a binary - and how many people fall in the middle
• The Seven Mountain Mandate and dominion theology
• How questions - not arguments - can open real change
• Why this movement impacts everyone, regardless of belief

👥 People/Resources Mentioned

Andrew Whitehead: @ndrewwhitehead
April Ajoy: @aprilajoy
Star-Spangled Jesus
Jemar Tisby: @jemartisby
Kristin Kobes Du Mez: @kkdumez

#Christianity #deconstruction #ChristianNationalism #FaithAndPolitics #ProgressiveChristianity

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24. Julie (Aakadewin-o Waawaashkeshi Kwe ) Francella (Ojibwe, Batchewana First Nation) - We’re Still Here: Indigenous Wisdom, Empathy, & the Wounds Beneath Hate

Wed, 08 Apr 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 24. Julie (Aakadewin-o Waawaashkeshi Kwe) Francella (Ojibwe, Batchewana First Nation) - We’re Still Here: Indigenous Wisdom, Empathy, & the Wounds Beneath Hate

Alexis sits down with Julie (Aakadewin-o Waawaashkeshi Kwe) Francella - an Ojibwe professor of Indigenous Studies, mental health professional, writer, artist, and @SiriusXM co-host, for a powerful conversation on Indigenous wisdom, trauma, empathy, and staying human in a brutal time.

Julie shares how she walks between worlds without losing her center - rooted in Anishinaabe ways of knowing while navigating Catholic education, psychology, trauma work, and advocacy. Together, they explore what Christian listeners can learn about love of neighbor, care for the earth, humility, and shared humanity.

They discuss Ribbon Skirt Day, Two-Spirit sacredness, survivors of sexual violence, parenting with curiosity, and why hate grows from fear, shame, pain, and the hunger to belong. Julie offers a framework: boundaries matter - but transformation requires understanding the wound beneath behavior.

Also, who makes a surprise cameo?

They also dive into:
• Indigenous teachings on relationality and Mother Earth
• What Christians misunderstand about colonization
• How survivors calculate the risk of speaking up
• Why Two-Spirit people were seen as sacred
• What parents can teach their kids
• Why curiosity matters more than certainty

The episode closes with a reminder: hope is a practice. Indigenous people have been resisting for over 500 years - and they are still here.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Hate reveals disconnection, not irredeemability
• Boundaries matter, but understanding interrupts harm
• Indigenous peoples were never spiritually empty
• Two-Spirit identity has long been sacred
• Curiosity and humility are essential to healing
• Hope is something we practice

📚 Resources & Voices Mentioned
• Julie Francella - The Fire I Keep on Substack - https://substack.com/@juliefrancella
• We’re Still Here with Simon Moya-Smith @simonsaidtakeapic on the @johnfugelsang Show: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-john-fugelsang-podcast/id1464094232
• Separation of Church and Hate by John Fugelsang
• 1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture - @1946themovie
• Dolores Huerta @doloreshuerta

#deconstruction #IndigenousWisdom

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23. Kristin Mockler Young (Non-Denominational Pastor) - The Other Side of Certainty

Sat, 04 Apr 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 23. Kristin Mockler Young (Non-Denominational Pastor) - The Other Side of Certainty

What if losing certainty isn’t losing your faith… but the beginning of a deeper one?

Alexis sits down with Pastor Kristin Mockler Young @kristinmockleryoung, teaching pastor at Mosaic Church @mosaicclt, host of the Becoming Church podcast , and author of the upcoming book, The Other Side of Certainty, to explore what happens when the version of Christianity you were given no longer fits.

Kristin shares her journey from lifelong “church girl” to pastor, all while deconstructing in real time. Together, they unpack what it means to hold onto Jesus while questioning everything else, and why doubt might not be the enemy we were taught it was.

They explore how rigid certainty can limit our understanding of God, and how freedom, humility, and curiosity can open the door to a more expansive, honest, and deeply rooted faith. Kristin shares why she’s still a Christian, what she had to unlearn, and how she now pastors people far beyond the walls of a church.

They also dive into:
• What’s on the other side of deconstruction
• How to find a healthy, safe church
• Faith, politics, and holding compassion with conviction
• Parenting kids through faith without rigid answers
• Why curiosity and compassion matter more than control

The episode closes with a powerful prayer for anyone feeling disenchanted, alone, or unsure where they belong.

This episode is for anyone exploring:
progressive Christianity, deconstruction, faith after evangelicalism, Christian nationalism, church hurt, or rebuilding faith.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Certainty is not the same as truth
• Deconstruction can lead to deeper faith
• You don’t have to abandon Jesus to question systems
• Healthy faith makes space for questions
• Compassion and curiosity can lead to transformation

📚 Resources & Voices Mentioned
• The Other Side of Certainty (pre-order): https://a.co/d/03RMF1CU
• Rachel Held Evans @rachelheldevans
• Pete Enns @peteenns
• Sarah Bessey @sarahbessey
• John Fugelsang @johnfugelsang
• Meredith Ann Miller @meredithannmiller

Becoming Church Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/becoming-church/id1606553800

#Christianity #deconstruction #reconstruction

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22. Rev. Brandan Robertson (Progressive Pastor) - Queer & Christian: Reclaiming the Bible, Our Faith, and Our Place at the Table

Wed, 01 Apr 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 22. Rev. Brandan Robertson (Progressive Pastor) - Queer & Christian: Reclaiming the Bible, Our Faith, and Our Place at the Table

What if being queer and Christian was never the contradiction you were taught it was?

Alexis sits down with Rev. Brandan Robertson, pastor, activist, and author of Queer & Christian, to explore how scripture has been misunderstood, weaponized, and reclaimed.

This conversation reframes the Bible not as a rulebook, but as a complex, ancient library inviting curiosity, wrestling, and growth.

The episode closes with a powerful prayer for anyone who has felt rejected, afraid, or cut off from the love of God.

This episode is for anyone exploring:
progressive Christianity, LGBTQ Christianity, queer theology, biblical interpretation, deconstruction, faith after evangelicalism, or healing from church hurt.

About Our Guest
Rev. Brandan Robertson (@brandanrobertson) is a pastor, activist, and author of Queer & Christian. He is a PhD candidate in New Testament at Drew University (@drewuniversity).

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21. Johanna Ta (Catholic) - Faith, Culture, & The Golden Rule

Sat, 28 Mar 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 21. Johanna Ta (Catholic) - Faith, Culture, & The Golden Rule

What happens when two friends from different Christian traditions choose curiosity over debate?

Alexis sits down with her longtime friend Johanna Ta, a Filipino Chinese American Catholic, mother of three, and Bay Area professional, to explore faith, culture, and the real differences - and surprising similarities - between Catholicism and Protestantism.

Johanna shares her story of being baptized as a newborn during a life-threatening health crisis, growing up in Catholic school, and how her faith has evolved through motherhood, cultural identity, and lived experience.

Together, they unpack common misconceptions about Catholics, the role of the Pope, and what it actually means to live a Christ-like life in today’s world.

They also explore:

Catholic vs Protestant beliefs and practices
Faith as culture, identity, and community
Parenting through the lens of the Golden Rule
Immigration, empathy, and political Christianity

Johanna offers a grounded and deeply human perspective on faith:

“Who am I to judge? The best I can do is live in a way that brings others along in a positive light.”

As the conversation turns to the state of Christianity today, they wrestle with rising division, racism, and the concept of “toxic empathy,” returning again and again to the core of Jesus’s teaching - love your neighbor.

Johanna reflects:

“Maybe this is our test… how do we continue to live Christ-like despite all these challenges?”

They also discuss the global Catholic Church, the leadership of @vaticannews and Pope Leo (@pontifex), and the cultural expression of faith in unexpected places - including the viral “raves of peace” by @padre.guilherme.

This episode is not a debate - it’s a bridge. A conversation rooted in humility, curiosity, and the belief that we can learn from each other across traditions.

💡 Key Takeaways

• Catholics and Protestants share more common ground than many realize
• Faith is deeply tied to culture, family, and community
• Being Christ-like is about daily practice, not perfection
• Empathy is central to the teachings of Jesus
• Curiosity can replace defensiveness in conversations about faith

About Our Guest

Johanna Ta is a Filipino Chinese American Catholic, mother of three, and Bay Area professional. Her faith is shaped by culture, community, and a deep commitment to living out the Golden Rule.

🌍 The Sacred Slope is now in 60+ countries and 1,300+ cities, sharing diverse voices of faith beyond one dominant lens.

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20. Jeremy Jernigan (Former Non-Denominational Megachurch Pastor) - The Edge of the Inside

Wed, 25 Mar 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 20. Jeremy Jernigan (Former Non-Denominational Megachurch Pastor) - The Edge of the Inside

What happens when the church that formed you becomes the place that wounds you?

Alexis sits down with Jeremy Jernigan @jeremyjernigan, former megachurch pastor, now part of a Mennonite community, host of Cabernet and Pray and Rebuilding Faith, and author of The Edge of the Inside, to explore what it means to deconstruct faith without losing Jesus.

Jeremy shares his journey out of evangelical megachurch leadership, including the breaking point many experienced as white evangelical support for Trump exposed a disconnect between the teachings of Jesus and what was being lived out.

They unpack deconstruction, post-evangelical faith, church hurt, and the cost of using your voice when your community would rather you stay silent. Jeremy shares what it was like to lose his job, relationships, and community—and how that loss led to a more honest, compassionate faith.

They explore why many are not leaving Jesus, but leaving systems rooted in certainty, control, and power. Jeremy introduces “the edge of the inside”—a space for those who still love Jesus but no longer fit in the center—and how Mennonite theology is helping him heal.

This episode includes a powerful prayer for anyone who feels alone, displaced, or hasn’t been prayed over in a long time.

This episode is for anyone navigating deconstruction, progressive Christianity, LGBTQ Christianity, church hurt, Christian nationalism, or faith after evangelicalism.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Deconstruction can be the fruit of faith
• Many left church because it no longer looked like Jesus
• Certainty and control often replace compassion
• There is space to follow Jesus outside the center
• Healing can happen in new spiritual communities

About Our Guest
Jeremy Jernigan @jeremyjernigan is a former megachurch pastor, now connected with a Mennonite community. He hosts Cabernet and Pray and Rebuilding Faith and is the author of The Edge of the Inside.

🎧 Podcasts
Cabernet and Pray @cabernetandpray
Rebuilding Faith

📖 Book
The Edge of the Inside: https://www.jeremyjernigan.com/edge-of-the-inside

👤 Voices Mentioned
Richard Rohr
Tim Whitaker @timwhitakerspeaks

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19. Podcastathon 2026 - IJM, Pastor Sarah (UCC), Rev. Joseph Yoo (Episcopal), Pastor Joe Smith (Post-Evangelical), Rev. Joe Graves (United Methodist)

Sat, 21 Mar 2026 05:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 19. Podcastathon 2026 - IJM, Pastor Sarah (UCC), Rev. Joseph Yoo (Episcopal), Pastor Joe Smith (Post-Evangelical), Rev. Joe Graves (United Methodist)

This episode means a lot to me. I wanted to highlight one of my favorite non-profits along with ministries from beloved pastors returning to The Sacred Slope to share the incredible work churches are doing.

- Alexis Rice

Alexis brings together global and local expressions of justice in this special Podcastathon (https://podcasthon.org/, @podcasthon_en) episode - featuring International Justice Mission (IJM) (one of my favorite organizations) and the return of some of your favorite Sacred Slope pastors.

Alexis speaks with Miguel Lau, Global Senior Officer, Church Partnerships at International Justice Mission (IJM) to explore human trafficking, forced labor, and violence against the poor - and how justice systems can be transformed to protect millions.

🌍 International Justice Mission (IJM): https://www.ijm.org

Then, some of your favorite pastors across the U.S. return to The Sacred Slope to share about some of their church ministries in their communities.

Pastor Sarah (UCC - New Mexico)
IG: @disorganized.religion Church: https://ucccogs.org/leadership/pastor-sarah/
Casa Q (LGBTQ youth shelter): https://www.casaq.org
Mutual Aid Albuquerque: IG @abqmutualaid

YouTube Episode on The Sacred Slope: https://youtu.be/pwzPGpcdVsA?si=LkYFIuOpX8P1W-W8

Rev. Joseph Yoo (Episcopal - Pearland, TX)
IG: @joseph.yoo Church: https://www.mosaicpearland.org/
Impact Offering (school lunch debt relief)

YouTube Episode on The Sacred Slope: https://youtu.be/ODnIUKfRdpU?si=Nv8sD5lP20CAlx9V

Pastor Joe Smith (Post-evangelical - Gainesville, FL)
IG: @therealjoe.smith Church: https://shiftgnv.com/all-things-shift
Santa Fe College Food Pantry
Pride Community Center of North Central Florida
Unspoken Treasure Society: https://www.unspokensociety.org/

YouTube Episode on The Sacred Slope: https://youtu.be/TwspO3sPlsc?si=wKfEnxj1XR3DSuYy

Rev. Joe Graves (United Methodist - Ohio)
IG: @josephdavidgraves Church: https://cityviewcolumbus.org/staff

Feminine Resources Free Store: https://cityviewcolumbus.org/feminine-resources-free-store

Mothers of Murdered Children: https://www.mothersofmurderedcolumbuschildren.com/

YouTube Episode on The Sacred Slope: https://youtu.be/dXsz93ron-Q?si=1gdg5M7RuXJU1_Y0

Across every conversation, one theme emerges: we can't fix everything - but we can do something.

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18. Rocky Roggio (Director, 1946: The Movie) - The Year the Word “Homosexual” Entered the Bible

Wed, 18 Mar 2026 08:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 18. Rocky Roggio (Director, 1946: The Movie) - 1946: The Year the Word “Homosexual” Entered the Bible

One mistranslation changed theology, policy, families, and the lives of millions of LGBTQ people.

Alexis sits down with Rocky Roggio @rockyroggio, director of the award-winning documentary 1946: The Movie @1946themovie, to explore the year the word “homosexual” first appeared in an English Bible and how that translation decision reshaped theology, culture, and public policy for generations.

They unpack the historical research behind the film, including discoveries in the Yale archives surrounding the 1946 Revised Standard Version Bible translation. Rocky explains how one translation decision helped shape decades of church teaching and influence modern debates around LGBTQ Christianity and Bible translation.

Rocky also shares the personal story behind the film, including the decision to include her own father, a minister, in the documentary. Their conversations reveal how theology is never abstract - it shows up in families, churches, and real relationships.

Alexis and Rocky discuss why the film resonates with audiences across the political and theological spectrum and why understanding Bible translation history, queer theology, progressive Christianity, and Christian nationalism matters right now.

This episode is for anyone - Christian or not, queer or not - who cares about truth, history, and how sacred texts are interpreted and sometimes weaponized.

💡 Key Takeaways

• The word “homosexual” first appeared in an English Bible in 1946
• Bible translation decisions can shape theology and culture for generations
• Scripture can inspire justice or be used to justify harm
• Biblical literacy matters in conversations about Christian nationalism and LGBTQ inclusion

About Our Guest

Rocky Roggio is the director of 1946: The Movie, an award-winning documentary investigating how the word “homosexual” first entered the English Bible and how that translation shaped modern debates around LGBTQ Christianity.

🎬 Watch the film

Best way to support the filmmakers (independent streaming platform):
https://watch.eventive.org/1946themovie

🌍 Projects & Organizations Mentioned

The Living Wall of Love - Jarko’s project featured at World Pride Amsterdam
https://growingwalloflove.com

Making Things Right (LGBTQ Christian reconciliation resource)
https://makingthingsright.org

Clips used with permission from Rocky Roggio of 1946

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17. Pastor Kristian A. Smith (Liberation Theology) - The Courage to Question Your Answers

Sat, 14 Mar 2026 18:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 17. Pastor Kristian A. Smith (Liberation Theology) – The Courage to Question Your Answers

Alexis Rice sits down with Pastor Kristian A. Smith — pastor, author, educator, public theologian, and host of Holy Smokes: Cigars and Spirituality — for a deeply honest and pastoral conversation about doctrine, certainty, doubt, and what it means to rebuild faith with integrity.

Kristian leads The Faith Community, a digital church centered around curiosity, justice, and what he calls Greatest Commandment Theology — the idea that Jesus’ call to love God, love neighbor, and love self should guide how we interpret everything else in our Christian tradition.

Together Alexis and Kristian explore why doctrine is not the same thing as scripture, how the Bible has historically been used to justify radically different moral positions, and why losing religious certainty can feel like grief. Kristian shares why doubt is not the enemy of faith and why love must remain the center of theology.

Kristian closes the episode with a powerful pastoral prayer for listeners who may not have been prayed over in a long time.

💡 Key Takeaways

• Doctrine often reflects interpretation, not absolute certainty
• “The Bible says” is often shorthand for “my tradition interprets it this way”
• Losing religious certainty can bring real grief
• Doubt is not the opposite of faith - it is part of faith

About Our Guest

Pastor Kristian A. Smith is a pastor, author, educator, and public theologian.
He is the founding pastor of The Faith Community and host of Holy Smokes: Cigars and Spirituality.

IG: @thekristianasmith

📚 Books, People & Resources Mentioned

Kristian A. Smith — IG: @thekristianasmith
The Faith Community — IG: @tfc.virtual
Holy Smokes: Cigars & Spirituality — IG: @holysmokesmovement

Books: Breaking All the Rules – An Ancient Framework for Modern Faith & Question your answers: https://www.kristianasmith.com

Dan McClellan — IG: @maklelan
Pete Enns — IG: @peteenns
Rachel Held Evans — IG: @rachelheldevans

Frederick Buechner — theologian and author
https://www.frederickbuechner.com

Martin Luther King Jr. — pastor and civil rights leader
https://kinginstitute.stanford.edu

#Christianity #deconstruction #OpenAndAffirming #LiberationTheology #FaithAfterEvangelicalism #ProgressiveChristianity #TheSacredSlope

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16. Tripp Fuller (Theologian, Pastor & Keeper of Chickens) - Deconstruction Can Be Holy, Healing, and Even Joyful

Thu, 12 Mar 2026 16:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 16. Tripp Fuller (Theologian, Pastor & Keeper of Chickens) - Deconstruction Can Be Holy, Healing, and Even Joyful

Alexis Rice sits down with Tripp Fuller - host of Homebrewed Christianity, founder of Theology Beer Camp, theologian, pastor, and author for a rich, funny, deeply pastoral conversation about faith after certainty.

Together they explore why deconstruction does not have to mean losing God, how harmful theology can be unlearned, why questions can be sacred, and how people can reconnect with the divine without fear, shame, or rigid literalism.

This episode is for anyone rethinking faith, grieving harmful theology, raising kids after evangelicalism, or longing to believe that the sacred slope can still lead somewhere beautiful.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Deconstruction can be painful - but also freeing, joyful, and holy
• Certainty is not the same thing as faith
• Centering prayer can help people reconnect with God after spiritual harm
• Scripture can be read with wonder, honesty, and less fear
• Kids need room for questions, ritual, and belonging - not rigid answers
• The Spirit may be present even in the questions that unsettle us

About Our Guest
Tripp Fuller is a theologian, pastor, podcast host, and founder of Homebrewed Christianity and Theology Beer Camp.
IG: @trippfuller
Homebrewed Christianity: @theologynerd
Theology Beer Camp: @theologybeercamp

📚 Books, People & Resources Mentioned
God After Deconstruction by Tripp Fuller & Thomas Jay Oord:
https://a.co/d/03BF15TP

Theology Beer Camp 2026- I'll be there- are you coming?
Kansas City, Missouri
October 8–10, 2026
https://www.homebrewedchristianty.com/theology-beer-camp/

Thomas Jay Oord — IG: @thomasjayoord
Brian McLaren — IG: @brian_mclaren
Rachel Held Evans — IG: @rachelheldevans
Pete Enns — IG: @peteenns

#Deconstruction #ProgressiveChristianity #Christianity #FaithAfterEvangelicalism #Exvangelical #Theology #CenteringPrayer #OpenAndRelationalTheology #TheSacredSlope #TrippFuller

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15. Rabbi Lexi Erdheim (Judaism) & Rev. Joel Simpson (Methodist) – When Faith Leaders Protect the Vulnerable Together

Sun, 08 Mar 2026 00:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 15. Rabbi Lexi Erdheim (Judaism) & Rev. Joel Simpson (Methodist) – When Faith Leaders Protect the Vulnerable Together

Alexis Rice sits down with Rabbi Lexi Erdheim and Rev. Joel Simpson—two faith leaders from different traditions whose friendship models curiosity, respect, and shared moral responsibility.

Together they explore what interfaith relationships can teach us about protecting the vulnerable, listening across real differences, and showing up for neighbors in moments of crisis.

This conversation is about friendship, moral courage, and the kind of world that becomes possible when faith traditions work side by side to protect human dignity.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Interfaith relationships deepen empathy
• Faith traditions share a call to protect the vulnerable
• Scripture can be weaponized—or inspire compassion
• Real change begins with relationships across difference
• Curiosity and humility strengthen collaboration
• Faith leaders can help communities resist fear and polarization

About Our Guests

Rabbi Lexi Erdheim is the Associate Rabbi at Temple Beth-El in Charlotte, NC. Ordained at Hebrew Union College and a graduate of Barnard College, she works at the intersection of Jewish life, public policy, and interfaith organizing.

Temple Beth-El Charlotte
IG/FB/TikTok: @tbeclt
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/jewtubecharlotte

Rev. Joel Simpson is a Methodist pastor at First United Methodist Church in Taylorsville, NC and a doctoral student at Duke University. His work connects faith, community organizing, and advocacy for vulnerable communities.

IG: @joelrsimpson
FB: @joel.simpson.98
Substack: @joelsimpson

📚 People & Organizations Mentioned

Siembra NC — IG: @siembranc
Carolina Jews for Justice — IG: @carolinajewsforjustice
Repairers of the Breach — IG: @repairersofthebreach
Rev. Dr. William Barber — IG: @revbwilliambarber2
Jonathan Wilson-Hartgrove — IG: @jonathanwilsonhartgrove
Shane Claiborne — IG: @shaneclaiborne
Barbara Brown Taylor — https://barbarabrowntaylor.com/
Rabbi Sandra Lawson — IG: @rabbisandralawson

Duke University — IG: @dukeuniversity
Candler School of Theology (Emory) — IG: @candler_school
Hebrew Union College — IG: @hebrewunioncollege
Barnard College — IG: @barnardcollege

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14. William Gibson (Church of Scotland) – When Christianity Gets Co-Opted by Power

Thu, 05 Mar 2026 06:00:00 -0000

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14. William Gibson (Church of Scotland) – When Christianity Gets Co-Opted by Power

What does American Christian nationalism look like… from Scotland?

In this episode, Alexis Rice is joined by William Gibson - a Scottish church historian and soon-to-be minister in the Church of Scotland - to zoom out of the American bubble and name what many outside the U.S. can see so clearly: when Christianity gets fused with nationalism, it becomes a weapon.

William doesn’t just critique - he offers language, history, and hopeful resistance: collective action, ecumenical courage, and a faith that refuses empire.

If you’ve been watching “Christianity” used to justify cruelty and thinking, This cannot be Jesus… this conversation is for you.

🎙️ About Our Guest
William Gibson is a PhD student in Theology & Religious Studies at the University of Glasgow and a candidate for ministry in the Church of Scotland. His work focuses on modern church history, mission, and the way faith intersects with power, economics, and community life - including trade unions, labor, and Christian ethics.
Find William: @williamgibsongla

💬 In This Episode
• How American Christian nationalism is perceived globally
• Why “Christian symbolism” at nationalist rallies is alarming
• The Church of Scotland: broad, Presbyterian, Reformed - without U.S.-style fundamentalism
• Christianity as culturally mediated (and why that matters)
• Capitalism, greed, solidarity - and the Bible’s uncomfortable clarity
• Bonhoeffer, Niemöller, and what Christian resistance really costs
• A prayer for the spiritually tender and spiritually tired

📚 Resources + Verified Instagram Handles
• Church of Scotland - @churchofscotland
• The Iona Community - @ionacommunity
• Wild Goose Publications (Iona books) - @ionabooks
• Awake, Emerging, and Connected (publisher) - @scm_press
• Student Christian Movement (UK) - @studentchristianmovement
• World Communion of Reformed Churches - @reformed_communion
• Trinity College Glasgow - @trinitycollegeglasgow
• Lamorna Ash - @lamornaaash
• The Sacred Slope - @thesacredslope

#Christianity #deconstruction #OpenAndAffirming #MentalHealth #ChurchOfScotland #Scotland #ProgressiveChristianity #Exvangelical

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13. Jared Byas (The Bible for Normal People) – Taking the Bible Seriously But Not Literally

Mon, 02 Mar 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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13. Jared Byas (The Bible for Normal People) – Taking the Bible Seriously But Not Literally

Alexis sits down with Jared Byas - co-host of The Bible for Normal People (along with Pete Enns) and author of Love Matters More — to explore what it really means to take Scripture seriously. For many of us raised in evangelical spaces, we were taught that taking the Bible seriously meant taking it literally. But what happens when reading closely actually raises more questions? When you see the “wrinkles” and the humanity in the text? When certainty starts to crack?

💬 In This Episode

• “Taking the Bible seriously will inevitably lead you to not take it literally”
• The “wrinkles” in Scripture - and choosing intimacy over perfection
• Why “speaking the truth in love” often becomes a power move
• Paul’s black swan moment and theological transformation
• Fear vs. love in Christian formation
• Rebuilding trust in the Bible after church harm
• Parenting with curiosity instead of control
• For the spiritually tender: you’re not backsliding - you’re paying attention

👥 People/Resources Mentioned

Jared Byas: @jaredbyas
The Bible for Normal People: @biblefornormalpeople
Pete Enns: @peteenns
Curious Faith Media: @curiousfaithmedia
Rachel Held Evans: @rachelheldevans

Love Matters More by Jared Byas: https://www.jaredbyas.com

God's Stories as told by God's Children: https://a.co/d/087F8ZFN

God's Stories as told by God's Children for Adults: https://a.co/d/0fteC7QR

#Christianity #deconstruction #reconstruction #Christian

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12. Rachel Held Evans (Braving the Truth) with Sarah Bessey

Wed, 25 Feb 2026 03:00:00 -0000

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12. Rachel Held Evans (Braving the Truth) with Sarah Bessey

Sarah Bessey joins Alexis Rice for a special release-day episode honoring Braving the Truth by Rachel Held Evans - out now.

Alexis and Sarah read from Rachel's book, reflect on holy anger, spiritual wilderness, life after evangelicalism many are living in real time, and why Rachel’s voice feels less like nostalgia and more like necessity.

Braving The Truth from @HarperCollins
https://www.harpercollins.com/products/braving-the-truth-rachel-held-evans

💬 In This Episode

• Reading: “Life After Evangelicalism” (originally posted Nov 14, 2016)
• Sarah on editing Rachel’s work: grief, time travel, and why this book feels like a gift “from the past for the future of the church”
• Reading: “Why I Can’t Stay Angry Even Though I Want To”
• Women, power, patriarchy — and why Rachel’s work was truly threatening (because it was making change)
• For the spiritually tender: you belong, and “there’s always room for more”

👥 People/Resources Mentioned

Rachel Held Evans: @rachelheldevans
Sarah Bessey: @sarahbessey
Evolving Faith: @evolvfaith
Glennon Doyle: @glennondoyle
Jen Hatmaker: @jenhatmaker
Jeff Chu: @jeffchu
Matthew Paul Turner: @matthewpaulturner
Brian McLaren: @brianmclaren
Pete Enns: @peteenns
Dan McClellan: @maklelan

🎙 Credits: “Come Thou Fount” used with permission by Sara Groves @grovesroad

#Christianity #deconstruction #RachelHeldEvans #BravingTheTruth

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11. Seth A. Cain (Non-Denominational) - Deconstructing While Leading

Sun, 22 Feb 2026 07:00:00 -0000

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11. Seth A. Cain (Non-Denominational) - Deconstructing While Leading

In this raw conversation, Alexis Rice sits down with Seth A. Cain - a former non-denominational lead pastor (14+ years) whose ministry came to a breaking point when he was asked to resign after being open to performing a same-sex wedding.

Before we begin: to the pastors who are deconstructing - especially in American non-denominational spaces - I see you. When a pastor deconstructs, it’s not only grief. It can be livelihood on the line: reputation, housing, healthcare, decades of relationships, and the identity you built your life around.

The Sacred Slope is listened to in 50+ countries because Christianity doesn’t belong to one nation, one political party, or one expression. This is a space for the curious, the deconstructing, and the reconstructing - where LGBTQ+ inclusion is safe, women in leadership are affirmed, and we believe God loves all people with dignity and worth.

💬 In this episode:
• How Seth was “preaching love and acceptance” without being direct — until a real-life moment demanded integrity
• The phone call that changed everything: “Just pencil me in and I’ll figure out the rest”
• The cost of saying yes - and the heartbreak of “all are welcome” with a no-fly zone
• “Transcend and include,” deconstruction in real time, and why certainty can feel like “pillars in quicksand”
• A closing prayer for anyone who feels unseen, isolated, or rejected by church spaces

👤 About Our Guest
Seth A. Cain is a writer, speaker, and former pastor. “Everything is like Seth Andrew Cain,” including Instagram, TikTok, and Facebook. (@sethandrewcain)

🔗 Links & Resources (Books + Seth Online)

Seth links (all platforms):
https://linktr.ee/sethacain

“But How’d You Get There?” (YouTube channel / playlist):
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCio30AwkmXzEwhAYoDtUKYA

To Give the Universe a Hug (book):
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0FMNRGBDC

Life Is Beautiful (book):
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09WH56B9F

#Christianity #deconstruction #OpenAndAffirming #MentalHealth #ProgressiveChristianity #ProgressiveClergy #ChurchHurt #Exvangelical #LGBTQ #WomenInMinistry

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10. Rev. Dr. Sarah Townes aka Pastor Sarah of Disorganized Religion (UCC) - Faith That Resists Empire

Wed, 18 Feb 2026 08:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 10. Rev. Dr. Sarah Townes aka Pastor Sarah of Disorganized Religion (UCC) — Faith That Resists Empire

Rev. Dr. Sarah Townes is helping thousands rediscover a Christianity rooted not in power — but in conscience, community, and courage.

In this episode, Alexis Rice sits down with UCC pastor, organizer, and digital ministry leader Rev. Dr. Sarah Townes, known online as Pastor Sarah of @disorganized.religion, to explore a version of Christianity many people were never taught: Christian resistance — protecting the vulnerable, building community, and telling a truer story than empire tells.

Drawing from scripture, church history, and modern organizing, Pastor Sarah shows how Christian resistance spans centuries — from early church movements to global resistance stories to modern mutual aid and faith-rooted organizing.

Together, Alexis and Sarah explore today’s spiritual hunger for faith spaces where certain questions are not dismissed as "doubts", dignity is protected, and belief is lived through action. They also discuss digital church spaces — from livestream congregations to Discord-based communities — and how online faith spaces are becoming lifelines for people healing from church harm, navigating deconstruction, or seeking belonging outside traditional church structures.

Stay through the end for Pastor Sarah’s blessing for those rebuilding faith after spiritual harm.

👤 About Our Guest
Rev. Dr. Sarah Townes is a United Church of Christ pastor serving Church of the Shepherd (Albuquerque, NM). She helps people explore progressive Christianity, deconstruction, and justice-rooted faith through digital ministry.

🔗 Resources Mentioned

*The Bible For Normal People @biblefornormalpeople

*1946 the movie @1946themovie with Director @rockyroggio

*Checkpoint Church (Digital / Discord church)
https://www.checkpointchurch.com/
@checkpointchurch

*#ProgressiveClergy

*Riverside Church (NYC Digital Ministry) https://www.trcnyc.org/
@riversidechurchnyc

*Convergence Digital Ministry Fellowship
https://convergenceus.org/digital-ministry-fellows/
@convergenceus

*James Talarico @jamestalarico on @stephencolbert (both Christians, Stephen- Catholic, James- United Methodist, both progressive)

🕊️ Stay to the end for Pastor Sarah’s blessing for a reconstructing faith.

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9. David Clayton - (He's not MAGA, please don't scroll. He's got a moral compass and a soul.)

Mon, 16 Feb 2026 03:00:00 -0000

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9. David Clayton - (He's not MAGA, please don't scroll. He's got a moral compass and a soul.)

Alexis Rice speaks with David Clayton - a powerhouse of conviction who has broken through on social media, creator of the Official Empathy Tour, and candidate running for North Carolina’s 5th Congressional District - about faith, political power, empathy, and living with moral clarity in a time of cultural and spiritual noise.

David has built a massive audience across social platforms by speaking directly about corruption, representation, dignity, and the human cost of systems that prioritize power over people. He says what many people are thinking and his messages are a breath of fresh air. In this conversation, he shares the life experiences that shaped his worldview, including personal loss, caregiving, and work supporting veterans experiencing homelessness.

Together, Alexis and David discuss the misuse of religion in politics, the difference between faith and religious power structures, and why many Americans - across political identities - feel unrepresented by current leadership. David also shares why empathy, service, and accountability shape how he views faith and public leadership.

This episode is for listeners who feel politically or spiritually disoriented, for those questioning how faith is used in public life, and for anyone searching for voices grounded in integrity - for those who still believe - as David says- in having a moral compass and a soul.

⚠️ Trigger Warning:
This episode contains discussion of suicide, loss, and grief. Listener discretion is advised. If you or someone you know is struggling, call or text 988 (U.S. Suicide & Crisis Lifeline) or visit 988lifeline.org. You are not alone.

💡 Key Takeaways

• Faith as belief vs faith used for political gain
• Why representation requires lived empathy
• How trauma can shape compassion and service

👤 About Our Guest

David Clayton is running for North Carolina’s 5th Congressional District and is known for direct, values-driven conversations about faith, politics, and culture. He has built a large cross-platform audience by speaking candidly about corruption, representation, and moral responsibility in leadership. His work focuses on veteran advocacy, government accountability, and restoring dignity to public policy conversations.

🔗 David Clayton - Official Links & Social Handles

🌐 Campaign Website
https://www.clayton4nc.com

🔗 Link Hub
https://direct.me/empathytour

📱 Social Media
Instagram (Empathy Tour): @officialempathytour
Instagram (Campaign): @davidclayton4nc
Bluesky: @empathytour.bsky.social
TikTok: @davidempathytourclayton, @empathytour

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8. Rev. Darrell Goodwin (UCC) - The God of Our Wildest Dreams (Spotlight Re-Release)

Wed, 11 Feb 2026 11:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 8. Rev. Darrell Goodwin (UCC) — The God of Our Wildest Dreams (Spotlight Re-Release)

There are conversations that inform you… and conversations that do something to you.
This one did something to me.

After speaking with Rev. Darrell Goodwin, I felt blessed—my soul filled, stretched, challenged, and hopeful. His words carry rare pastoral tenderness and prophetic clarity. This conversation is profound not because it is loud, but because it names what so many people have lived and rarely hear spoken with this much truth and compassion.

This episode is for every person told “not you,” and for anyone who still longs for Jesus but doesn’t trust the building anymore. It is for the wounded, the deconstructing, and those discerning faith after church harm.

Rev. Goodwin explores how faith can expand—not by abandoning God—but by releasing versions of God rooted in fear, shame, or exclusion.

He challenges churches and progressive spaces alike: if we say “come as you are,” we must mean it—and create space for people to heal enough to believe us.

If your early faith trained you to fear God, he offers a liberating invitation: sometimes you must stop believing in the God of limitation to encounter the God of your wildest dreams.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Queer people often carry profound spiritual gifts—and the church wounds them early
• Deconstruction often begins in heartbreak and can lead to freedom
• Scripture invites wrestling, not control
• “Come as you are” must be practiced, not performed
• The Church needs both welcome and depth
• Liberation is lived through right relationship—with self, God, and others
• God knocks—God does not kick the door in

👤 About Our Guest
Rev. Darrell Goodwin is the Executive Conference Minister for the Southern New England Conference of the United Church of Christ (UCC), overseeing 600+ congregations. He is the first openly queer Black person to serve in this role within the UCC and is completing doctoral work at San Francisco Theological Seminary.

His ministry focuses on liberation theology, racial justice, LGBTQ+ inclusion, and healing from religious harm while reconnecting people to life-giving faith.

🔗 Connect + Learn More
Rev. Darrell Goodwin — IG: @revdgoodwin
Southern New England Conference (UCC) — IG: @sneucc
United Church of Christ — IG: @unitedchurchofchrist

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7. Cody Deese: The Pastor This Moment Has Been Waiting For

Fri, 06 Feb 2026 01:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 7. Cody Deese (Spiritual Collective Pastor) The Pastor This Moment Has Been Waiting For

In this urgent and culturally relevant episode of The Sacred Slope, Alexis Rice is joined by Cody Deese @codydeese - pastor of the Vining’s Lake spiritual collective @viningslake and author of Discovering Your Internal Universe: The Unexpected Good News About Anxiety, Panic, and Fear.

At a time when Christianity is increasingly entangled with political power and nationalist ideology, this conversation explores what it means to follow the teachings of Jesus in a moment defined by division, fear, & institutional mistrust. Alexis & Cody examine the historical dangers of religion merging with empire and why Christian nationalism represents a political ideology rather than a theological one.

The episode also moves into deeply personal territory, addressing anxiety, religious trauma, & the long arc of healing - intellectually, neurologically, emotionally, & somatically. Together, they explore how both love & suffering can become catalysts for transformation, & why many people are simultaneously deconstructing faith, national identity, inherited narratives about power- & ending up with a faith that is more beautiful & expansive than ever before.

✨ Ep Themes

• Christianity and power in modern America
• Revelation as social and spiritual critique
• Faith deconstruction beyond doctrine
• Anxiety, trauma, and body-based healing
• Community as a stabilizing force in cultural disruption
• Hope and moral agency in destabilizing historical moments

🕊️ The episode concludes with a spoken benediction from Pastor Cody for listeners navigating political anxiety, church trauma, spiritual isolation, or moral fatigue - offering language of dignity, compassion, and collective responsibility.

📚 Resources & Voices Mentioned
• Discovering Your Internal Universe: The Unexpected Good News About Anxiety, Panic, and Fear by Cody Deese, Forward by Rob Bell @realrobbell: https://www.eerdmans.com/9780802885401/discovering-your-internal-universe/
• Vining’s Lake Spiritual Collective: https://www.viningslake.org
• Richard Rohr Podcast: Another Name for Everything https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/another-name-for-every-thing-with-richard-rohr/id1452609613
• Pete Enns: @peteenns
• The Bible for Normal People: @thebiblefornormalpeople
• Cory Booker: @corybooker

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6. April Ajoy (Leaving Christian Nationalism, Keeping Jesus) – Star-Spangled Jesus

Thu, 29 Jan 2026 05:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 6. April Ajoy (Leaving Christian Nationalism, Keeping Jesus) – Star-Spangled Jesus

Alexis Rice speaks with author and commentator April Ajoy (@aprilajoy) about Christian nationalism, deconstruction, and what it costs to leave certainty without leaving faith.

April grew up in white evangelical, Pentecostal spaces where theology, politics, and identity were tightly bound. In this conversation, she describes how Christian nationalism forms people from the inside—how doubt is framed as spiritual failure, how loyalty is enforced, and how questioning can cost you community, family, and belonging.

Together, Alexis and April discuss January 6 as a turning point for many former evangelicals, the pressure Christians face around voting and abortion, and why Christian nationalism is not fringe but structurally embedded in American political and religious life. April also names what comes after deconstruction: uncertainty, grief, and a less coercive faith rooted in the teachings of Jesus rather than fear or power.

This episode is for listeners trying to understand how Christianity became a vehicle for exclusion and control—and for those still inside Christian spaces who sense something is off but don’t yet have language for it.

💡 Key Takeaways

• Why deconstruction is often involuntary and destabilizing
• How Christian nationalism disguises itself as “Biblical truth”
• Why abortion bans fail to reduce abortions, and what does
• The difference between Christianity and Christian nationalism
• What remains when certainty collapses

👤 About Our Guest

April Ajoy is the author of Star-Spangled Jesus, co-host of The Tim & April Show Podcast (@timandaprilshow), and hilarious social media influencer. Her work examines Christian nationalism, evangelical political formation, and what accountability and faith can look like after leaving authoritarian religious systems.

📚 Resources & Mentions

📖 Star-Spangled Jesus – April Ajoy
https://www.amazon.com/dp/1668016284

🎙 The Tim & April Show – @timandaprilshow
🟡 The New Evangelicals – @thenewevangelicals
🗣 Tim Whitaker – @timwhitakerspeaks
📘 The Bible for Normal People – @thebiblefornormalpeople
📖 Pete Enns – @peteenns

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5. Rev. Katie Nakamura-Rengers (Episcopal) – Standing in Awe: Faith Beyond Certainty

Sat, 24 Jan 2026 05:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 5. Rev. Katie Nakamura-Rengers (Episcopal) – Standing in Awe: Faith Beyond Certainty

In this deeply grounding episode of The Sacred Slope, Alexis Rice is joined by Reverend Katie Nakamura-Rengers (@katienakamurarengers)—an Episcopal priest, musician, and bridge-builder whose ministry invites us to slow down, release certainty, and rediscover faith rooted in presence and relationship. Reverend Katie was recommended to The Sacred Slope by Reverend Joseph Yoo (@joseph.yoo), and you will know why once you listen.

In a moment when Christianity is often pressured to be louder, faster, and more confident, this conversation offers a counter-witness: awe. Drawing from Anglican and Anglo-Catholic traditions, Reverend Katie reflects on how liturgy, silence, music, and embodied worship form us not through rigid rules, but through mystery and relational love.

Alexis and Katie explore why Jesus resists moral “protocols,” how God is encountered in the space between people—especially where power shifts—and why faith doesn’t require having all the answers to be deeply alive.

✨ In this conversation, we explore:
• Why faith doesn’t need certainty to be faithful
• How stillness and silence shape us in a distracted age
• Why rules exist for people—not people for rules
• Finding God in the space between us
• What embodied, sensory worship offers deconstructing Christians
• Why awe is a spiritual practice, not an intellectual failure

🕊️ Reverend Katie closes the episode with a prayer for listeners who may not have been prayed over in a long time—especially those who feel spiritually tender, tired, or unseen.

💛 A note to our listeners:
If this episode helped you breathe or loosen your grip on certainty, please share it with someone who may need that permission right now. Following, rating, and reviewing the podcast helps The Sacred Slope continue reaching those seeking faith grounded in love, not fear.

#Christianity #Deconstruction #OpenAndAffirming #ProgressiveChristianity #Exvangelical #FaithAfterEvangelicalism #WomenInMinistry #QueerTheology #MentalHealth #TheSacredSlope

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4. Dr. Aaron Higashi (Bible Scholar) – Serving Up Scripture: How to Interpret the Bible for Yourself and Others

Fri, 16 Jan 2026 16:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 4. Dr. Aaron Higashi (Bible Scholar) – Serving Up Scripture: How to Interpret the Bible for Yourself and Others

What if the Bible doesn’t actually present one unified doctrine of hell — and what if the answers you were given weren’t actually grounded in the text itself?

In this rich, accessible conversation, Alexis Rice dives deep with Dr. Aaron Higashi — biblical scholar, teacher, and TikTok theologian — about how Scripture actually works when you take it seriously: historically, linguistically, culturally, and personally.

If you’ve ever wondered why Christians disagree on hell, why pastors sometimes warn about Bible scholars, or how you can read the Bible without letting someone else’s interpretation do your thinking for you — this episode is for you.

What we cover

• Why the Bible does not contain one settled doctrine of hell
• The original words behind “hell” — Sheol, Hades, Gehenna, Tartarus — and why they matter
• How cultural and linguistic translation shapes theology
• Why people fear biblical scholarship — and how scholarship can actually liberate you
• The role of interpretation, bias, and your own voice in reading Scripture
• The relationship between pastors, scholars, and lay people

Key takeaways

• “The Bible is a multi-vocal text” — written across cultures, times, languages, and perspectives.
• No single biblical language term maps perfectly onto the English idea of “hell.”
• Interpretation always involves the interpreter — no one escapes bias, even if they claim to.
• Biblical scholars aren’t trying to take faith away — they’re trying to give access to tools to read the Bible well.
• You don’t have to accept a received interpretation — you are capable of engaging Scripture thoughtfully.

About our guest

Dr. Aaron Higashi is a biblical scholar and teacher whose work bridges academic theology and accessible real-world faith conversations. He serves as “nerd in residence” at @thebiblefornormalpeople, and brings humor, clarity, and depth to issues people care about most.

Resources & People Mentioned

🔖 Books & Study Materials
📘 Serving Up Scripture: How to Interpret the Bible for Yourself and Others — by Dr. Jennifer Garcia Bashaw & Dr. Aaron Higashi (Out Jan 27, 2026)

Pre-Order/Order: https://a.co/d/ihDX060

👩‍🏫 Other Voices & Scholars

✨ @thebiblefornormalpeople — community bridging scholarship and everyday readers
✨ @jgbashaw — Dr. Jennifer Garcia Bashaw
✨ @maklelan — Dan McClellan, Biblical Scholar: Data Over Dogma Podcast

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3. Rev. Dr. Chris Davies (UCC) – When the World Feels Like It’s on Fire: A Raw Conversation with a Pastor for the Soul

Sun, 11 Jan 2026 01:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 3. Rev. Dr. Chris Davies (UCC) – When the World Feels Like It’s on Fire: A Raw Conversation with a Pastor for the Soul

In this deeply vulnerable and pastoral episode of The Sacred Slope, Alexis Rice welcomes back Rev. Dr. Chris Davies, a reverend, theologian, and executive minister in the United Church of Christ. What unfolds is not a traditional interview, but a sacred conversation about grief, fear, joy, and faith in a moment when the world feels unbearably heavy.

🌍 The world is so chaotic right now
If you’re scrolling social media looking for catharsis, Rev. Dr. Chris Davies has it for you. This episode offers soul care in a time of collective grief—when outrage cycles, political fear, and spiritual exhaustion have left so many feeling lost and alone.

Alexis and Chris reflect on how their relationship began during the COVID and George Floyd era, when a single act of pastoral care—holding space for a stranger—became a catalyst for The Sacred Slope. Together, they explore what it means to tend the soul when institutions fail and anxiety is high.

✨ In this conversation, we explore:
• What real pastoral care looks like beyond “hot takes”
• Why Christian nationalism is an empire project—not the Gospel
• Why joy is not escapism, but resistance
• How queer communities survive through celebration and belonging
• Why exvangelicals are uniquely equipped for this moment
• How faith can remain rooted in love, not fear or purity tests

Chris reminds us that faith has survived fascism, empire, and collapse before—and God is still found in the cracks.

🕊️ Voices & References
• United Church of Christ – @ucc.coalition
• Rev. Darrell Goodwin – @revdgoodwin
• The Daily Show – @thedailyshow
• RuPaul's Drag Race – @rupaulsdragrace
• Dan Savage – @dansavage
• Sharon McMahon – @sharonsaysso
• Find Hope Now – https://findhopenow.org

💛 A note to our listeners:
If this conversation helps you, please share this episode with someone who may need it right now. Please also subscribe, follow, rate, and review the podcast so The Sacred Slope can continue reaching those searching for care, clarity, and community.

#Christianity #Deconstruction #OpenAndAffirming #ProgressiveChristianity #Exvangelical #FaithAfterEvangelicalism #ChristianNationalism #QueerTheology #WomenInMinistry #MentalHealth #TheSacredSlope

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2. Pastor Kimberly Bulgin (Seventh-day Adventist) – The Sisters Stay Dropping Gems: Reclaiming Women’s Stories in Scripture

Thu, 08 Jan 2026 04:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 2. Pastor Kimberly Bulgin (Seventh-day Adventist) – The Sisters Stay Dropping Gems: Reclaiming Women’s Stories in Scripture

Alexis Rice welcomes Pastor Kimberly Bulgin—Seventh-day Adventist trailblazer, global leader, musician, and author of The Sisters Stay Dropping Gems: What Women in the Bible Teach Us About Life, Love, and Relationships. Pastor Kim shares what it actually costs to challenge patriarchy from the inside, why women’s stories in Scripture have been flattened into stereotypes, and how Jesus’ treatment of women dismantles modern purity culture and hierarchy.

Pastor Kim also opens up about being among the first women ordained in her region—celebration and pain held together—and offers language that will set many listeners free: “When you break glass ceilings, the glass can cut you.”

✨ In this episode, we talk about:
• The resistance (and real-world backlash) women face in ordination
• Why congregations need spiritual preparation to receive women pastors
• What Seventh-day Adventists are known for: Sabbath, second Advent, health, and service
• “Modern-day Rahabs” and why the church must stop treating women as problems to solve
• Re-reading the Woman at the Well with complexity, dignity, and liberation
• What Jesus’ public, unashamed posture toward women reveals about God
• Stick around until the end for a closing prayer for anyone who hasn’t been prayed over in a long time

📖 Featured Book
The Sisters Stay Dropping Gems — www.kimberlybulgin.com/shop.

Exclusive promo code for listeners/viewers of The Sacred Slope. Those that enter the promo code SACREDPOD will get a 10% discount off physical copies of Pastor Kim's book.

🎵 Music
Brett Rutledge, Eddie Irvin, and Sean Spence

💌 Nominate a guest (pastor, priest, artist, or everyday person anywhere in the world):
Alexis @ thesacredslope.com

#Christianity #deconstruction #MentalHealth #womeninministry #womenintheBible #SeventhdayAdventist #purityculture #churchhurt #faith #Jesus #womenleadership

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1. Rev. Dr. Mark Sandlin (Presbyterian) – ProgressiveChristianity.org & The Christian Left: Busting Myths About Progressive Christianity

Sat, 03 Jan 2026 19:00:00 -0000

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ITS THE SEASON TWO PREMIERE!

🎙️ 1. Rev. Dr. Mark Sandlin (Presbyterian) – ProgressiveChristianity.org & The Christian Left: Busting Myths About Progressive Christianity

In this episode of The Sacred Slope, Alexis Rice is joined by Rev. Dr. Mark Sandlin (@marksandlin), Presbyterian minister, writer, and co-founder of ProgressiveChristianity.org (@progressivechristianity) and The Christian Left (@the_christian_left). Mark has spent decades helping people recover a Christ-centered faith rooted in love rather than fear, shame, or authoritarian control.

Together, Alexis and Mark dismantle the biggest misconceptions that keep so many people trapped—or pushed out—of Christianity altogether, especially those raised in conservative or fundamentalist spaces.

✨ In this conversation, we myth-bust 6 common beliefs:

1. Progressive Christians don’t believe the Bible
Why taking Scripture seriously is not the same as taking it literally—and how historical and literary tools deepen faith.

2. Progressive Christianity isn’t “real” Christianity
How white American evangelicalism came to dominate the narrative—and why Christianity has always been bigger, older, and more diverse.

3. Progressive Christians ignore sin and holiness
How fear, shame, and hell were weaponized—and what sin looks like when understood as anything that separates us from love and community.

4. Faith and science can’t coexist
Why evolution, the Big Bang, and the cosmos don’t threaten belief in God—and can actually reveal deeper beauty and connection.

5. Progressive Christianity is just politics in disguise
Why justice, care for the vulnerable, and love of neighbor were never apolitical—and why calling them “political” protects power.

6. There’s no salvation or afterlife in progressive faith
What salvation looks like without fear-based evangelism—and what Jesus was actually saving people from.

📚 Resources Mentioned
• The Bible for Normal People – @thebiblefornormalpeople. Podcast: https://thebiblefornormalpeople.com/podcast/

• Jared Byas – @jaredbyas
• Pete Enns – @peteenns
• Richard Rohr – Podcast: Another Name For Everything https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/another-name-for-every-thing-with-richard-rohr/id1452609613
• Brian McLaren – @brianmclaren Podcast: Learning How to See: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/learning-how-to-see-with-brian-mclaren/id1532685433
• Diana Butler Bass – @dianabutlerbass
• Barbara Brown Taylor – @barbarabrowntaylor
• Dan McClellan – @maklelan Podcast: Data Over Dogma: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/data-over-dogma/id1681418502
• Bart Ehrman – @bartdehrman
• Moonshine Jesus Show Podcast: https://moonshinejesus.podbean.com/

#christianity #progressivechristianity #deconstructing #deconstruction #exvangelical #faithandscience #preysbyterian #thechristianleft #liberal #progressive #democrat #openandaffirming #lgbtq #letherlead #womeninleadership #antiracist

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35. Ike Ndolo (Catholic, Singer-Songwriter) - God in the Rubble, Honest Hymns & Freedom Songs

Wed, 31 Dec 2025 22:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 35. Ike Ndolo (Catholic, Singer-Songwriter) - God in the Rubble, Honest Hymns & Freedom Songs

Alexis Rice welcomes Ike Ndolo @ikendolo, a Nigerian-American Catholic worship leader and singer-songwriter whose voice refuses silence in the face of suffering. This episode is a powerful, honest conversation about faith with legs—faith that tells the truth, stands with the oppressed, and sings even when the world is on fire. Ike reflects on global Christianity, Catholic tradition, liberation theology, and the cost of speaking out—especially in this season.

We talk about God in the Rubble—a lament, protest, and prayer written in response to Gaza—and how worship can hold grief, rage, and hope at the same time. Ike also shares the stories behind Won’t He Do It, Sons and Daughters, City of God, and the heart of his forthcoming work Honest Hymns & Freedom Songs. Along the way, we explore music as resistance, salvation history as a living drama, and why collective liberation matters.

💡 Key Takeaways

Why scripture read in full tells a story of liberation, not domination
How Catholic liturgy resists cherry-picked theology
Music as protest, prayer, and communal healing

👤 About Our Guest
Ike Ndolo has spent his entire adult life in ministry, leading worship across continents while writing songs rooted in justice, dignity, and radical welcome. His sound blends Americana, folk, and rock, influenced by Bob Marley, Ben Harper, Bob Dylan, and Marvin Gaye. His work invites listeners into faith that is honest, embodied, and alive.

🎶 Songs & Music Featured

God in the Rubble — Ike Ndolo
Won’t He Do It — Ike Ndolo
Sons and Daughters — Ike Ndolo (co-written with Matt Maher @mattmahermusic) Featuring Emoni Wilkens @emoniwilkins
City of God — Ike Ndolo
Honest Hymns & Freedom Songs — upcoming record

🎙 Mentions & Influences

James Talarico @jamestalarico on God’s cry for justice
Inspirational singer-songwriters: Sara Groves @grovesroad, Derek Webb @derekwebb, Semler @gracebaldridge, Jon Guerra @iamjonguerra

🔗 Follow & Support Ike

Music & videos (watch, listen, share): YouTube / Spotify / Apple Music — Ike Ndolo: https://www.youtube.com/@IkeNdolo
Music lessons & creative mentorship: https://www.ikesmusicmakers.com/

#IkeNdolo #Catholic #LiberationTheology #WorshipMusic #Christianity #deconstruction #MusicAsResistance #FreePalestine #GodIsLove

Music used with permission from Ike Ndolo

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34. David Hayward (The Naked Pastor) – Challenging Power, Holding Grief, and Sharing the Gospel Through Art

Sat, 27 Dec 2025 16:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 34. David Hayward (The Naked Pastor) – Challenging Power, Holding Grief, and Sharing the Gospel Through Art

Highly encourage you to watch this episode on YouTube or Spotify to see art from The Naked Pastor we talk about! https://youtu.be/U2okGOpqGrA?si=_vb3UU346wydnpcV

Alexis Rice welcomes David Hayward, the Canadian artist known globally as The Naked Pastor @nakedpastor, for a courageous, deeply human conversation about faith, power, grief, art, and what it actually means to follow Jesus right now.

A former pastor of nearly 30 years, David’s minimalist cartoons have become lifelines for millions navigating deconstruction, church harm, 2SLGBTQIA+ inclusion, political theology, and spiritual independence. In this episode, he reflects on leaving institutional ministry, the grief of losing both parents, and why art can sometimes tell the truth faster — and more honestly — than sermons ever could.

Together, Alexis and David explore where Jesus consistently shows up: not in the center of power, but on the margins — among the excluded, the grieving, and those still brave enough to love indiscriminately.

💡 Key Takeaways

• Why “indiscriminate love” is at the heart of Jesus’ teachings — and why it’s never been popular
• The difference between church style and spiritual substance (high church vs. low church)
• How charismatic religious leadership bleeds into politics — and why that matters
• Why 2SLGBTQIA+ inclusion exposes the deepest fears of patriarchy
• Art as a spiritual practice that bypasses defenses and speaks directly to the heart
• Grief, loss, and why David painted a man “floating in his own tears”
• Why de-centering ourselves may be the most faithful work we can do

👤 About Our Guest

David Hayward is a Canadian artist, former pastor, author, and visual theologian. Known as The Naked Pastor, his daily cartoons challenge religious harm, patriarchy, and exclusion while re-centering faith around dignity, compassion, and love. His work is shared globally and has helped countless people reclaim faith — or heal from it — beyond institutional walls.

🎨 The Naked Pastor Art & Prints (Shop)
https://nakedpastor.com/collections/all

🌐 Website (Home Base)
https://nakedpastor.com

📖 Books by David Hayward
Available wherever books are sold

https://nakedpastor.com/pages/about">canadian artist

https://nakedpastor.com/blogs/news/what-is-the-deconstruction-of-faith">deconstruction

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33. BONUS: If You Haven’t Been Prayed Over in a Long Time

Thu, 25 Dec 2025 06:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 33. BONUS: If You Haven’t Been Prayed Over in a Long Time

This labor of love is my Christmas gift to you. I wasn’t planning to make this episode, but if it helps even one person this Christmas season, it was worth it.

Over the past 7 months, I invited pastors, priests, and reverends from around the world to pray for those who haven’t been prayed over in a long time. This episode is a compilation of those prayers, woven together with music from singer-songwriters featured in Season One. There are some guests sprinkled in that will be in Season Two!

Beloveds, you are loved just as you are. You matter to God. You have infinite worth, and you are needed. My hope is that this prayerful meditation offers healing, peace, and clarity—and invites you to listen for the Holy Spirit as you reflect, remember, and rest.

May you leave with a little more courage, a little more clarity, and a peace that surpasses understanding.

Merry Christmas.

- Alexis Rice

Clergy and Artists Featured
Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde (Episcopal) @bishopbudde
Pastor Josh Scott (Progressive Baptist/Post-Evangelical) @josh_a_scott
Rev. Helen (Anglican, Church of England) @revhelenpt
Pastor Paul Drees (Lutheran) @pastorpauldrees
Rev. Darrell Goodwin (UCC) @revdgoodwin
Father Lizzie (Episcopal) @rev.lizzie
Rev. Gerlyn (Anglican) @gerlynhenry
Rev. Joseph Yoo (Episcopal) @joseph.yoo
Rev. Joash P. Thomas (St. Thomas/Anglican) @joashpthomas
Bishop Guðrún Karls Helgudóttir (Lutheran, Iceland) @gudrun.biskup_

Music - Jon Guerra — Citizens @iamjonguerra

Rev. Dr. Chris Davies (UCC) @jesuslovesdinos
Pastor Joe Smith (Non-denominational) @therealjoe.smith
Rev. Elizabeth Ashman Riley (Episcopal) @therevriley
Pastor Jeremy Steele (United Methodist) @skeptic.pastor

Music - Sara Groves — Hello, Lord @grovesroad

Rev. Joe Graves (United Methodist) @josephdavidgraves
Pastor Kim (Seventh-day Adventist) @_kimberlybulgin

Music- Semler — Faith @gracebaldridge

Rev. Dr. Mark Sandlin (Presbyterian) @marksandlin
Pastor Seth Cain (Non-denominational) @sethandrewcain

Music- Derek Webb — I Was There Too, It Won't Be This Way Forever @derekwebb

Rev. Roberto Che Espinoza, PhD (Baptist) @drrobertoche
Pastor Zach Lambert (Post-Evangelical) @zachwlambert
Rev. Dr. Ginny Brown Daniel (UCC)
Rev. Katie (Episcopal)

Music - Malynda Hale — God and His Gun @malyndahale

Rev. Amber Evans (Episcopal)
Rev. Dr. Chris Davies (UCC)

Music - The Sacred Slope Theme - Brett Rutledge, Eddie Irvin, Sean Spence

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32. Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde (Episcopal) - We Can Be Brave

Sat, 20 Dec 2025 15:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 32. Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde (Episcopal) – We Can Be Brave

It’s not every day you get to sit down with one of your heroes. Bishop Budde has shaped my spiritual life - and my willingness to be brave - in these uncertain times. I hope this episode, my Christmas gift to you, fills you up with the same.
- Alexis Rice

What does Christian courage look like when fear dominates public life - and love still calls us to show up with dignity?

In this episode of The Sacred Slope, Alexis is joined by Mariann Edgar Budde, Episcopal Bishop of Washington, D.C., and author of the New York Times bestselling book We Can Be Brave, now adapted for young readers and out now from Penguin Young Readers.

Many first encountered Bishop Budde during the National Prayer Service at Washington National Cathedral, when she looked directly at President Trump and made a plea for mercy. In this conversation - and through her book - she places that moment in context, showing how bravery is not a single act, but a lifelong practice shaped by faith, humility, and love.

✨ In this conversation, we explore:

Why affirming another person’s humanity is moral work
Mercy, forgiveness, and accountability - without bypassing harm
How bravery is practiced over a lifetime

✨ An excerpt from Bishop Budde’s sermon at the National Prayer Service at Washington National Cathedral:

“Let me make one final plea, Mr. President. Millions have put their trust in you.
And as you told the nation yesterday, you have felt the providential hand of a loving God. In the name of our God, I ask you to have mercy upon the people in our country who are scared now. There are gay, lesbian, and transgender children in Democratic, Republican, and Independent families - some who fear for their lives. And the people - the people who pick our crops and clean our office buildings; who labor in poultry farms and meatpacking plants; who wash the dishes after we eat in restaurants and work the night shifts in hospitals - they may not be citizens or have the proper documentation, but the vast majority of immigrants are not criminals. They pay taxes and are good neighbors. They are faithful members of our churches and mosques, synagogues, gurdwaras, and temples. I ask you to have mercy, Mr. President, on those in our communities whose children fear that their parents will be taken away, and that you help those who are fleeing war zones and persecution in their own lands to find compassion and welcome here. Our God teaches us that we are to be merciful to the stranger, for we were all once strangers in this land. May God grant us the strength and courage to honor the dignity of every human being, to speak the truth to one another in love, and to walk humbly with each other and our God - for the good of all people. The good of all people in this nation and the world.

Amen.”

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31. Rev. Elizabeth Ashman Riley (Episcopal) – Rage Prayers & What to Expect at an Episcopal Church

Sat, 13 Dec 2025 17:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 31. Rev. Elizabeth Ashman Riley (Episcopal) – Rage Prayers & What to Expect at an Episcopal Church

What if the holiest prayer you could pray wasn’t polite at all—but a full-body, honest, angry, “Are you seeing this, God?!”

In this episode of The Sacred Slope, Rev. Elizabeth Ashman Riley (@therevriley), Episcopal priest & author of Rage Prayers, invites us to bring our whole selves—grief, fury, doubt, and all—to God. We talk about queer-affirming faith, the beauty of small Episcopal communities, and what newcomers can expect when they step inside an Episcopal church for the first time.

✨ In this conversation, we explore:
• Elizabeth’s call story in a tiny Alaskan village
• 20+ years of Episcopal debates around queer inclusion
• Why “Jesus loves you, but…” is not the Gospel
• The surprising, viral origin of Rage Prayers
• How to write your own rage prayers (and why God can handle them)
• What it’s really like to attend an Episcopal church—rituals, liturgy, community
• The gift of small, intergenerational churches where people actually notice you
• A closing prayer for anyone who hasn’t been prayed over in a long time

✨ What to Expect at an Episcopal Church
If you’re coming from non-denominational or megachurch spaces, an Episcopal church may feel smaller, quieter, more ancient—and more intimate. Expect ritual and scripture, weekly communion, candles, responses, and a community that knows your name. Expect belonging without condition, space for questions, and a faith shaped by love over fear.

💡 Key takeaways
• God is not fragile—your full emotions and doubts are welcome
• Rage can clarify what matters most
• Queer-affirming, justice-centered churches exist
• You deserve a church that doesn’t confuse “neutrality” with love
• Faith can be rebuilt with honesty, curiosity, and courage

📚 Resources Mentioned
• Rage Prayers – Elizabeth Ashman Riley
• Father Lizzie McManus-Dail – God Didn't Make Us to Hate Us @rev.lizzie
• April Ajoy – Star Spangled Jesus – @aprilajoyr
• Erin Hicks Moon – I’ve Got Questions – @erinhmoon
• Church Clarity – @churchclarity
• The New Evangelicals – @thenewevangelicals
• Theology Beer Camp - @theologybeercamp
• Tripp Fuller - @trippfuller
• Adam Clark - @adamclk

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30. Jen Hatmaker (Relaxed in the love of Jesus) - and Awake

Sun, 07 Dec 2025 23:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 30. Jen Hatmaker (Relaxed in the love of Jesus) and Awake

Alexis Rice welcomes NYT Bestselling author, podcaster, and spiritual trailblazer Jen Hatmaker (@jenhatmaker) for a tender, fierce, and raw conversation about her new memoir Awake. It's about the collapse of her marriage, and the systems that helped build the house that fell. Together they unpack patriarchy, purity culture, codependency, women’s leadership in the church, LGBTQIA+ inclusion, and how to survive the holidays with people whose politics and theology break your heart.
Grab a copy of the book for a friend this holiday season!

💡 Key Takeaways

• Why deconstructing toxic systems is faithful work - and why some churches and platforms simply won’t change
• A blessing and a help for parents when a child comes out, and how to build a safe home
• How to navigate holiday tables with MAGA relatives: what you can’t control, when to draw a boundary, and why clear is kind (THX @BrenéBrown)
• A gentler Jesus: relaxed, non-fragile, present inside and outside institutions - and what it means to co-create “the good life” right now

👤 About Our Guest
Jen Hatmaker is a longtime Christian author, speaker, and podcast host whose work has walked millions of women through authenticity, agency, and spiritual evolution. She’s the author of Awake and Fierce, Free, and Full of Fire, host of the For the Love podcast, and a loud, unapologetic advocate for women’s leadership and LGBTQIA+ inclusion in the church.

📚 Resources & Mentions
📖 Awake: A Memoir – Jen Hatmaker
https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Awake/Jen-Hatmaker/9781668083680

📘 Fierce, Free, and Full of Fire – Jen Hatmaker
https://jenhatmaker.com/fierce-free-and-full-of-fire/

🎙 For the Love with Jen Hatmaker – Podcast
Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/for-the-love-with-jen-hatmaker-podcast/id1258388821

🌈 Church Clarity – finding clear, affirming churches (women in leadership & LGBTQIA+ inclusion) @churchclarity

📗 Codependent No More – Melody Beattie (on codependency & responsibility for our own healing)
https://www.melodybeattie.com/codependentnomore

📖 Renovation of the Heart – Dallas Willard (on spiritual formation & the character of Christ)
https://dwillard.org/resources/books/renovation-of-the-heart @dallas_willard_ministries

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29. Pastor Josh Scott – (Non-Denominational, Progressive, Open & Affirming) The Kind of Pastor I Wish I’d Had Growing Up

Mon, 01 Dec 2025 03:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 29. Pastor Josh Scott – (Non-Denominational, Progressive, Open & Affirming) The Kind of Pastor I Wish I’d Had Growing Up

What if the pastor you grew up with had made room for your questions instead of your fear? In this episode, Pastor Josh Scott (@josh_a_scott) shares how a kid raised in conservative Free Will Baptist Appalachia—where reading the NIV was considered “progressive”—became one of the most trusted voices in today’s progressive, Open & Affirming, non-denominational Christian movement.

Josh grew up in a tiny holler on the Kentucky/West Virginia border with King-James-Only theology, fear-based sermons, and a faith built on certainty. But the loss of his grandfather inside a church conflict cracked that certainty open and launched his lifelong journey of re-imagining Christianity around justice, compassion, and Jesus at the margins.

In this conversation, we explore:

Growing up fundamentalist and slowly unraveling that worldview
Why his progressive convictions come from Scripture, not in spite of it
How he teaches his kids about gender, pronouns, and diverse families with simple Christian compassion
Why he refuses to become the “progressive version” of the fundamentalism he left
What to look for in a safe, affirming church
How he pastors online without losing his soul to trolls
A prayer for anyone who hasn’t been prayed over in a long time

💡 Key takeaways
• Deconstruction often begins with grief, not rebellion
• Christianity was never meant to be about control
• A Christ-shaped faith always widens the circle of belonging
• You can hold convictions without dehumanizing anyone

📚 Resources Mentioned

✨ Brian D. McLaren – Life After Doom, Faith After Doubt, Do I Stay Christian?
Instagram: @brian_mclaren

✨ Marcus J. Borg – The Heart of Christianity, Meeting Jesus Again for the First Time

✨ John Dominic Crossan – The Historical Jesus, God and Empire

✨ Rob Bell – Love Wins, What We Talk About When We Talk About God
Instagram: @realrobbell

✨ Jay Bakker – Fall to Grace, Revolution Church, One Punk Under God
Instagram: @jaybakker

✨ Vote Common Good – Faith-rooted civic engagement
Instagram: @votecommongood

✨ Doug Pagitt – Pastor, author, Executive Director of VCG
Instagram: @dougpagitt

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28. Rev. Joash P. Thomas (Saint Thomas Christian / Evangelical Anglican tradition) – The Justice of Jesus & Decolonizing Our Faith

Mon, 24 Nov 2025 05:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 28. Rev. Joash P. Thomas (Saint Thomas Christian / Evangelical Anglican tradition) – The Justice of Jesus & Decolonizing Our Faith

Who taught me my theology - and who is missing from the table? From his roots in the ancient St. Thomas Christian tradition in India, through white American evangelicalism and Georgia Republican politics, to ministry in Canada, Rev. Joash shares how reclaiming his Global South perspective transformed his understanding of Jesus, justice, and the global church.

What we cover

• Why it’s “dangerous to only learn from one branch of the church”
• The 2,000-year story of St. Thomas Christians
• How colonization reshaped Western theology and our picture of justice
• Re-centering the table: why Eucharist once sat at the heart of Christian worship
• Seeing Christ on the margins—survivors of trafficking, refugees, the poor
• Deconstruction vs. decolonization, and why justice is good news for bodies and souls
• Being “politically agnostic” except on behalf of our marginalized neighbors
• A pastoral blessing and the Prayer of St. Francis for listeners who need prayer

💡 Key takeaways

• It’s dangerous to only learn from one wealthy, powerful branch of the church
• Christianity is global and ancient; it never belonged exclusively to the West
• Deconstruction without decolonization can recreate the same power structures
• Jesus is already on the margins; we’re invited to recognize and join him there

⛪ About our guest

Rev. Joash P. Thomas (@joashpthomas) is a Saint Thomas Christian with deep Anglican roots, born and raised in India within one of the world’s oldest Christian communities, tracing back to the apostle Thomas. He holds two master’s degrees from Dallas Theological Seminary and a master’s in political management from George Washington University. A former political consultant and international human rights worker, he now serves in Hamilton, Ontario, helping the church recover a justice-centered, decolonized vision of the gospel in his book The Justice of Jesus.

📚 Resources mentioned

• The Justice of Jesus – Rev. Joash P. Thomas (@joashpthomas)
• James H. Cone – The Cross and the Lynching Tree (Black Liberation Theology)
• Dr. Willie James Jennings – The Christian Imagination: Theology and the Origins of Race (theology, race, ecclesiology)
• Gustavo Gutiérrez – A Theology of Liberation (founder of Liberation Theology; Peruvian Catholic theologian)
• Dr. Jamar Tisby (@jemartisby) – The Color of Compromise, How to Fight Racism, historian of race, religion & justice
• Leonardo Boff – Liberating Theology / Cry of the Earth, Cry of the Poor (Latin American liberation theologian)
• René Padilla – Mission Between the Times (Latin American evangelical theology / “integral mission”)

Podcasts

• Bodies Behind the Bus – Joanna Harris (spiritual abuse survivors & church power) https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/bodies-behind-the-bus/id1601586078

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27. Mike Maeshiro (Ex-evangelical pastor) – God Made Me Gay: Healing from Spiritual Harm

Mon, 17 Nov 2025 06:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 27. Mike Maeshiro (Ex-evangelical pastor) – God Made Me Gay: Healing from Spiritual Harm

Growing up evangelical, Mike was taught that being gay was sinful, dangerous, and something God would eventually “fix.” Today, he’s an ex-evangelical pastor helping thousands heal from spiritual trauma and rediscover a God who delights in them. In this episode, Mike shares his story with honesty, humor, and courage — from coming out, to losing his church community, to rebuilding a life rooted in joy, integrity, and love.

We explore how harmful theology takes root, what harm-reduction can look like for queer youth still inside evangelical spaces, why parents should celebrate (not merely tolerate) their queer kids, and how allies can use their voices to protect those most vulnerable.

What we cover

• Growing up fundamentalist & knowing he was gay at age 10
• Why “pray the gay away” theology creates lifelong trauma
• Harm-reduction for queer teens still stuck in non-affirming churches
• The healthiest Christian response when your child comes out
• How to begin deconstructing fear-based, authoritarian theology
• Finding safer, affirming churches—and spotting red flags
• Why allies must be loud in the comments & in real life
• What gives Mike hope for the future of Christianity

💡 Key takeaways

• Queer kids need celebration and safety — not neutrality
• Evangelicalism is a constructed system; leaving it is not leaving God
• Affirming theology saves lives
• Allies speaking up publicly is essential for closeted youth
• You can be queer and Christian — many pastors and scholars already are

⛪ About our guest

Mike Maeshiro (@mikemaeshiro) is an ex-evangelical pastor, emotional-health coach, and writer. He is currently releasing his memoir God Made Me Gay on Substack, helping people recover from spiritual harm and reconnect to themselves, to joy, and to love.

📚 Resources mentioned

Affirming theology & deconstruction
• 1946: The Movie (@1946themovie)
• Dan McClellan (@maklelan) – Data Over Dogma
• Unclobbered – Colby Martin (@colby_martin)
• Brian McLaren (@brianmclaren) – A New Kind of Christianity
• Pete Enns (@peteenns) – The Bible Tells Me So
• J.S. Park (@jspark3000) – As Long As You Need
• Eucontamination: Disgust Theology and the Christian Life – Paul & Billie Hoard

Queer pastors, priests & musicians previously featured on The Sacred Slope
• Rev. Dr. Chris Davies (@jesuslovesdinos, Episode 4)
• Rev. Darrell Goodwin (@revdgoodwin, Episode 5)
• Rev. Roberto Che Espinoza, PhD (@drrobertoche, Episode 15)
• Father Lizzie @rev.lizzie (Episode 7)
• Semler (@gracebaldridge, Episode 13)

Finding affirming churches
• churchclarity.org
• Josh Scott @josh_a_scott (GracePointe Church)

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26. Dr. Jennifer Garcia Bashaw (Bible Scholar) – Wrestling with Scripture Beyond Literalism

Sun, 09 Nov 2025 15:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 26. Dr. Jennifer Garcia Bashaw (Bible Scholar) – Wrestling with Scripture Beyond Literalism

When “Bible-believing” meant literalism and inerrancy, many of us thought that was the only Christian option. Dr. Jennifer Garcia Bashaw—New Testament scholar, professor, and church practitioner—opens the door to a bigger, older, more beautiful Christian story. We unpack why inerrancy & literalism are relatively recent (1800s) theologies, how the Bible’s genres invite deeper reading, what Revelation is actually doing, and how multiple atonement models live inside the tradition.

What we cover

• Inerrancy & literalism as modern control theologies
• Reading the Bible as literature: genres + context
• Atonement models 101: moral exemplar, Christus Victor, satisfaction → penal substitution
• Revelation as apocalyptic resistance literature (and why the rapture isn’t in Revelation)
• Practical tips for finding Jesus-centered churches today
• Learning to think in stories not isolated verses
• Jennifer’s forthcoming Serving Up Scripture (with @abhigashi)

💡 Key takeaways

• Wrestling with Scripture is ancient & holy work
• The rapture is a 19th-century doctrinal system, not a Revelation doctrine
• Center Jesus when doctrines conflict
• You’re not alone — many scholars make Scripture accessible without dumbing it down

⛪ About our guest

Dr. Jennifer Garcia Bashaw (@jgbashaw) is a New Testament scholar & professor who also serves in congregational ministry — bridging academy + church with clarity, courage, and compassion.

📚 Resources mentioned

@thebiblefornormalpeople (Bible Scholar Pete Enns @peteenns + former pastor Jared Byas @jaredbyas)
Homebrewed Christianity @theologynerd (host @trippfuller)
@maklelan – Bible Scholar and podcast host, Data Over Dogma
@abhigashi – co-author and Bible Scholar
@crosspointecary – church where Jennifer preaches
@derekwebb – songwriter mentioned

🔎 Episode highlights

“Nowhere does the Bible say you must read this literally or that every word is inerrant.”
“Genres matter. Reading apocalyptic like a newspaper guarantees you’ll miss the point.”
“If a church talks more about the inerrancy of the Bible than the way of Jesus, pause.”
“Think in stories, not isolated proof-texts.”

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25. Bishop Guðrún (Church of Iceland) – A Nation Led by Women, and a Bishop Who Says Queer People Should Be Safe in Christianity

Mon, 03 Nov 2025 05:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 25. Bishop Guðrún Karls Helgudottir (Church of Iceland) – A Nation Led by Women, and a Bishop Who Says Queer People Should Be Safe in Christianity

Together, Alexis & Bishop Guðrún dive into:

💡 Key Takeaways

⛪ About Our Guest

Bishop Guðrún Karls Helgudottir (@gudrun.biskup_) is the Bishop of Iceland - the spiritual head of the Church of Iceland (@kirkjan.is), a national Lutheran church interwoven into Icelandic cultural life, history, and state ceremonies. The Bishop’s office carries both sacred and civic weight: accompanying presidents and prime ministers at moments of national significance, offering moral clarity in public crises, and serving as a pastoral presence when the country gathers in grief, remembrance, or celebration.

📚 Resources Mentioned

Iceland Church Pride clip:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DNBnMnFMtN8/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Bishop Guðrún Trans rights clip:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DFvNaZ8tKeN/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Suicide-awareness clip:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DPCd44njMXo/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Women’s Strike (BBC):
https://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/articles/cy0ky4e4kzwo

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24. Rev. Gerlyn (Anglican Church of Canada) – Communion over Control: The Faith that Frees

Sun, 26 Oct 2025 19:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 24. Rev. Gerlyn Henry (Anglican Church of Canada) – Communion over Control: The Faith that Frees

When faith becomes about control instead of communion, something sacred is lost.
Reverend Gerlyn Henry (@gerlynhenry)—an Indian-Canadian Anglican priest whose social media content about Jesus, justice, and women in ministry has reached millions and gathered hundreds of thousands of followers—joins Alexis Rice to talk about a faith that liberates instead of dominates.

Together, Alexis & Gerlyn dive into:

• “Your first food is the Bible” — how a childhood rhythm of morning scripture shaped her vow never to mock someone for who they are
• Deuteronomy’s grapes — living so there’s enough for those who come after
• Canada→ India → Canada — how pluralism, study, and migration form her theology
• Anglican 101 — common prayer and common table, not a doctrinal contract
• Embodied faith — why Anglicans bow when the cross passes and how to make the sign of the cross: “From the top of my head to the bottom of my soul … and then: what is my call in this?”
• Women in the collar vs. The Handmaid’s Tale @handmaidsonhulu Christianity — what happens when empire dresses up as faith
• Pastors online — how clergy can use digital spaces to amplify inclusion
• A closing prayer for everyone who feels judged or spiritually homeless

💡 Key Takeaways

❤️ The gospel is liberation, not control
🌿 Worship extends into housing and feeding neighbors
👩‍⚖️ Women in collars are a vital part of the church
🌈 Pluralism is not a threat to Jesus

⛪ About Our Guest

Rev. Gerlyn Henry (@gerlynhenry) is an Anglican priest in the Diocese of Toronto and rector of Holy Wisdom—a parish formed from three historic congregations during the pandemic. She holds an M.Div. from Columbia Theological Seminary and lives in intentional community with asylum seekers. Her online ministry reaches hundreds of thousands across platforms and millions through viral reels about a Jesus of welcome, dignity, and courage.

📚 Resources Mentioned

God Didn’t Make Us to Hate Us — Rev. Lizzie McManus-Dail | IG: @rev.lizzie
Rev. Paul Drees | IG: @pastorpauldrees
The New Evangelicals | IG: @thenewevangelicals
“The Tim & April Show” — @timandaprilshow | @timwhitakerspeaks | @aprilajoy
Praying the Psalms — Walter Brueggemann
Consider the Birds — Debbie Blue
Texts of Terror — Phyllis Trible
“The Reuben Option” — Allan Boesak (sermon on refusing neutrality)

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23. John Fugelsang (Aspiring Christian) – Separation of Church & Hate

Mon, 20 Oct 2025 16:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 23. John Fugelsang (Aspiring Christian) – Separation of Church & Hate

Alexis Rice welcomes comedian, author, and radio host John Fugelsang (@johnfugelsang) — whose blend of humor, history, and theology cuts through America’s culture-war fog. His NYT bestseller Separation of Church and Hate challenges both the weaponization of Christianity and the silence that enables it.

With his trademark wit, John dismantles the TV-made binary, tracing how power keeps hijacking Jesus’ message—from the Crusades to cable news—and why faithful Christ-followers still choose empathy over empire.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Why corporate media platforms outrage, not nuance
• Proof-texts un-weaponized — Luke 22 & Matthew 25 in context
• Love as resistance: turning the other cheek ≠ turning off your brain
• Beyond binaries: global, diverse, love-driven Christianity

👤 About Our Guest
John Fugelsang is a comedian, actor, and commentator; host of Tell Me Everything on SiriusXM Progress (Ch. 127); and author of Separation of Church and Hate. He’s appeared on The Daily Show, CNN, MSNBC, HBO & Fox News—bringing scripture and satire into public life.

📚 Resources & Mentions
📖 Separation of Church and Hate — Simon & Schuster: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Separation-of-Church-and-Hate/John-Fugelsang/9781668066898
🎙 Tell Me Everything with John Fugelsang — SiriusXM Progress 127
🎧 The John Fugelsang Podcast — Apple / Spotify
🕊 @itskristinahart — creator of “love your neighbor Christian, not a storm the Capitol Christian” shirt: https://www.bonfire.com/store/kristina-hart
📘 Bishop John Shelby Spong — Rescuing the Bible from Fundamentalism: https://www.harpercollins.com/products/rescuing-the-bible-from-fundamentalism-john-shelby-spongjohn-shelby-spong
🎧 The Nonviolent Jesus Podcast with Father John Dear: https://www.ncronline.org/news/nonviolent-jesus-podcast-john-dear
🪶 We’re Still Here — weekly Indigenous voices segment featuring Simon Moya-Smith (@simonsaidtakeapic) & Julie Francella (@juliefranciella): https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/were-still-here-with-simon-and-julie/id1464094232?i=1000723204916
🎧 Christian examples like John talking about their faith in public and how it determines their values @jamestalarico, @pete.buttigieg. Be like John, James & Peter.

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22. Pastor Joe Graves (United Methodist) – The Progressive Planter: Finding (and Building) the Church You Wish Existed

Mon, 13 Oct 2025 01:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 22. Pastor Joe Graves (United Methodist) – The Progressive Planter: Finding (and Building) the Church You Wish Existed

When so many are walking away from church, Pastor and Author Joe Graves (@josephdavidgraves) is reimagining what it can be—clear, inclusive, justice-rooted, and grounded in grace. From launching free stores and violence-reduction funds to writing The Progressive Planter, Joe shares how “clear is kind,” why progressives must move from gatekeeping to organizing, and how we can all help build the kind of faith community we’ve been longing for.

Together, Alexis & Joe dive into:

Why “clear is kind”: finding churches that state values up front (no bait-and-switch)
How the United Methodist Church holds a wide umbrella—largely contemporary, liturgical, and LGBTQ+ affirming
Deconstruction diversity: when one person still prays with hands laid on, and another has stopped praying altogether
Mental health as ministry—covering therapy sessions, normalizing care, and breaking stigma
How City View Church became an incubator for justice through Little Bottoms Free Store and the Columbus Violence Reduction Fund
The Methodist theology of prevenient grace—God’s love already everywhere
Why progressives must stop gatekeeping and start organizing around shared values

💡 Key Takeaways

Grace is everywhere—before, within, and beyond the walls of church.
Empathy is the heart of the gospel. The incarnation itself is “cosmic empathy.”
Progressives can disagree theologically yet work together for justice.

⛪ About Our Guest
Rev. Joe Graves, (he prefers Joe) is pastor of City View Church in Columbus, Ohio—a progressive United Methodist congregation formed through an innovative merger. He has helped launch or support 10+ new ministries across the Midwest and founded justice-centered initiatives including Little Bottoms Free Store and the Columbus Violence Reduction Fund.
🌐 Website: joegraves.org
🏛️ Church + sermons: cityviewcolumbus.org

📚 Resources Mentioned

God Didn’t Make Us to Hate Us — Rev. Lizzie McManus-Dail | IG: @rev.lizzie
The Bible for Normal People (podcast) | IG: @biblefornormalpeople @peteenns, @jaredbyas
The Progressive Planter: A Handbook for Ecclesial Entrepreneurs — Joe Graves (Abingdon Press) https://www.abingdonpress.com/product/9781791040116/
New Interpreter’s Bible Commentary
Columbus Violence Reduction Fund: cityviewcolumbus.org/give
Little Bottoms Free Store: https://www.littlebottoms.org/

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21. Malynda Hale (African Methodist Episcopal – AME) – Being the Good News

Mon, 06 Oct 2025 03:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 21. Malynda Hale (African Methodist Episcopal Church – AME) – Being the Good News

Alexis Rice welcomes artist-activist, writer, and Executive Director at The New Evangelicals @TheNewEvangelicals, Malynda Hale (@malyndahale) — raised in the joy and lift of the Black church. African Methodist Episcopal (AME) church is one of the oldest historically Black denominations in the U.S., born out of resistance, faith, and community. Malynda’s story is a beautiful window into this tradition. This conversation is a master class in a healthy, justice-shaped Christianity lived out loud.

With warmth and clarity, Malynda names what the left gets wrong about grace and messaging, shows how faith can inform politics without erasing pluralism, and invites us to be the good news.

🎧 Highlights:

AME roots: joy, uplift, belonging, and why she never had to “deconstruct”
Women preaching & leading without apology
“Spreading” vs. being the good news
Grace with standards: calling in without purity tests
Better messaging for the broad middle
Faith-informed politics without Christian nationalism
Why diversity is a spiritual gift
The story behind Malynda’s protest hymn “God and His Gun”

💬 Key Quotes

“People are so focused on spreading the good news when they should be focused on being the good news.”

💡 Key Takeaways

Love has teeth: grace is repair, responsibility, and welcome.
Simpler, human-first messaging connects; policy is pastoral when it protects people.
Pluralism strengthens witness: affirm your faith and your neighbor’s freedom.
Measure faith by its fruit: what we practice online/offline forms the public’s view of Jesus.

👤 About Our Guest
Malynda Hale is a singer-songwriter, activist, writer, and cultural commentator whose work braids art and justice. She is the Executive Director of The New Evangelicals and creates spaces for honest dialogue on race, faith, and the common good. Don’t miss her powerful protest hymn “God and His Gun.”

📚 Resources & Mentions

African Methodist Episcopal Church — @amechurchofficial
The New Evangelicals — @thenewevangelicals
Rep. James Talarico — @jamestalarico
United Church of Christ — @unitedchurchofchrist
Joan Osborne’s “What If God Was One of Us” — @joan_osborne
Jimmy Kimmel (studio story) — @jimmykimmellive,
@jimmykimmel

🎵 Music Notes

God and His Gun Music Video used with permission from Malynda Hale

#Christianity #deconstruction #ProgressiveChristianity #OpenAndAffirming #LetHerLead #AMEChurch #AfricanMethodistEpiscopal #FaithInAction #BelovedCommunity

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20. Brian Recker (Ex-Evangelical Pastor) – Hell Bent on Reclaiming Love

Mon, 29 Sep 2025 00:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 20. Brian Recker (Ex-Evangelical Pastor) – Hell Bent on Reclaiming Love

Alexis Rice welcomes Brian Recker (@berecker) — former evangelical pastor, founding voice of Beloved on Substack, and author of Hellbent: How the Fear of Hell Holds Christians Back from a Spirituality of Love (out Sept 30)

👉 Order on ThriftBooks

With honesty and pastoral clarity, Brian explores why hell-talk became the center of so many Christian upbringings—and how returning to Jesus’ core command to love can free our faith from fear, control, and gatekeeping.

Alexis and Brian dive into:

What fear-based theology does to kids and communities
Gehenna vs. “hell”: context, metaphor, and why it matters
Deconstruction without losing God—and why Brian stayed Christian
Leaving inerrancy, re-meeting Jesus, and finding church again
Worship as deeply human
Justice now vs. afterlife anxiety: building a world where love is in charge

💡 Key Takeaways

“Perfect love casts out fear” isn’t optional; fear-built faith produces punishment, not Christlike love
Reading Scripture with history, genre, and language (Gehenna/Sheol/Hades/Tartarus) expands—not erases—faith
The Kingdom of God is about this world’s flourishing, especially for the most vulnerable
Curiosity and honesty are spiritual practices; consent and freedom belong in our faith lives

👤 About Our Guest

Brian Recker is a former evangelical pastor turned writer and creator whose work centers love-forward, justice-rooted Christianity. He speaks widely on faith, deconstruction, and reimagining spirituality beyond fear.

📚 Resources Mentioned (with IG handles)

James H. Cone (The Cross and the Lynching Tree)
Marcus Borg (The Heart of Christianity, Jesus: A New Vision) — @mjbfound
bell hooks (All About Love) — @bellhooks_
Rob Bell (Love Wins) — @realrobbell
Rev. Darrell Goodwin (Executive Conference Minister, UCC) — @revdgoodwin
United Church of Christ — @unitedchurchofchrist

✨ Beyoncé @beyonce, John Legend @johnlegend, Jon Batiste @jonbatiste — if you’re listening, we’re ready for that Christian worship album. Please and thank you. 🎶🙌

#Christianity #deconstruction #ProgressiveChristianity #Exvangelical #TheSacredSlope

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19. Sara Groves (Singer-Songwriter) - Faith, Fruit of the Spirit, and a License to Love

Mon, 22 Sep 2025 00:00:00 -0000

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🎙 19. Sara Groves (Singer-Songwriter) – Faith, Fruit of the Spirit & a License to Love

🕊️ Reconciling Faith | 💜 Fruit of the Spirit | 🌱 Culture Care > Culture War | 🧠 Mental Health & Church

This episode is for anyone holding grief, doubt, and hope at the same time—longing to keep Jesus at the center when public witness fractures. It’s for those learning to absorb harm without returning it, to practice active peacemaking, and to choose culture care in their actual neighborhoods.

It’s also a gentle challenge to churches everywhere: love is the measure. Make space for complicated people to belong—and to heal.

💡 Key Takeaways
• “Without love” is the metric of Christian witness
• Pacifism isn’t passive—it’s active peacemaking like Jesus
• Culture care > culture war—tend the garden where you live
• Faith can mature from certainty to curiosity and stay centered on Christ

🙏 For Listeners Questioning, Lamenting, and Rebuilding
Sara reminds us that love is not a soft retreat—it’s the hard, holy work. We become people of reconciliation by practicing generosity, kindness, peace, and patience—especially in conflict.

⛪ About Our Guest
Sara Groves (IG: @grovesroad • Web: saragroves.com) is a Dove-nominated singer-songwriter whose catalog (Conversations, Add to the Beauty, Fireflies and Songs, Floodplain, What Makes It Through) has accompanied listeners through seasons of doubt and renewal. She co-founded Art House North in St. Paul and has long partnered with International Justice Mission. This year, Sara celebrates 25 years of Conversations and is recording four new songs.

📚 Resources & Mentions
• International Justice Mission — @ijm
• Art House North — @arthousenorth / arthousenorth.com
• John Inazu — @john.inazu
• Makoto Fujimura — @iamfujimura
• Charlie Peacock & Andi Ashworth — @andi_ashworth / arthouseamerica.com
• Henri Nouwen Society — @henrinouwensociety
• The Porter’s Gate — @theportersgate; Climate Vigil Songs: climatevigil.org/album
• Dan McClellan — @maklelan

🎵 Music on This Episode (Sara Groves)
“He’s Always Been Faithful,” “Roll to the Middle,” “Without Love,” “Hello, Lord,” “What I thought I Wanted”

🗓 What’s New with Sara
Conversations 25-year celebration + new studio tracks in progress

Go in peace, friends. May you find sacred ground wherever your questions lead, and may the fruit of the Spirit guide you this week. If you’re longing for community, may you be encouraged to find one that embraces your full, questioning, beautiful selves.

Music in this episode used with permission from Sara Groves

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18. Rev. Helen (Church of England) – From St. Phoebe to Today: Women as Leaders, Science & a Kinder Christianity

Tue, 16 Sep 2025 05:00:00 -0000

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🎙️18. Rev. Helen (Church of England) – From St. Phoebe to Today: Women as Leaders, Science & a Kinder Christianity

Alexis Rice welcomes Rev. Helen —a Church of England priest serving at St. Margaret’s, Ipswich—and our first guest from outside the United States. With warmth, candor, and a fierce pastoral heart, Rev. Helen shares how her late-in-life call to ministry grew from community, story, and wonder—and why an inclusive, justice-rooted Anglican faith speaks powerfully in today’s world. Stay til the end if you would like prayer.

Together, Alexis and Rev. Helen dive into:

How the Church of England works (parishes, bishops, General Synod) and the monarch’s role
Women in church leadership—from St. Phoebe (Romans 16) to women priests and bishops
Science & faith in the UK (Big Bang, evolution) vs. often evangelical creationism—and teaching kids the Bible with genre and context
Practicing an inclusive church for LGBTQ+ and neurodivergent people, and why visibility matters
Public perception of Christianity in Britain: “quiet revival,” everyday parish life, and service to the whole community
A UK view of U.S. Christian nationalism—and the hope of ordinary Christians choosing love over power
A pastoral prayer for listeners who need comfort, courage, and blessing

💡 Key Takeaways

There have always been women in leadership in the church—see Romans 16 and the early deacons and apostles.
Context isn’t compromise. Reading Scripture with history, culture, and genre in mind deepens faith.
Science and Christian faith aren’t enemies. Many UK Christians embrace both without tension.
Parish means everyone. The Church of England exists to serve the spiritual care of the whole neighbourhood.
Inclusion is pastoral, not political. An affirming, accessible church reflects the wide welcome of Jesus.
Hope looks like small, faithful acts—prayer, presence, and practical love multiplied in community.

⛪ About Our Guest
Rev. Helen Prior Townsend is an Anglican priest (Church of England) and Assistant Curate at St. Margaret’s Church, Ipswich. A liberal Anglo-Catholic, she weaves Godly Play, story, and sacrament into family ministry and champions women’s leadership, LGBTQ+ inclusion, and neurodiversity-affirming worship. Ordained in 2024 after serving as a Licensed Evangelist, she brings a grounded parish lens to life, liturgy, and public faith in the UK.

📚 Resources Mentioned

James Talarico @jamestalarico (Running for US Senate- Texas) https://jamestalarico.com/
St. Phoebe — woman serving and leading in the early church
Godly Play — nurturing children’s spiritual imagination through story and wonder
General Synod (Church of England) — how doctrine and practice are discerned and decided
Women’s Ordination in the C of E — priests since 1994; bishops since 2014
Inclusive Church Practices — welcoming LGBTQ+ and neurodivergent people as full participants in worship and leadership

Go in peace, friends

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17. Pastor Paul Drees (Lutheran) - Grace, Power & the Future of the Church

Mon, 08 Sep 2025 02:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 17. Pastor Paul Drees (Lutheran) - Grace, Power & the Future of the Church

This week, Alexis Rice welcomes Pastor Paul Drees (@pastorpauldrees)—a Lutheran pastor of a local church. His online ministry, begun in 2021 in response to church trauma and toxic theology, has since reached 90M+ video views and drawn 650K+ followers across TikTok, Instagram, YouTube, and Facebook.

Together, Alexis and Paul dive into:

Why grace comes first in Lutheran identity—communion as gift, not reward
How Christianity has gone wrong whenever it chooses power over sacrifice
The history of weaponized faith—from slavery to Christian nationalism today
Different views of hell in Christian history, and Paul’s perspective as an annihilationist
The role of a pastor in pointing us back to the gospel: “a different way is possible”
Why progressive Christians must show up online and reclaim public conversations about faith

💡 Key Takeaways

Grace is God’s gift from the beginning—we don’t earn it.
Communion is not a prize; it’s an open table of love.
Christianity’s witness falters when it seeks power instead of sacrifice.
Loving our enemies—including those we most resist—is the radical call of Jesus.
Progressive Christian voices must take up space in the digital and political commons.

⛪ About Our Guest
Pastor Paul Drees serves in the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA). A graduate of St. Olaf College and Luther Seminary, he combines parish ministry in Wisconsin with a bold online presence that challenges Christians to live faithfully, love radically, and resist injustice.

📚 Resources Mentioned

God Didn’t Make Us to Hate Us — Rev. Lizzie McManus-Dail | IG: @rev.lizzie
A Change of Habit — Sister Monica Clare | IG: @claudettemonica
Jesus and Nonviolence — Walter Wink
At the Altar of Wall Street — Scott W. Gustafson
Rep. James Talarico — Texas legislator and seminary student whose public faith inspires many | IG: @jamestalarico. James Talarico talking with Joe Rogan about his Christian faith and progressive politics: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/2352-james-talarico/id360084272?i=1000717982651

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16. Tim Whitaker (The New Evangelicals) – Rebuilding Faith Beyond Fundamentalism

Tue, 02 Sep 2025 15:00:00 -0000

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🎙 16. Tim Whitaker – Rebuilding Faith Beyond Fundamentalism

This week, Alexis welcomes Tim Whitaker @timwhitakerspeaks, founder and host of The New Evangelicals@thenewevangelicals, a digital-first community holding space for honesty, justice, and theological exploration. Tim’s story mirrors so many of ours: deep roots in white evangelical subculture, then courageous questions the old answers couldn’t hold—culminating in a movement inviting Christians into a wider house of faith.

We Explore

From “basement” faith to a bigger house: conservative upbringing (AWANA, missions, purity culture), cracks of doubt, and the books/voices that opened windows (Irresistible Revolution, Pagan Christianity, BibleProject).
The cost of conscience: losing a church role and friendships, and how grief gave way to healing.
Christian nationalism: Ten Commandments in schools, pluralism, and why symbolism-as-power misses Jesus’ Sermon on the Mount.
Good-faith dialogue: critiquing ideas, not people; refusing dehumanization.
Empathy isn’t a sin: why “toxic empathy” is propaganda, and why gospel-shaped empathy is essential.
Beyond deconstruction: letting anger tell the truth, then building something better.

💡 Key Takeaways

Accountability > “safety.” Real community risks hurt; healthy community repairs it.
Dehumanization is a red line. Hold convictions without mocking image-bearers.
Empathy is gospel-shaped. Love of neighbor demands proximity and policy concern.
Reconstruction matters. Tearing down isn’t the finish line; rebuilding with Jesus’ fruit is.

⛪ About Our Guest

Tim Whitaker is the founder of The New Evangelicals, a nonprofit creating pathways out of fundamentalism toward a Jesus-centered, justice-rooted faith. Through podcasts, content, and events, TNE models theology, good-faith dialogue, and a zero-dehumanization posture.

📚 Resources & Links

The New Evangelicals Podcast (Apple): https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-new-evangelicals-podcast/id1557794865
BibleProject Podcast: @thebibleproject
Shane Claiborne @shane.claiborne– The Irresistible Revolution
Frank Viola & George Barna – Pagan Christianity?
Scott Coley – Ministers of Propaganda: https://www.eerdmans.com/9781467466004/ministers-of-propaganda/
Theology Beer Camp (Homebrewed Christianity): @theologynerd

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15. Rev. Roberto Che Espinoza, PhD (Baptist) – Becoming Human With One Another

Mon, 25 Aug 2025 05:00:00 -0000

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🎙 15. Rev. Roberto Che Espinoza (Baptist) – Becoming Human With One Another

This week, Alexis Rice welcomes Rev. Dr. Roberto Che Espinoza, PhD (@drrobertoche), pastor, scholar, and founder of Activist Theology and Our Collective Becoming.

Alexis and Roberto explore:

Why oppositional politics fuels polarization—and how interdependence offers a better way
How embodiment and presence can reshape theology and ethics
Roberto’s call story: growing up in poverty and violence, finding home in the church, surviving abuse, and reclaiming his call to ministry
The painful reality of being pushed out of churches for living prophetically, and the hope of interspiritual community
What it means to become a stone catcher in a world of violence toward queer and trans people
How proximity, care, and hospitality can disrupt cycles of fear and build true solidarity

💡 Key Takeaways

Embodied presence is the starting point for repair
The fruit of the Spirit—not fear or exclusion—must guide Christian community
To follow Jesus is to risk proximity, solidarity, and radical love
Flourishing requires more than inclusion—it demands spaces where difference blooms

📚 Resources Mentioned

Activist Theology & Body Becoming — @drrobertoche
Queer Virtue — @elizabethedman
Survival Songs album — @derekwebb
Homebrewed Christianity — @theologynerd
Exvangelical — @brchastain
Straight White American Jesus — @straightwhitejc & @bbonishi
Work by Sarah Heath — @revsarahheath
The Bible for Normal People — @thebiblefornormalpeople

May you find sacred ground, may the fruit of the Spirit guide you. If you’re longing for community, may you be encouraged to find one that embraces your full, questioning, beautiful selves.

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14. Pastor Zach Lambert (Post-Evangelical) – Better Ways to Read the Bible

Mon, 18 Aug 2025 03:00:00 -0000

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🎙 14: Better Ways to Read the Bible — with Pastor Zach Lambert

This week, Alexis Rice welcomes Pastor Zach W. Lambert (@zachwlambert), founding pastor of Restore Austin and author of Better Ways to Read the Bible: Transforming a Weapon of Harm into a Tool of Healing.

Zach’s work calls us to examine the lenses we bring to Scripture. He argues that the Bible itself isn’t the problem—it’s the harmful interpretations that have been weaponized to silence women, justify racism, and marginalize LGBTQ+ people. Instead, he invites us to reclaim Scripture through the lens of flourishing, grounded in Jesus’ mission statement from John 10:10: “I came that they may have life, and have it abundantly.”

Together, Alexis and Zach explore:

Why flourishing, not fear, should guide biblical interpretation (Luke 4, Matthew 25, John 10:10)
How to walk through deconstruction and reconstruction faithfully—like Jesus with the disciples on the road to Emmaus
Raising kids in faith with curiosity and honesty, rather than dogma
The urgent need for progressive Christians to reclaim Scripture and faith language from those who distort it

Zach also shares his personal journey from college athlete to pastor, the founding of Restore Austin, and why he believes pastors must speak out against the weaponization of faith while building spaces of love, joy, and hope.

💡 Key Takeaways

The Bible is not inherently harmful—our interpretive lenses matter
Deconstruction is not abandonment of faith but a biblical, ongoing process
Progressive Christians must reclaim Scripture, faith, and even patriotism from harmful ideologies
Healthy discipleship nurtures curiosity in both adults and children
Our role as Christians is to create communities of flourishing that naturally critique cruelty and injustice

⛪ About Our Guest
Pastor Zach W. Lambert (@zachwlambert) is the founding pastor of Restore Austin, co-founder of the Post-Evangelical Collective, and a doctoral student at Duke Divinity School. A graduate of Fuller Seminary, Zach has been a faithful pastoral voice for those deconstructing harmful versions of Christianity. His writing appears on Substack, and his sermons and resources can be found at restoreaustin.org.

📚 Resources Mentioned

Better Ways to Read the Bible by Zach W. Lambert — @zachwlambert
Inspired and Searching for Sunday by Rachel Held Evans — @rachelheldevans (legacy account)
The Bible for Normal People podcast by Pete Enns & Jared Byas — @thebiblefornormalpeople, @peteenns, @jaredbyas

Go in peace, friends

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13. Semler (Singer-Songwriter) - Faith, Queerness, and Why Sometimes the Most Rebellious Act of All Is Staying

Tue, 12 Aug 2025 23:00:00 -0000

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🎙 13. Semler (Singer-Songwriter) – Faith, Queerness, and Why Sometimes the Most Rebellious Act of All Is Staying

🌈 Faith & Courage | Music as Resistance

Semler @gracebaldridge made history when their independent release Preacher’s Kid became the first openly queer Christian album to reach #1 on the iTunes Christian charts—an accomplishment they repeated with Late Bloomer. Semler has toured nationally, including alongside Relient K in 2022, performed an NPR Tiny Desk Concert, and attended the 2022 Dove Awards as a visible queer Christian artist in a space where LGBTQ+ inclusion still remains contested. Featured in Rolling Stone (@rollingstone), Religion News Service (@religionnews), and The Advocate (@ouradvocate), Semler continues to spark conversations that challenge the boundaries of Christian music and faith communities. In 2025, Semler released their debut full-length album, Revival in My Mind, expanding their spiritual and musical landscape.

Semler’s music and witness stand in the long tradition of faithful resistance—holding fast to God while refusing to bow to theologies that harm, and showing the church a bigger, more loving way forward. Fierce, vulnerable, and wise, Semler is just who we need in this time to help us see a fuller picture of the Body of Christ and teach us how to love better.

This episode is for anyone who’s been told they can’t be both queer and Christian—and for friends, pastors, and families who want to better stand with those who are marginalized, disrespected, or dehumanized. It’s for those wrestling with weaponized theology, searching for God beyond exclusion, and longing for a faith that protects rather than harms.

It’s also a call to church spaces where harm is still justified as “biblical.” History shows us that this label has been used to defend injustice—slavery, segregation, apartheid, bans on interracial marriage, silencing women, and shaming abuse survivors. Every one was wrong. Anti-LGBTQ theology is simply the newest iteration of that same bigotry. Our calling as Christians is not to defend fear, but to bear the fruit of love, humility, and compassion.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Queerness and Christianity are not contradictions
• Music can dismantle shame and open dialogue
• The Christian music industry still resists LGBTQ+ inclusion
• Curiosity, not fear, deepens faith

📚 Resources & Mentions
• 🌿 Music in this episode from Semler: (Faith, Jesus from Texas, Bethlehem) Revival in My Mind – @gracebaldridge
• Derek Webb – @derekwebb
• John Foreman / Switchfoot – @jonforeman / @switchfoot
• Jennifer Knapp – @jenniferknappmusic
• Relient K – @reliantk

Music in this episode by Semler

Go in peace, friends

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12. Pastor Joe Smith (Non-Denominational) - Reclaiming Faith from Christian Nationalism

Thu, 07 Aug 2025 03:00:00 -0000

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🎙 12. Pastor Joe Smith (Non-Denominational) - Reclaiming Faith from Christian Nationalism

Alexis Rice is joined by Pastor Joe Smith IG @therealjoe.smith — a bold and unflinching voice reclaiming Christianity from white Christian nationalism, spiritual manipulation, and cultural complacency. Known for his viral sermons and fearless online ministry, Joe shares his journey from fundamentalism to liberation—and how he uses his privilege as daily repentance for the harm he once enabled.

Together, they explore what it means to deconstruct in community, how to raise boys with a healthy model of masculinity, and why now is a Bonhoeffer moment for the American church. With raw vulnerability and prophetic fire, Joe calls Christians to choose: Will we stand with Jesus at the edge of the cliff—or be part of the mob trying to throw him off?

This episode is for anyone who’s questioned the church but still longs for Jesus, for those grieving the loss of community, and for all who are seeking a braver, freer, more Christlike faith.

💡 Key Takeaways

White Christian nationalism is a distortion of Jesus’ message
Deconstruction is not just personal—it’s communal and sacred
The American church often rewards manipulation over integrity
Healthy masculinity must replace the “UFC Jesus” culture
Faith can survive—even thrive—on the other side of certainty

⛪ About Our Guest
Pastor Joe Smith (@therealjoe.smith) is a non-denominational pastor and the lead pastor of Shift GNV in Gainesville, Florida, currently merging into a new spiritual community called Maison—rooted in love, justice, and inclusion.

Raised in the Free Will Baptist tradition and trained at a fundamentalist Bible college, Joe spent decades inside the American evangelical system before publicly deconstructing his faith from the pulpit. Today, he’s known for preaching a gospel that centers the marginalized, confronts abusive power, and calls the church to account.

Joe is also a husband, dad, and history buff who draws inspiration from the civil rights movement, John Lewis, and Dietrich Bonhoeffer.

📚 Resources Mentioned

Jesus for President by Shane Claiborne — @shane.claiborne
Rob Bell (author/speaker) — @realrobbell
Christopher L. Heuertz — @chrisheuertz
Rep. Angie Nixon — @angieforfl
Shift GNV Church and Podcast — @shifthappenspodcast_
Meizon Church (launching soon)

Go in peace, friends. May you find a faith that speaks truth to power, holds space for healing, and follows Jesus all the way to the margins.

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11. Rev. Joseph Yoo (Episcopal) – Reconstructing Faith After It All Falls Apart

Wed, 30 Jul 2025 03:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 11. Rev. Joseph Yoo (Episcopal) – Reconstructing Faith After It All Falls Apart

Alexis Rice is joined by Rev. Joseph Yoo @joseph.yoo — a priest and writer whose honest, funny, and deeply human reflections have connected with millions online. Together, they explore what happens when the certainty of faith collapses, why deconstruction isn’t a trend but often a lonely and costly journey, and how healing, community, and curiosity can guide the process of rebuilding something real.

Joe shares stories from seminary, growing up as a pastor’s kid in an immigrant family, and navigating life as a Korean American priest in a denomination still learning to embrace diversity. This episode is for anyone who's asking, Can I still be a Christian if I don’t believe everything I used to? It’s for those who’ve lost their community but not their longing—and for those wondering if it’s possible to create a faith that feels honest, expansive, and rooted in love.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Deconstruction is holy—but it often hurts
• Rebuilding faith takes time, questions, and community
• Asian American Christians navigate unique tensions in certain church cultures
• You don’t need certainty to follow Jesus—just curiosity and love
• Social media ministry can be sacred, subversive, and healing

⛪ About Our Guest
Rev. Joseph Yoo @joseph.yoo is an Episcopal priest, speaker, and author based in Texas, where he pastors Mosaic Episcopal Church—an inclusive, LGBTQ+‑affirming spiritual home for skeptics, seekers, and the spiritually bruised.

Raised in both Korean and American church contexts, Rev. Joe has served in United Methodist and Episcopal traditions and brings a rare blend of cross-cultural insight, pastoral honesty, and wit. He’s the author of When the Saints Go Flying In, a collection of theological reflections rooted in personal story.

Joe holds a B.A. in Psychology from the University of Hawai’i at Mānoa and a Master of Divinity from Wesley Theological Seminary in Washington, DC. He’s also a husband, dad, a pop culture junkie, and a reluctant TikTok star whose humor and depth have made him one of the internet’s most relatable clergy voices.

📚 Resources Mentioned
• When the Saints Go Flying In by Rev. Joseph Yoo
• Mosaic Episcopal Church — https://www.mosaicpearland.org/
• Brené Brown — IG @brenebrown • Joseph Yoo - https://josephyoo.com/
• Shane Claiborne - IG @shane.claiborne

Go in peace, friends. May you find a faith that makes room for your questions, a community that honors your wholeness, and a God who walks with you every step of the way.

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10. Jon Guerra (Singer-Songwriter) – Restoring Wonder and Finding God in the Quiet

Thu, 24 Jul 2025 06:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 10. Jon Guerra (Singer-Songwriter) – Restoring Wonder and Finding God in the Quiet

This episode is for anyone aching for a faith that welcomes mystery and makes space for honest lament. It’s for the ones who crave connection with God but can’t stomach the noise of easy answers—or who need permission to slow down, to rest, and to bring their whole, complicated selves to the sacred.

It’s also a gentle challenge to churches: rediscover the power of silence and let your worship make room for sorrow, wonder, and the untamed Jesus who upends our expectations.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Healing spiritual music invites us to stillness, not spectacle
• Lament, beauty, and questions all belong in the life of faith
• Jesus refused to be co-opted by power—his words still disrupt and console
• The story of Christ is wide enough for doubters, exiles, and those in process

🙏 For Listeners Longing for Depth, Rest, and Belonging
Jon reminds us: you don’t have to resolve all your questions to show up in worship. God meets us in the mystery.

“What makes something Christian isn’t that it’s neat and tidy right now. What makes something Christian is that it’s pointed toward Christ—whatever shape it’s in.”

He also shares the heart behind his latest album, Jesus, and the songs “American Gospel” and “Citizens”—music born out of wrestling with empire, lament, and hope. We talk bicultural identity, climate vigil songs, the gift of quiet, and why caretaking (for the earth and for each other) is holy work.

⛪ About Our Guest
Jon Guerra @iamjonguerra is a singer-songwriter known for devotional, justice-focused music that refuses easy answers. His albums—Keeper of Days, Ordinary Ways, and Jesus—offer solace for Christians, regardless of if they are evangelical, deconstructing, or weary believers. He also has collaborated with The Porter’s Gate on Climate Vigil Songs and composes for film with his wife, Valerie.

Music in this episode from Jon Guerra: Jesus, American Gospel, Citizens, Love your Enemies

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9. Jeremy Steele (United Methodist) – A Deep Skeptic and Also a Pastor Talks About How to Not Suck as a Christian

Sun, 13 Jul 2025 15:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 9. Jeremy Steele (United Methodist) – A Deep Skeptic and Also a Pastor Talks About How to Not Suck as a Christian

How to Not Suck as a Christian — with Jeremy Steele

Alexis is joined by Jeremy Steele — bestselling author, viral TikTok creator, and United Methodist pastor known for radical honesty and spiritual skepticism. Jeremy’s online community, NotChurch, is a safe harbor for agnostics, mystics, post-evangelicals, and anyone who’s done with fear-based faith but still seeking connection, meaning, and a purpose bigger than themselves.

Jeremy shares how he navigates doubt and faith as a pastor, why “deconstruction” shouldn’t be a dirty word, and what happens when we tell the truth about our doubts, spiritual wounds, and longing for a better way to be Christian. They dig into the legacy of apologetics, the damage of certainty culture, how church and brain science shape faith, and what the Book of Revelation is (and isn’t) really about.

This episode is for anyone who’s wrestled with faith, been told they don’t belong, or just wants a little more grace for themselves—and everyone else.

💡 Key Takeaways

Doubt isn’t failure; it’s honest faith.
Christianity has always held many voices—don’t settle for a single story.
Academic consensus in biblical scholarship matters—don’t just trust the loudest voice.
Healthy spiritual community heals what harmful church can’t.
The Bible wasn’t meant to be a weapon.
Revelation is not a rapture manual!
You are allowed to question, grieve, and begin again.

⛪ About Our Guest
Jeremy Steele- https://jeremy-steele.com/
Instagram & TikTok: @skeptic.pastor
NotChurch
Author of How to Not Suck as a Christian (the audiobook that he reads is so good)

📚 Resources Mentioned

How to Not Suck as a Christian by Jeremy Steele: https://www.amazon.com/How-Not-Suck-as-Christian/dp/1964252334
NotChurch Community
Society for Biblical Literature: https://www.sbl-site.org/
SBL Study Bible: https://www.augsburgfortress.org/store/product/9781506492248/Society-of-Biblical-Literature-Study-Bible
Data Over Dogma Podcast (Dan McClellan & Dan Beecher): https://www.youtube.com/@dataoverdogma
Pete Enns- Bible Scholar: https://thebiblefornormalpeople.com/about-pete-enns/
Instagram: @peteenns, @thebiblefornormalpeople
TikTok: @ptrnns
Dan McClellan- Bible Scholar
TikTok & Instagram: @maklelan
Theology Beer Camp with Tripp Fuller: https://theologybeer.camp/
United Methodist Church: https://www.umc.org/en/

Go in peace, friends. May your questions become the doorway to deeper faith. May you find comfort even in the not-knowing, and may you remember: God’s love was never something you had to earn.

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8. Christi Bolaños (Non-Denominational) – A Testimony of Bravery, Anger, and Reclaiming a Bigger God

Wed, 09 Jul 2025 04:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 8. Christi Bolaños (Non-Denominational) – A Testimony of Bravery, Anger, and Reclaiming a Bigger God

Alexis is joined by Christi Bolaños — an ER nurse, adoptive mom of seven, and lifelong Christian whose fierce love for Jesus has carried her through heartbreak, injustice, and a faith that had to break open to hold it all.

In this episode, Christi shares how moments of childhood courage shaped her deep commitment to justice, how her family’s decision to adopt shattered her savior complex, and how the “sacred slope” of deconstruction helped her discover a God big enough for all her questions — and all her rage.

They talk about anger as holy fuel, learning to love people beyond success stories, and why standing against Christian nationalism is not a betrayal of faith, but a return to it. Christi’s story is raw, beautiful, and lit with joy, even in the dark.

This episode is for anyone who’s ever sat alone at recess, questioned their calling, or wondered whether their heartbreak could still be holy ground.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Bravery begins in small acts of resistance
• Anger can be sacred when surrendered to Jesus
• Love doesn’t mean rescuing — it means staying
• The “slippery slope” of deconstruction might just be sacred
• The fruit of the Spirit is a better litmus test than any purity code

⛪ About Our Guest
Christi Bolaños (@christibolanos) is a Pittsburgh-based ER nurse, adoptive mom of seven, and former house parent to more than 70 foster youth. She studied Religious Studies and Philosophy at Westmont College with a focus on feminist and liberation theology. She brings a lived theology of justice, joy, and showing up — even when it costs you everything.

📚 Resources Mentioned
• The Very Good Gospel by @lisasharper
• Migrant God by Isaac Villegas www.isaacvillegas.com (Westmont alum, theologian of immigration justice)
• “All That I Can Say” by David Crowder — @crowder
• Rev. Mariann Budde — Episcopal bishop of Washington D.C. @mariannbudde

#Christianity #Deconstruction #ProgressiveChristianity #FosterCare #FaithAndJustice #FaithAfterEvangelicalism #OpenAndAffirming #MentalHealth #TheSacredSlope #FruitOfTheSpirit #LGBTQ #Exvangelical #Adoption #WomenInLeadership #WomenInMinistry #LetHerLead

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7. Rev. Lizzie McManus-Dail (Episcopal) – God Didn’t Make Us to Hate Us

Thu, 26 Jun 2025 00:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 7. Rev. Lizzie McManus-Dail (Episcopal) – God Didn’t Make Us to Hate Us

Alexis is joined by Rev. Lizzie — an Episcopal priest, digital minister, & founding vicar of Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX. Her new devotional, God Didn’t Make Us to Hate Us, is a healing and pastoral 40-day companion for those reclaiming their faith after spiritual harm.

They explore how deconstruction can lead to delight, why queer joy is sacred, & how the church has always included women as leaders—despite what some traditions might claim. Rev. Lizzie shares stories of raising her kids with spiritual wonder, showing up online as a playful priest, & building an affirming church rooted in liberation and joy.

This episode is for anyone who’s ever wondered if they had to earn God’s love—or feared they lost it. It’s for those who’ve walked away, still long for connection, or are raising a new generation of curious hearts.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Joy is a spiritual discipline—not a distraction
• God’s love isn’t earned—it’s already yours
• Women have always led in the church
• You can be queer, faithful, and deeply beloved by God
• The Fruit of the Spirit matters more than purity codes
• Parenting through faith shifts invites curiosity, not fear

⛪ About Our Guest
Father Lizzie McManus-Dail (@rev.lizzie) is an Episcopal priest and founding vicar of Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX — https://jubileeaustin.org.
She holds degrees from Mount Holyoke College and Duke Divinity School, and completed her Anglican formation at Seminary of the Southwest. Rev. Lizzie is a mother, wife, preacher, and digital priest whose ministry uplifts joy, liberation, & the wildly inclusive love of God.

📚 Resources Mentioned
• God Didn’t Make Us to Hate Us by Rev. Lizzie McManus-Dail
• Dare to Lead by Brené Brown — @brenebrown
• Womanist Midrash by Rev. Dr. Wil Gafney — https://www.wilgafney.com/
• Red Lip Theology by Candice Benbow — @candicebenbow
• The Book of Belonging by Mariko Clark — @thebookofbelonging, @marikoclark
• Dr. Roberto Che Espinoza — @drrobertoche
• Homebrewed Christianity podcast @theologynerd with Tripp Fuller @trippfuller
• ChurchClarity.org — https://www.churchclarity.org (find O&A, women in leadership churches)
• Archbishop Desmond Tutu — https://www.tutu.org.za
• And Also With You podcast @andalsowithyoupodcast w/Rev. Lizzie & Rev. Laura Di Panfilo @laura.peaches
• Father Emmanuel Katongole — https://theology.nd.edu/people/emmanuel-katongole/

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6. Derek Webb (Singer-Songwriter) – Holding Complexity: Queer Solidarity, Art, and Faith After Certainty

Mon, 23 Jun 2025 03:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 6. Derek Webb (Singer-Songwriter) – Holding Complexity: Queer Solidarity, Art, and Faith After Certainty
🕊️ Music as Resistance | Queer Solidarity | Faith After Certainty

This episode is for anyone who's ever tried to sort through the rubble of their faith and wondered if anything worth keeping could survive. It’s for the ones who still ache for Jesus but can’t return to the version they were handed—and for those learning to stand with the marginalized, even when the cost is high.

It’s also a challenge to churches everywhere: to stop confusing safety with silence—and to make space for complicated people to belong.

💡 Key Takeaways
• A faith audit is not a crisis—it’s a spiritual practice
• Certainty often leads to control, not connection
• Marginalized people show us where Jesus would be
• You don’t have to simplify yourself to be worthy of love

🙏 For Listeners Questioning, Dismantling, and Rebuilding
Derek reminds us that doubt isn’t dangerous—refusing to engage is.

“The practice of spirituality is to never stop trying to kill all the gods you identify… until you find one you can’t.”

A regular audit of your beliefs—especially about invisible and unknowable things—is not just helpful; it’s necessary.

He also shares the story behind his newest project, Survival Songs — an album written in honor of and in deep solidarity with members of the LGBTQ+ community. Inspired by the voices of queer and trans friends and family, this record is both a soundtrack for survival and a love letter to those who’ve been told they don’t belong in the church or in their own skin.

⛪ About Our Guest
Derek Webb @derekwebb is a veteran singer-songwriter whose work spans decades of spiritual searching, cultural critique, and artistic evolution. A founding member of Caedmon’s Call and longtime solo artist, Derek’s albums (Fingers Crossed, The Jesus Hypothesis, Survival Songs) interrogate faith, justice, empire, and identity. Survival Songs is his most personal and community-centered record yet—made for and with LGBTQ+ friends navigating faith, identity, and survival in 2025.

📚 Resources Mentioned
• Survival Songs by Derek Webb
• Church Clarity — https://churchclarity.org @churchclarity
• The Sin of Certainty by Pete Enns — https://peteenns.com/the-sin-of-certainty @peteenns
• The Bible for Normal People podcast — https://thebiblefornormalpeople.com @thebiblefornormalpeople
• 1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture — https://1946 themovie.com @1946themovie
• Jennifer Knapp — https://jenniferknapp.com @jenniferknappmusic

Music on this episode from Derek Webb: Survival Songs

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5. Rev. Darrell Goodwin (United Church of Christ - UCC) - The God of Our Wildest Dreams

Mon, 16 Jun 2025 05:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 5. Rev. Darrell Goodwin (United Church of Christ - UCC) - The God of Our Wildest Dreams

This episode is for every queer person who was told “not you,” and for anyone who’s ever wondered if God could still be safe after the church became a source of pain. It’s for the seekers, the wounded, the deconstructing—and those finding their way back to faith with new eyes.

It’s also a powerful call to churches everywhere: to create spaces where people can heal, belong, and believe again.

💡 Key Takeaways
• The God of fear is not the God of liberation
• Queer people carry profound spiritual gifts
• Deconstruction often begins with heartbreak—and leads to freedom
• Scripture invites questioning, not control
• True pastoral integrity requires honesty, even before we’re ready
• Churches must mean it when they say, “Come as you are”
• Liberation means right relationship—with self, God, and others

🙏 For Listeners Healing from Church Hurt
Rev. Goodwin challenges listeners: sometimes you have to stop believing in the God who made you feel small or afraid in order to encounter the God of your wildest dreams.

⛪ About Our Guest
Rev. Darrell Goodwin (@revdgoodwin) is the Executive Conference Minister for the Southern New England Conference of the United Church of Christ (@unitedchurchofchrist). He is the first openly Black Queer person to serve in this role, where he oversees more than 600 congregations. A powerful preacher, seminary educator, and pastoral leader, Rev. Goodwin holds degrees from Boston College, the University of Vermont, Seattle University, and is a doctoral candidate at San Francisco Theological Seminary.

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4. Rev. Dr. Chris Davies (United Church of Christ- UCC) – Queer Proclamation and Liberation

Mon, 19 May 2025 16:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 4. Rev. Dr. Chris Davies (United Church of Christ- UCC) – Queer Proclamation and Liberation

This episode is a love letter to the queer people who’ve expanded my understanding of God, faith, and love. It’s a balm for harm caused by Christian communities—and a tribute to the beauty and wisdom you bring to faith. It’s also for every Christian striving to walk in love: an invitation to listen, grow, and reclaim faith as a force for healing, not harm.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Queer theology imagines God beyond binaries
• Deconstruction happens in community
• Trauma is valid but doesn’t define you
• Faith can harm, but it can also heal
• Children’s theology begins with story and dignity
• Change grows through relationship—not shame
• We’re wounded healers doing holy work together

🙏 For Queer Listeners
"You are not broken. You are not too hard to love. You are beloved by God in the fullness of who you are." — Rev. Dr. Chris Davies

⛪ About Our Guest
Rev. Dr. Chris Davies (@revdrchris) is a queer femme pastor, spiritual leader, and VP of Organizing, Innovation & Strategic Initiatives at the national office of the United Church of Christ (@unitedchurchofchrist). She holds an M.Div. from Yale Divinity School (@yaletheology) and a D.Min. from Andover Newton Seminary at Yale. Chris is known for spiritual depth, creative leadership, and inclusive Christian practice.

📚 Resources Mentioned
• Church Clarity — churchclarity.org (@churchclarity)
• Rainbow Theology by Patrick Cheng — churchpublishing.org/rainbowtheology (@queertheology)
• “Queer Water Carrier” by Peterson Toscano — qspirit.net/queer-water-carrier (@p2son)
• The Wounded Healer by Henri Nouwen — henrinouwen.org (@henrinouwen)
• Papa's Coming Home by Chasten Buttigieg — papas-coming-home.com (@chasten.buttigieg @pete.buttigieg)
• The Family Book by Todd Parr — toddparr.com/books/the-family-book (@toddparr)
• Emergent Strategy by adrienne maree brown — adriennemareebrown.net (@adriennemareebrown)
• Building Up a New World — thepilgrimpress.com/products/building-up-a-new-world
• God Didn’t Make Us to Hate Us by Rev. Lizzie McManus-Dail — penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683 (@fatherlizzie)
• Our Whole Lives (UCC/UU curriculum) — ucc.org/what-we-do/justice-local-church-ministries/justice/our-whole-lives/

Go in peace, friends. May you find sacred ground wherever your questions lead—and may the Spirit’s fruit guide you this week. If you’re longing for community, may you be encouraged to find one that embraces your full, beautiful selves.

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3. Rev. Amber Evans (Episcopal) – Spiritual Direction and Sacred Shifts

Mon, 12 May 2025 15:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 3. Rev. Amber Evans (Episcopal) – Spiritual Direction and Sacred Shifts

In this episode, Alexis sits down with her own spiritual director, Rev. Amber Evans—an Episcopal priest, preacher, and guide for the spiritually curious. Together, they explore what happens when foundational beliefs begin to shift, when certainty gives way to curiosity, and when God shows up outside the lines we were given.

They talk biblical interpretation beyond literalism, LGBTQ+ inclusion, and how the Episcopal Church honors scripture, tradition, and reason in balance. Amber also shares mystical stories from her call to ministry, her experience leaving evangelical literalism behind, and how spiritual practices like contemplative prayer and praying with the news can help us stay grounded during disorientation.

This episode is for those grieving the faith they once knew, feeling spiritually homeless, or wondering if God can still be found in this sacred unknown.

💡 Key Takeaways
• The Bible is sacred—and also shaped by history, worldview, and symbol
• Literalism isn’t the only faithful way to read scripture
• LGBTQ+ individuals are fully affirmed in many church traditions
• Hard questions aren’t a slippery slope—they’re a sacred invitation
• The Episcopal Church values scripture, tradition, and reason equally
• Prayer can look like art, stillness, movement—or even reading the news
• There is a church out there that affirms your full humanity

⛪ About Our Guest
Rev. Amber Evans (@revamberevans) is the vicar of Holy Family Episcopal Church in Half Moon Bay, CA — https://holyfamilyhmb.org (@holyfamilyhmb).
She is a preacher, spiritual director, and pastoral presence for those navigating faith transitions. Amber earned her Master of Divinity from Church Divinity School of the Pacific — https://cdsp.edu (@cdspberkeley) and serves in the Episcopal Diocese of California (@episcopaldiocal).

Amber leads with compassion, mysticism, and a deep commitment to inclusive spiritual practice.

📚 Resources Mentioned
• The Revelatory Text by Sondra Schneiders — https://litpress.org/Products/3130/The-Revelatory-Text
• Love Poems from God (World mystical poetry anthology) — https://www.amazon.com/Love-Poems-God-Daniel-Ladinsky/dp/0142196126
• Richard Rohr's Daily Meditations (Center for Action and Contemplation) — https://cac.org/daily-meditations/ (@cacradicalgrace)
• Chelan Harkin (Modern mystical poetry) — https://chelanharkin.com (@chelanharkinpoetry)
• Praying in Color by Sybil MacBeth — https://prayingincolor.com

Go in peace, friends. May you find sacred ground wherever your questions lead, and may the fruit of the Spirit guide you this week. If you’re longing for community, may you be encouraged to find one that embraces your full, questioning, beautiful selves.

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2. Lindsay & Tommy Airey (Post-Evangelical) – Testimonies of Liberation, Deconstruction, and Holy Resistance

Wed, 07 May 2025 17:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 2. Lindsay & Tommy Airey (Post-Evangelical) – Testimonies of Liberation, Deconstruction, and Holy Resistance

Alexis sits down with longtime friends and spiritual companions Lindsay and Tommy Airey to talk about reclaiming faith, resisting empire, and rediscovering a gospel rooted in justice and liberation.

Raised in evangelical culture shaped by mission trips, purity pledges, and rapture-ready theology, Lindsay and Tommy trace their journey from fear-based fundamentalism to liberating spirituality. They explore spiritual trauma, activism, ancestral connection, and decolonization—and why the gospel still matters.

This episode is for those deconstructing, grieving, organizing, and dreaming of a faith that builds a freer world.

💡 Key Takeaways
• Evangelicalism taught us to distrust our gut—liberation theology helps us reclaim it
• Deconstruction is not the end—it’s the beginning of healing
• We must move from personal repentance to collective liberation
• Black and Indigenous traditions offer roadmaps for resisting empire
• Lectio Divina, ancestor work, and embodied faith transform theology
• Jesus shows up in protests, rituals, and resistance—not just churches

⛪ About Our Guests
Lindsay and Tommy Airey (@soulaccompaniment) are writers, spiritual companions, and co-leaders of Kardia Kaiomenē — https://kardiakaiomene.blogspot.com — a ministry in Detroit cultivating liberatory spiritual practice.
Tommy is author of Descending Like a Dove — https://www.amazon.com/dp/1725274133 — and writes at https://soulaccompaniment.substack.com.
They’re also part of the Radical Discipleship Network — https://radicaldiscipleship.net — and organizers with Christians for a Free Palestine — https://christiansforafreepalestine.com.

📚 Resources & Voices Mentioned
• The Cross and the Lynching Tree by James Cone
• Sister Outsider by Audre Lorde
• Dr. Wil Gafney — https://www.wilgafney.com (@drgafney)
• Black Womanist Ethics by Delores Williams
• Sabbath as Resistance by Walter Brueggemann
• The Powers That Be by Walter Wink
• Ched Myers — https://chedmyers.org (@chedmyers)
• Jim Perkinson
• Bill Wylie-Kellermann

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1. Rev. Dr. Ginny Brown Daniel (United Church of Christ - UCC) - Reclaiming Faith Beyond Fundamentalism

Thu, 01 May 2025 17:00:00 -0000

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🎙️ 1. Rev. Dr. Ginny Brown Daniel (United Church of Christ - UCC) - Reclaiming Faith Beyond Fundamentalism

Welcome to The Sacred Slope—where the slippery slope becomes sacred ground.
Alexis sits down with Rev. Dr. Ginny Brown Daniel—pastor, activist, and prophetic voice for justice—to talk about reclaiming faith beyond fundamentalism. Rooted in her Southern Baptist upbringing and leadership in the UCC, Ginny shares her journey of deconstruction, insights on sin and hell, and unwavering support for the LGBTQIA+ community.

This conversation brings both healing and heat—a journey through grief, truth-telling, and hope for a more courageous church.

💡 Key Takeaways
• We are all created in God’s image—loved, good, and whole
• Fundamentalism and nationalism distort the Gospel
• Faith is lived through community, justice, and love
• Many churches affirm LGBTQIA+ people and reproductive justice
• Jesus stood with the oppressed—not the powerful
• Deconstruction invites us to co-create freer faith

⛪ About Today’s Guest
Rev. Dr. Ginny Brown Daniel is interim pastor at the Congregational Church of Austin, UCC (@uccaustin).
A former Baptist, she holds degrees from Auburn University (@auburnu), Baptist Theological Seminary at Richmond (@btsrva), and Union Presbyterian Seminary (@unionseminary).
She has pastored churches in Maryland, Texas, and Missouri, and once ran for the Texas House of Representatives. Ginny is a passionate advocate for justice, inclusion, and spiritual integrity.

📍 Featured Topics
• Leaving Southern Baptist fundamentalism
• Progressive views on sin and hell
• Harms of Christian nationalism
• Creating LGBTQIA+ affirming spaces
• Reimagining the Trinity through feminist theology
• Churches supporting reproductive freedom
• Why justice-rooted faith still matters

🕊️ Quotes
“You are created in God’s image. You are loved, you are good, and you are whole.”
“Hell is what we create here—through harm, greed, and fear.”
“I believe resurrection Christianity is coming.”

📚 Resources Mentioned
• Nadia Bolz-Weber @sarcasticlutheran
• Dr. Wilda Gafney @drgafney
• Sweet Honey in the Rock @sweethoneyintherock
• Stacey Abrams (@staceyabrams)
→ Assembly Required (Crooked Media, @crookedmedia)
• Mary Oliver
• Anne Lamott
• Nikki Giovanni
• ChurchClarity.org (@churchclarity) — https://www.churchclarity.org
→ A database that scores churches on clarity around LGBTQ+ inclusion, women in leadership, and more

Go in peace, friends. May you find sacred ground wherever your questions lead, and may the Spirit’s fruit guide you this week. If you’re longing for community, may you be encouraged to find one that embraces your full, beautiful selves.

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Trailer - The Sacred Slope Podcast

Tue, 25 Mar 2025 15:00:00 -0000

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Community Guidelines
If we claim to follow Jesus, we should be known by our love — not by what we say, wear, or perform, but by the fruit of the Spirit:
❤️ love, 💫 joy, ☮️ peace, 🕊 patience, 💝 kindness, 🌿 goodness, 🙏 faithfulness, 🤲 gentleness, and 💪 self-control.
Let our words online and our actions offline reflect that love.
🕊️ Let this space be shaped by it.

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