In this half-year review, Christian and Ayelet skip the dry stats read and get into the nitty-gritty: what H1 2026 actually looked like, where the premium is really going, and their favorite (and least favorite) deals of Q2. Christian leads a fast market update, Ayelet unveils her "star quality thesis" on what commands a premium now, and they close with the deals that mattered.

What we cover:

→ The market update: ~335 deals in Q2, ad tech public stocks up ~30%, and why it's a "bifurcated recovery"

→ Current valuation ranges by category: marketing services (~8.87x EBITDA median), scaled ad tech (~4.9x revenue), digital media/martech (~2.2x EV), and commerce software (2x to 16.9x ARR)

→ Why the revenue-multiple spread shows money still leaning hard toward tech-led businesses

→ Why 70% of Q2 deals were strategic-led, and how record-long PE hold periods (~32,500 companies waiting to exit) are shaping the market

→ Ayelet's "star quality thesis": why scale and measurable results are now table stakes, and the risk factor that actually makes a business the "it girl" → Why you need a clear, account-level value-creation thesis signed at LOI, and the discipline to stick to it instead of going "all cowboy"

→ Favorite deal: Mar4 Media / Ad Results Media, and why a 25-year audio specialist is a textbook star-quality asset

→ Least favorite deal: Publicis / LiveRamp, and the neutrality problem that could complicate the very thing they're buying (and who benefits, ID5, Rockad)

→ Christian's pick: Nth Degree / Invent (with Shamrock), and why the market underrated a "asset-heavy" experiential business that clients keep coming back to

→ Why podcast agencies may be an underappreciated value buy (and deserve their own episode)

The headline: M&A isn't back, it's gotten selective. In an AI world, the "it factor" and the trusted relationship are the scarce things, and that's where the premium is going.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:12 — Cold open: the summer of 500 deals and a bifurcated recovery

0:59 — Welcome + a milestone: 3,000 YouTube subscribers

2:16 — Shout-out to Scott Wingo, our first foundational Substack subscriber

3:07 — Why this episode is different: not a stats read, not an "M&A is back" take

4:00 — The three-part plan: market update, where the premium's going, favorite/least favorite deals

4:26 — Market update: ~335 Q2 deals and a bifurcated recovery

5:10 — The bid-ask spread, AI disruption risk, and raising debt in the upper market

5:47 — Why the lower middle market is seeing its highest volume in two years

6:08 — Valuations by category: marketing services, ad tech, digital media/martech, commerce software

7:15 — Shopify as the public commerce comp (~9x NTM revenue)

7:51 — The revenue-multiple spread: why money leans toward tech-led businesses

8:53 — Lower market vs. middle market: what a "lower market deal" actually is

9:55 — Why strategics are leading (70% of deals) and PE's record-long hold periods

11:04 — The commerce corner: PayPal/Symbio and other smaller comps

11:40 — Pre-2022 SaaS stuck in "AI zombie mode"

12:10 — Ayelet's POV: the "star quality thesis" on where the premium is going

13:43 — Is star quality just creators and influencers? The sorority recruitment analogy

15:03 — Why the risk factor is often what makes a business the star

16:05 — The LOI "dark cloud," and why you need an account-level value-creation thesis

17:49 — Sticking to the thesis vs. going "all cowboy"

18:05 — Sponsor: Sifted Pro

18:59 — Favorite deal: Mar4 Media acquires Ad Results Media

21:01 — The structure: Shamrock keeps a minority stake, CEO stays on

22:08 — Why podcast agencies are an underappreciated category

22:59 — Least favorite deal: Publicis / LiveRamp and the neutrality problem

24:27 — Who benefits from the migration (ID5, Rockad), and Publicis's defense

26:26 — Christian's favorite: Nth Degree acquires Invent (with Shamrock)

27:52 — Why buyers underrated an "asset-heavy" experiential business

29:03 — Wrap: it's not "M&A is back," it's selective, and that's where the premium is

🎙️ Part of the Marketecture Media Network | Sponsored by Sifted Pro (sifted.eu/inorganic)

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In this solo episode (Ayelet's out sick, but back next week), Christian breaks down Klaviyo's acquisition of Agency AI: a ~$17M asset deal that says as much about the current AI acqui-hire market as it does about a Boston reunion. Torres, a two-time founder with exits to HubSpot (Performable) and Vista (Drift, $1.2B), now reports to the founder he once mentored as Klaviyo's new Chief Product Officer.

Christian runs his four-part operator's read on the deal, strategic value, deal price, comms strategy, and post-merger integration risk, and lands on a non-obvious PMI risk that has nothing to do with retention and everything to do with how Klaviyo actually operates internally.

What we cover:

→ The market update: two venture rounds worth watching (Paper, the Figma challenger for the agentic era, and Dimension, the "Seller OS" replacing TikTok Shop's native seller center), and why they thread into Whatnot's $545M raise and the convergence of social, creator, and live commerce

→ The full backstory on the Torres/Bialecki relationship and why this is a trade between very familiar parties

→ Why a ~$17M asset deal on a company that raised $32M is textbook AI acqui-hire economics, cheap for Klaviyo, decent PR for investors, likely a haircut on return

→ Whether B2B customer-success agents graft cleanly onto a primarily B2C e-commerce platform, and the bet against Decagon and Sierra

→ The smart comms play of announcing alongside a Q2 beat (revenue up 26% to $370.6M) while the stock sits at a 52-week low

→ The real PMI risk Christian sees: not retention, but Klaviyo's internal "left hand / right hand" coordination culture, and whether the pond is big enough for a founder who wanted to build a billion-dollar company

→ Why Klaviyo still hasn't hired a corp dev leader, and whether this deal changes that

Plus two deals of the week: AMZ Advisors acquiring Reach Social Commerce (a TikTok Shop cross-sell play straight out of the Podean playbook) and Vusion acquiring In-Store Media (a European retail media network deal that ties into the in-store advertising wave).

If you missed Episode 79 with Ayelet on the persistent valuation gaps showing up in lower-market deals (tied to recent AdWeek data), go back and give it a listen.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

1:12 — Market update: two venture rounds in commerce and agency

1:26 — Paper, the Figma challenger for the agentic era ($34M round)

1:53 — Dimension, the "Seller OS" for TikTok Shop

2:24 — Threading it to Whatnot's $545M raise: where commerce is going 3:38 — The feature deal: Klaviyo is back to M&A (and still no corp dev leader)

4:38 — Why a $17M asset deal tells you about the AI agent market

5:29 — What Agency AI actually built (and the acqui-hire framing)

6:50 — The deal structure, buried in the 10-Q

7:16 — The tell: Agency raised $32M, so investors likely took a haircut

7:46 — The new roles: Torres as CPO, Ed Hallen as Chief Strategy Officer

8:09 — Torres' resume: Performable (HubSpot) and Drift ($1.2B to Vista)

9:46 — Operator's read #1: strategic value and the bet vs. Decagon and Sierra

10:01 — Operator's read #2: deal price and ~$680K/head acqui-hire economics

11:08 — Operator's read #3: comms strategy and the Q2 beat

11:47 — Operator's read #4: the real PMI risk (it's not retention)

13:00 — Verdict: a great value and a smart way to punctuate an AI strategy

13:16 — Deal of the week #1: AMZ Advisors acquires Reach Social Commerce

14:28 — Deal of the week #2: Vusion acquires In-Store Media

15:42 — Wrap, more deals on the Substack, and a nod to Episode 79 with Ayelet

🎙️ Part of the Marketecture Media Network | Sponsored by Sifted Pro (sifted.eu/inorganic)

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic

Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

What we cover: Why valuation expectation gaps are a symptom and misalignment is the real problem, the four rungs of the ladder, the ADWEEK x Evros Group 2026 M&A Sentiment Survey and how to read incentives in market reports, the Tel Aviv cab negotiation that explains the whole market, the buy-side acquisition that ignored its own decision gates and what it cost post-close, closing a $10 million valuation gap by restructuring the consideration instead of moving the number, why the highest cash offer lost a three-partner exit, and why willingness to walk away is your leverage.

Timestamps: 

0:00 — In/Organic intro

0:38 — Welcome & the #1 problem in dealmaking right now: misalignment

1:08 — The four-rung ladder begins: the market & the 2021 valuation anchor

2:10 — The business rung: what a seller wants vs. what diligence finds

2:55 — The partners rung: equal equity, different outcomes

4:10 — The individual rung: selling as an identity shift

5:25 — The ADWEEK x Evros Group 2026 M&A Sentiment Survey & reading incentives (including her own)

7:20 — The headline finding: the valuation expectation gap is a symptom, not the problem

7:55 — The Tel Aviv cab ride: "the price is the price"

9:35 — Sponsor: Sifted Pro

10:10 — Deal #1: the acquisition that closed but shouldn't have

12:11 — Diligence red flags pile up

13:00 — The investment committee agrees; Ayelet says walk

14:05 — Post-close fallout: unhappy customers, broken trust, wasted time

15:20 — The buyer's lesson: unwilling to walk means you've already lost

16:02 — Deal #2: the $10M deal where the number never moved

16:50 — The restructure: a seller note & the 80% revenue floor

18:00 — Creativity isn't discounting

18:30 — Deal #3: three equal partners & the higher cash offer that lost

19:36 — Closing the rungs: how deals get closed & closed well

20:15 — Structure the deal, structure the company & the final rule on walking away

🎙️ Now part of the Marketecture Media Network | Sponsored by Sifted Pro (sifted.eu)

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic

Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

Recorded live in Miami, Christian and Ayelet step away from the weekly deal coverage to tackle the question they hear constantly: I want to buy or sell through M&A, but how do I actually begin? The conversation centers on DealCon, the M&A conference they just attended, which Ayelet discloses upfront was founded by her father, Tom Shipley. What started as a 20-person intensive in an Austin office three and a half years ago is now a 160-person, personally vetted community of active buyers and sellers.

This one is essential listening for any founder or CEO who's stuck, whether you run a $1-5M EBITDA agency or a $3-5M ARR SaaS company that's plateaued, and you're wondering if there's an alternative path to growth. There is. It's called inorganic growth, and most founders don't even know it's an option.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

00:00 Introduction 

2:20 The Genesis and Purpose of DealCon

6:53 Target Audience and Business Requirements

12:32 Conference Demographics and Attendee Types

16:59 Real-World Success Stories and Examples

19:31 Practical Conference Content and Capital Access

22:43 Integration Focus and Post-Acquisition Strategy

25:06 Advisory Board Program and Advanced Support

27:37 Legal and Market Expertise Challenges

30:15 Ideal and Non-Ideal Conference Attendees

34:19 Quality Control and Conference Logistics

37:00 Conference Details and Closing Information

Whether or not DealCon is right for you, the goal of this episode is simple: to show that ground-level, human, one-to-one guidance on starting your M&A journey exists. This is one option among several, and Christian and Ayelet walk through exactly what makes it work.

The next DealCon is October 19-21 in Austin. If you're interested, we’ve arranged a 10% discount on passes for our listeners. Learn more here https://www.dealconlive.com/inorganic

🎙️ Now part of the Marketecture Media Network | Sponsored by Sifted Pro (sifted.eu)

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic

Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

0:24 — Big week for In Organic, Marketecture partnership & birthday wishes

1:12 — In Organic officially joins the Marketecture Media Network

2:01 — Introducing Sifted Pro as the show's first sponsor

2:39 — Headline: Salsify acquired by Sinven in a ~$1B deal

3:19 — What Salsify does and why it matters in commerce

4:18 — Deal value, valuation haircut & employee equity implications

5:28 — Christian's personal connection to Salsify's founding story

7:06 — The culture that built Salsify's success

8:32 — Why the Digital Shelf Institute community is a strategic asset

9:53 — Operator's read: Why Sinven is a major new commerce investor

12:36 — Was the acquisition price actually a success?

14:28 — Why SAP should have bought Salsify

18:30 — Post-merger integration risks and employee retention

21:36 — Deal architect's view: Partnership vs. takeover

22:21 — The value and risk of community in acquisitions

24:41 — What this deal means for future commerce M&A

25:25 — Deal hit: Tracksuit acquires Hall for AI brand visibility

26:14 — Deal hit: Neon raises $13M to challenge app store fees

26:46 — Preview of next week's M&A sentiment report 🎙️ Now part of the Marketecture Media Network | In/organic is Sponsored by Sifted Pro (check them out at sifted.eu) 🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet's LinkedIn:   / ayelet-shipley-b16330149   Christian's LinkedIn:   / hassold   Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

So this week, solo from an undisclosed location while Ayelet celebrates her 30th in LA, Christian goes deep. A full side-by-side of Criteo and LiveRamp, a walkthrough of why the multiple gap between them makes almost no sense on the financials, and a concrete bull case: pay $58 a share, a 200%+ premium, then run an M&A play to build the agentic commerce OS for brands and retail.

The thesis isn't buy it cheap. It's buy it decisively.

What we cover: Who actually leaked the Vista story (and why Criteo's repeated phantom-deal leaks are a comms problem), the Criteo vs. LiveRamp side-by-side on revenue growth, revenue mix, EBITDA, and free cash flow, why LiveRamp's 107% net retention is at real risk once Publicis owns it, why Criteo's transactional model might be the safer bet in an agentic era where subscription pricing is under fire, the AI option value nobody's pricing in, and three specific M&A targets that would fix Criteo's biggest gap: no Amazon, no Walmart.

Plus two deals worth flagging: Podean's fifth acquisition (Social Commerce Club) and Brunner buying AdSkate.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:26 — Solo episode, life changes, and happy 30th to Ayelet

0:50 — Why we're revisiting Criteo/Vista: "you really could have done better"

1:30 — The backstory: Bloomberg, Reuters, and a 50% premium at ~$3.7B implied

2:00 — Who leaked it? Why back channels point at Criteo, not Vista

2:30 — Criteo's leak engine: Microsoft, Walmart, Skai — deals that never materialized

3:00 — The headline thesis: pay 2.5x revenue ex-TAC, then run an M&A play

4:00 — Side-by-side setup: Criteo vs. LiveRamp

4:30 — Revenue growth: LiveRamp at 9%, Criteo at 1% (and why that's misleading)

5:15 — Growth quality: the Roundel and Uber Eats churn, and 16% underlying retail media growth

5:45 — Why LiveRamp's 107% net retention is at risk under Publicis ownership

6:30 — Revenue type: true SaaS vs. transactional media economics

7:00 — Why subscription models are under fire in the agentic era

7:45 — EBITDA: Criteo at $407M vs. LiveRamp at $185M, at a quarter of the multiple

8:30 — Free cash flow: both are cash compounders with clean balance sheets

9:15 — Strategic buyers pay up, financial buyers don't — but Vista usually pays 10-20x

9:45 — The AI option value nobody's pricing: OpenAI's ChatGPT ads pilot, 2x AI-referred conversions

10:30 — The real asset: 4,100 brands, 225 retail media networks, $1B in quarterly activated spend

11:15 — The bull case: $58/share, $2.9B equity value, a 203% premium

12:00 — Why no board can responsibly ignore an offer like this

12:30 — M&A target #1: Skai — solves Amazon and Walmart, and they already know each other

13:30 — M&A target #2: Pacvue (Advent) — Amazon, Walmart, Instacart muscle (and the Helium 10 problem)

14:15 — Why The Trade Desk's April integrations create urgency

14:45 — M&A target #3: digital shelf analytics — and the Profitero/Publicis precedent

16:00 — The Christian math, summarized

17:00 — Deal hit: Podean acquires Social Commerce Club (deal #5)

17:45 — Deal hit: Brunner acquires AdScape — creative intelligence as an AI play

18:30 — Why more deals are moving to our Substack, and what's coming next

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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Ayelet Shipley and Christian Hassold break down Vista Equity Partners' (with hedge fund Quinti Capital) proposed take-private of Criteo (Nasdaq: CRTO): the "melting ice cube" bear case vs. Ken Kubec's "Footnote Trade" bull case (reported retail-media revenue down 32% vs. ~24% underlying growth once you strip out an accounting change and two client roll-offs), why a business throwing off ~$400M in profit was trading around 2x EBITDA, the Luxembourg "re-domicile escape hatch," and whether Vista's playbook gives Criteo product oxygen or runs off its 900 engineers.

Plus the market update on AI marketing-tech venture rounds (geoSurge, Vendelux), and two quick deal hits with very different structures: Descartes x Drivin and Banzai x ConnectAndSell.

⏱️ Chapters

00:00 — Intro: Market & Deals Friday

00:49 — Market Update: VC keeps funding AI marketing tech (geoSurge, Vendelux)

03:06 — Feature: Vista + Quinti bid to take Criteo private — the facts

05:55 — The Operator's Read (Christian): toll road, or mispriced commerce-media asset?

11:32 — The Deal Architect's Read (Ayelet): incentives & the Luxembourg escape hatch

15:50 — Quick Hits: Descartes/Drivin & Banzai/ConnectAndSell

19:40 — Wrap

Reads referenced:

Chris Sheldon: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/chris-j-sheldon_criteos-retail-media-growth-fell-from-23-share-7480304433730441216-MyKw

Ken Kubec: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/kenkubec_privateequity-adtech-retailmedia-ugcPost-7480605776760307713-dbqi

🔔 Subscribe for Market & Deals Friday — the strategic read on lower-middle-market M&A in commerce & media.

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

Disclaimer: analysis and commentary only, not investment advice.

The Vista/Quinti offer is as reported; Criteo has not announced a decision.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Christian and Ayelet break down the deal from two distinct angles, the operator's read and the deal architect's read, plus a venture market update, hot tea on SPS Commerce quietly selling a business back to its founder, and eight rapid-fire quick hits in what's officially become the summer of add-ons.

One venture update. One deep dive, two POVs. Hot tea. Eight quick hits.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:38 — Happy Fourth of July, and what's on the agenda

2:19 — Market update: JustAI raises $17M Series A (Base10, Y Combinator, Peak XV)

3:00 — Concord raises $3M seed for agentic media buying, and why Vibe.co's CEO is an investor

4:34 — "The Summer of Add-ons": why fragmentation is fueling M&A

4:44 — The deal: Walmart Connect acquires Vibe.co, the "Google Ads of streaming"

6:25 — The numbers: ~$100M revenue, ~$1.4B deal, 10-14x revenue (and why it's not an AI deal)

8:00 — Walmart's M&A cadence and the Vizio precedent

8:54 — The 10x ad-revenue gap: Amazon at $82B vs. Walmart at $8.2B

9:30 — The advisors and why this was a CEO-to-CEO deal

9:50 — The operator's read: a capability tuck-in that buys 3-4 years

10:00 — Is the CTV TAM actually big enough? The Brian Wieser cannibalization argument

12:00 — Integration risk: folding a scrappy startup into a corporate giant

12:26 — The France factor: why acquiring 60 employees in Paris is its own challenge

14:00 — Why The Trade Desk is the biggest loser (per Ari Paparo)

14:38 — The deal architect's read: the founders' first big exit, sold from strength

16:55 — Why $180M in retention may not hold founders who don't need the money

17:31 — The real make-or-break: keeping the team hungry inside a giant

18:00 — Hot tea: SPS Commerce carves out Seller Investigators, sells it back to the founder

22:01 — Quick hits: Revmatics/DataFeedWatch, Moburst/Hyperzon, The Independents/Phantasm

22:51 — More hits: Samba TV/Bestever, Yes&/Modo Modo, Arketi/Sperling

24:00 — Martis Capital takes majority of Deerfield Group (~$280M, 12-14x EBITDA)

25:00 — The consistent 14x agency marker, and how to break past it into strategic territory

25:38 — Final thought: this is add-on summer

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this special edition, Christian and Ayelet sit down with Chris Erwin of RockWater, one of the sharpest analysts in the creator economy, to go deep on what Accenture actually bought, what the founders kept, and why the deal structure tells the real story.

Chris published a standout newsletter on this deal, and we brought him on to share his expert POV: the carve-out logic, the multi-year partnership nobody has details on, the "largest deal ever" math, and what Accenture Song buys next.

What we cover: Why Neil Waller and James Street sold the agency but kept the broader creator-facing portfolio (Sixteenth, Foam, Moby Ventures, The Lighthouse, Umi Games), what the undisclosed multi-year partnership likely includes — global infrastructure, technology, enterprise client access, and balance-sheet capital, how the "$500M+ largest creator deal ever" claim squares with a $225-300M outside EV estimate, why the answer is probably a meaningful upfront payment plus a multi-year earnout, how Accenture's Droga5 precedent and stated M&A policy help reverse-engineer the structure, why the real value driver is media spend, measurement, and the performance data that unlocks $100B+ media budgets, the "do no harm" PMI era and why a prior 12-month working relationship de-risked the deal, and who Accenture Song buys next — plus why there's a genuine shortage of scaled independent creator agencies left to acquire.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:00 — Show note: why this special edition replaces Market and Deals Friday

1:09 — Welcome and guest intro: Chris Erwin of RockWater

1:38 — The backstory: Accenture Song's June 8th carve-out of the Whalar agency

3:08 — "They sold the engine and kept the garage" — what that actually means

4:17 — Speculating on the undisclosed multi-year partnership

5:44 — Why life changes fast when you co-sell through Accenture's SOW machine

6:37 — Predicting how the integration goes (and why a prior relationship matters)

7:37 — The "do no harm" PMI era for people-heavy agency businesses

8:01 — Is this really the largest creator economy transaction ever?

8:49 — Reverse-engineering the structure: Accenture's M&A policy and the Droga5 precedent

10:36 — Earnout norms: 3-5 years on larger deals, 2-3 on sub-$100M EV

11:30 — Christian's thesis: Accenture is buying creator media dollars

12:04 — The big-picture framing: consultancies pushing into marketing services

14:05 — Why the materiality of the number unlocks everything Accenture can sell alongside it

14:53 — What Accenture Song buys next — bolt-on capabilities across the creator stack

16:56 — The real problem: a shortage of scaled independent creator agencies

18:01 — The creator commerce wave and where the next big deals get built

🎙️ Guest: Chris Erwin, Founder, RockWater

https://www.linkedin.com/in/chrnov/

https://wearerockwater.com/accenture-song-buys-whalar/

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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Recorded live at Salsify's Digital Shelf Summit in Atlanta, Christian sat down with Steve — founder and CEO of Sitation — for a conversation about building a services-plus-software business in commerce, how AI is rewriting the buy-vs-build equation, and why a 62-person specialist can out-maneuver Deloitte Digital and Accenture Song in product data.

What we cover: The Sitation origin story and the early bet on PIM before it was a category, the three pillars of the business today (systems integration, managed services, and proprietary software), why the software-services convergence is playing out in real time, the "headless PIM in 2026" conversation with Salsify's CEO and what AI agents, MCP, and CLIs mean for the future of product data, how AI lowered the bar for participation and changed buy-vs-build, the Philips case study — a 111% conversion lift on a single SKU by optimizing content, not price, why 90%+ of Sitation's team came from industry and how that makes them stickier than the big SIs, and how Steve thinks about Sitation's future: international expansion as a platform vs. fitting neatly into a larger strategic's plans.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:26 — Welcome from Salsify's Digital Shelf Summit in Atlanta

1:00 — The origin story: first day of work September 10, 2001, laid off five weeks later

2:11 — Early to commerce enablement — and Boston as a commerce software hotbed

3:02 — What Sitation does today: the three business segments

5:25 — The 2019 "pick a lane" problem and why software-services convergence vindicated the strategy

6:16 — How AI is changing the buy-vs-build equation

7:36 — The "headless PIM in 2026" conversation with Salsify's CEO

8:33 — Salesforce going headless and the new customization opportunity for SIs

10:00 — APIs, the MCP revolution, CLIs, and why schema matters for AI agents

11:05 — How a 62-person firm out-maneuvers multi-thousand-person SIs

11:42 — Why this is a massive market, not a zero-sum game

12:30 — The Philips case study: 111% conversion lift on one SKU without touching price

13:30 — Why multinationals choose a boutique over Deloitte Digital or Accenture Song

15:46 — The strategic question: platform play or acquisition target?

16:29 — International expansion as the organic (or capital-backed) growth path

17:40 — Why Sitation's platform credentials make it an attractive, hard-to-replicate target

18:45 — Why you can't build Sitation's early-mover position — you have to buy it

🎙️ Guest: Steve Engelbrecht, Founder & CEO, Sitation | Recorded at Salsify Digital Shelf Summit, Atlanta

https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevenengelbrecht/

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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The week before Cannes, the dam broke. Christian and Ayelet break down the deepest deal review we've done yet — anchored by a transaction Ayelet's team actually advised on the sell side: Residence acquiring GateMaker, a female-founded creator and influencer agency with a blue-chip beauty roster.

Plus a sponsor-to-sponsor recap in commerce services (Bluebird Group + Bertram Capital), and a rapid-fire run through 12 more deals across creator, beauty, luxury PR, B2B, and commerce.

One platform investment. One deep dive. Twelve quick hits. Under 20 minutes.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:39 — Welcome to Market and Deals Friday — and a 14-deal week

1:12 — Did everyone wait until the week before Cannes to announce?

1:37 — Coming up: a special edition with Chris Erwin of RockWater on the Accenture/Whalar deal

2:00 — Market update: Bluebird Group partners with Bertram Capital

2:20 — Bertram's buy-and-build model and the Bertram Labs tech advantage

3:00 — Reading the deal size from a $1.6B control fund with a 43% IRR

4:00 — Why a relationship-driven commerce services business resists AI disruption

5:35 — Deep dive: Residence acquires GateMaker — a sell-side deal Ayelet's team ran

6:05 — GateMaker's founders, blue-chip beauty roster, and creator economy pedigree

7:20 — Did Residence already have creator capability? (No — this was the capability buy)

7:50 — Second acquisition in under five months: Residence is now a 9-agency network

8:44 — The Gemspring-backed platform build and why Residence is now an active acquirer

9:28 — The "anti-holdco" model — and Christian's pushback on the framing

10:42 — Why creator and influence relationships command a premium right now

11:30 — The cross-industry pattern: do-no-harm PMI for people-heavy businesses

11:56 — Advisors: Palazzo and Speed M&A on the sell side

12:32 — Brinkley the deal-finding agent and a 20-deal week

13:20 — Quick hit: Front Row acquires Carbon Beauty (second deal this year)

13:57 — Quick hit: Mazarine acquires Bacchus — luxury PR and UHNW access

14:10 — Quick hit: Huge acquires Rotate — composable commerce

14:27 — Quick hit: Motion Agency acquires LKHNS — B2B and video (Kim Everl's 7th)

15:30 — Quick hit: Akeneo acquires Pricing Hub — PIM moves into pricing

16:33 — Rapid fire: Mile Marker/Lyfe, Legion Advertising, Factual/Intelsio, Everything Branding/Darlington

17:44 — The week's only disclosed number: 2X acquires KnownWell at a $400M combined valuation

18:09 — Quick hit: Scorpion acquires One SEO Digital

18:32 — 14 deals, one disclosed price: the lower middle market buying capability quietly

18:52 — Don't miss the Erik Huberman interview (Ep. 71) + the Chris Erwin special coming up

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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Recorded live at Possible 2026 Ayelet sat down with Erik Huberman, founder of Hawke Media, for one of the most candid conversations about agency M&A we've ever had. No spin, no posturing — just the actual mechanics of how a bootstrapped agency built a 23-deal acquisition machine focused on the lower and middle market that everyone else ignores.

Erik breaks down the deal structure that puts growth (not cash) at the center, why he intentionally did 10 deals in one year to "break the system" and learn integration the hard way, the advice from a roll-up veteran that made him simplify his contracts, and why a third of his deals don't go well — and how he absorbs that without PE backing.

What we cover: Why Hawke Media stays focused on growth-stage and challenger brands instead of going enterprise, the deal structure where Hawke guarantees the founder's profitability and takes over HR, accounting, legal, and operations, why "no cash up front" filters out the wrong sellers (and the ego trap behind it), how Hawke gets to a term sheet in three days, why over-complicating contracts benefits the person being tricky, the "would you do all 10 deals again?" advice that changed everything, why Mountain Gate and most PE want him to go enterprise — and why he won't, and what it would actually take for Erik to bring on a venture-minded private equity partner.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

1:02 — The Hawke Media mission: be the best at the lower and middle market everyone else abandons

2:04 — Three sides of the business: 23 acquisitions, a venture fund, and an AI tool

2:23 — How HawkAI started as a predictive analytics tool and became an internal advantage

3:23 — 10 years of M&A: from one deal a year to 10 in a single year

4:00 — Why Erik did 10 deals at once to intentionally break and rebuild the system

4:30 — The mistake of over-complicating contracts to protect the downside

5:22 — Putting the risk back on the seller — and the advice that made him reverse course

6:32 — The actual deal structure: guaranteed profitability, no cash up front

7:03 — Why a 23-deal track record means he never has to speak hypothetically

8:13 — Who this deal structure actually works for (and who it doesn't)

9:23 — The "I'll be a billionaire next year" founder problem

10:09 — Why founders get bogged down by the back-office work they hate

10:29 — Where Hawke fits vs. Mountain Gate, Herringbone, and the scout fund operators

11:21 — Why most PE wants Erik to go enterprise — and why he says no

12:17 — The "wild wild west" of lower middle market deals

12:29 — Three days to a term sheet: how the process actually moves

13:49 — Why "no cash up front" is the first thing he says, and the ego piece behind it

14:36 — Why simplicity wins: the rev-share story and avoiding the retrade game

15:21 — Doing this at scale now vs. before the name — why you can't just copy the playbook

15:45 — Why a third of deals don't go well, and why you have to be able to absorb it

16:45 — Acquisition isn't for everyone: you have to build the infrastructure first

17:23 — Why integrity and over-disclosure are baked into how the deal works

18:11 — "Ask me what I had for breakfast" — radical transparency with sellers

18:57 — What's next: dominating lower and middle market marketing, the reverse-franchise model

19:18 — Would Erik ever sell? Why he's not bowing out — but might take a PE partner

20:54 — Why he needs a venture-minded PE fund, not a traditional buyout thesis

22:38 — Cleaning up the balance sheet and earning the right to that conversation

22:52 — Entrepreneurship as a "mental illness" and the Mexican taco stand exit plan

Connect with Erik on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/erikhuberman/

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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But is it really "the largest creator economy transaction ever"? Christian runs the math. The claim doesn't survive contact with a calculator unless there's a lot more going on than a simple agency purchase.

Christian and Ayelet break down the structure, what Accenture actually bought (hint: it's the $600M in media spend and the measurement layer, not just the creators), and why this probably isn't the end of Accenture's media buying spree.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:39 — Welcome to Market and Deals Friday, June 12

1:20 — The victory lap: our Episode 61 Accenture prediction came true

2:06 — Why the deal took longer than expected (deals just take time)

2:20 — Why we didn't name Whaler at the time — protecting a people-heavy business

3:05 — When and how to tell your team you're selling: a real consideration for owners

3:46 — What happened: Whaler Agency joins Accenture Song, terms undisclosed

4:28 — The $44B creator economy and why Whaler sits in the middle of it

4:50 — The real prize: $600M in media spend + the measurement and data layer

5:33 — Reading it against the holdcos: consultants are coming for creator businesses

6:16 — The math problem: can this really be "the largest creator economy deal ever"?

6:50 — Why a $500M price on ~$12M EBITDA (40x) doesn't add up for the agency alone

8:00 — The carve-out + call option + licensing theory that makes the number work

8:30 — Is Whaler Agency just step one? Why Christian doesn't think so

9:46 — Accenture Song's creator build: 9 acquisitions in 2024 alone

10:16 — Why $600M in media spend is the growth-acceleration play vs. single-digit agency growth

12:28 — Moelis advised Whaler; Accenture Song's corp dev ran it in-house

13:46 — Why this is a planned (not closed) deal — and what shareholder disclosure will reveal

14:35 — Quick hit: Walker Sands acquires Rev Partners (Mountain Gate turns on the engine)

15:35 — Why Mountain Gate is already doing M&A less than a year into Walker Sands

16:00 — Quick hit: Channable acquires Metreon — server-side conversion tracking

16:41 — Quick hit: Sitecore acquires Scrunch — AI search optimization beyond traditional SEO

18:16 — The connective tissue: four deals, zero disclosed prices, all capability buys

18:31 — Why AI won't kill feed management anytime soon (the 20-30% false positive rabbit hole)

20:11 — The bet: Accenture's next move is about media, not agencies

20:38 — Structure over headline EV — the drum worth beating for every smaller shop

21:06 — Wrap and a Knicks championship wish

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A coverage on In/Organic

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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Christian and Ayelet sat down with Kevin — outgoing CEO of adMixt, now President of Performance Marketing at Interluxe Group — for an unusually candid conversation about deal structure, integration, and why the headline multiple tells you almost nothing about whether a deal was good.

What we cover: Why Kevin took the adMixt CEO seat (a turnaround that wasn't actually broken), how a single text from a friend on a Mountain Gate board started the whole process, why there was no formal auction and the buyer recommended his own banker, why a strategic that didn't already offer his service line was the more interesting buyer, the "do no harm" integration approach — no title mapping, no email changes until 2027, how deal structures have shifted from 2020 to 2026 (equity loans, rollover treatment, the 2022 law change), and why Kevin now just asks friends "was it good or bad?" instead of asking about the multiple.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:12 — Welcome and guest intro: Kevin Simonson, outgoing CEO of adMixt

0:45 — Kevin's background: iProspect intern to Metric Digital to Wpromote to adMixt

1:39 — What adMixt does: "we get people to buy things on the internet"

2:07 — Why adMixt is different — they built their own media buying software

3:03 — Who is Interluxe Group? Experiential, media, and PR for luxury brands

4:02 — The Mountain Gate connection and how a single text started the deal

4:50 — Reverse due diligence: why trusted relationships de-risked the process

5:52 — No formal process: how the strategic buyer side reached out and stayed updated quarterly

6:46 — Why the buyer recommended Palazzo as Kevin's banker

7:26 — Why Interluxe was the right buyer: a brand-new service line vs. overlap at Wpromote

9:29 — The "do no harm" integration: no title mapping, no email changes, slow roll to 2027

10:10 — Deal structure: how it's changed from 2020 to 2026 (and the 2022 law change)

11:14 — Ayelet on the legal mechanics: asset vs. stock vs. membership interest purchase

12:56 — Why the multiple lies: "just ask if it was good or bad"

13:43 — Why structure matters more than the headline EV

14:07 — Mountain Gate's acquisition tear and the standing invite to Shamrock

15:11 — Kevin's credit to founder Zach and the foundation that made adMixt worth buying

16:15 — Why this was an excellent turnaround, well landed

🎙️ Guest: Kevin Simonson, President of Performance Marketing, Interluxe Group

https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevinsimonson/

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Christian and Ayelet break down what each deal actually signals about where the software and agency markets are heading — plus stick around for the live after-show with Kevin Simonson, CEO of adMixt, on the Interluxe Group acquisition.

One deep dive. Three quick hits. One live after-show.

What we cover: Why Sprinklr restarted M&A after nearly five years and what choosing ViralMoment first says about the market, the "tale of two cities" in AI exits — top 1% startups clearing the preference stack vs. capability tuck-ins sold as assets, why Asana's $75M StackAI deal is the other side of that coin, and how two ad tech and agency deals (Peer39/Adloox and Interluxe/adMixt) reflect the same buy-not-build logic.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:00 — Welcome to Market and Deals Friday

0:30 — Quick market context: the data is backing up the thesis

2:50 — Why corporate M&A is surging while PE volume drops

4:11 — Deal #1: Sprinklr acquires ViralMoment — video-native social intelligence

5:00 — The gap it fills: social moved to video, listening tools are still text-based

5:50 — ViralMoment background: founded by Chelsea Hall, Carnegie Mellon, seed-stage

6:27 — Sprinklr's earnings context and why this was a buy-not-build asset deal

7:30 — The tale of two cities: top 1% AI startups vs. capability tuck-ins

8:30 — Sprinklr is hiring an M&A role right now (and Christian's soapbox on the title)

9:22 — Deal #2: Asana acquires StackAI for ~$75M — clearing the preference stack

10:00 — Why this is the "right tech, right team, right investor" version of the same trade

10:30 — The MIT startup angle and the agent execution layer Asana was buying

11:01 — Deal #3: Peer39 acquires Adloox from Scope3 — walled garden verification

11:50 — Why this matters against DoubleVerify and IAS

11:55 — Deal #4: Interluxe Group acquires adMixt — performance firepower for luxury

12:56 — The thread tying all four deals together: buy is beating build

13:27 — Tease: big announcement next week + after-show with Kevin Simonson of adMixt

Links:

Goldman report: https://www.goldmansachs.com/insights/articles/ma-volume-expected-to-surge-this-year-despite-economic-uncertainty

EY Parthenon report: https://www.ey.com/en_us/newsroom/2026/06/ey-parthenon-forecasts-resilient-8-percent-growth-in-us-dealmaking-in-2026-despite-geopolitical-and-economic-headwinds

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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Recorded at Possible 2026 in the Unplugged Collective pavilion, Christian Hassold and Ayelet Shipley sat down with Justin Hayashi, CEO of NewEngen, one of the most tech-forward independents in the market to break down how he thinks about acquisitions, what makes NewEngen genuinely different from its peers, and what he's looking for next.

NewEngen started in 2016 as a tech company trying to dethrone Marin Software, among others. It evolved into the agency their clients always said they were and built a platform around content, creator marketing, and measurement that most of their competitors can't replicate.

What we cover: The origin story; from Zulily's IPO to trying to build a bidding algorithm to accidentally building an agency, how three acquisitions in the content and creator space shaped NewEngen's differentiated positioning, the Grapevine.ai deal thesis and why beating an aggressive forecast during diligence was the final proof of conviction, how NewEngen handles integration with a "do no harm" philosophy while keeping brands like Donut Studios intentionally separate, and the buy box for what comes next: social, content, measurement, and commerce.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

00:12: Cold open: does the YC target on agency backs keep you up at night?

1:08: Welcome and guest intro: Justin Hayashi, CEO of NewEngen, at Possible 2026

1:19: The backstory: from Zulily IPO and billion-dollar sale to Qurate, to founding NewEngen

2:25: The original thesis: dethrone Marin Software and Kenshoo — and why it didn't work

3:58: The pivot: from SaaS company (that clients kept calling an agency) to what NewEngen is today

4:28: Tech-enabled DNA: what survived the pivot and what defines NewEngen now

5:54: What scaled independents are getting wrong — and where NewEngen differentiates

6:45: Three acquisitions in the content and creator space: why content was always the bet

7:23: The Grapevine.ai deal: why most scaled independents walked away and NewEngen stepped up

8:04: Why Caroline's conviction and operator mindset won the first filter

9:00: 900 vetted, high-performing creators vs. seven million claims — the quality argument

10:29: Two lenses: founder CEO conviction vs. PE underwriting — how Justin navigated both

11:06: The aggressive forecast, the bottoms-up conviction, and what actually happened

11:30: Zuckerberg's earnings calls as diligence data: short-form video growth 20% → 30% YoY

12:43: What made Grapevine.ai hard for strategic buyers: long-tail revenue and small contracts

13:37: How Caroline's client migration story played out in real time during diligence

15:19: Donut Digital acquisition: "do no harm" integration and why they kept the brand

16:45: LT Partners vs. Acorn Influence vs. Donut Studios: three different integration approaches

17:57: The hardest integration lesson: get alignment on goalposts before you close

18:59: Buy box: social/content, measurement, commerce, B2C only, $3-12M revenue sweet spot

21:02: Closing take: NewEngen is the software-led agency ready to take on Silicon Valley

🎙️ Guest: Justin Hayashi, CEO, NewEngen | Recorded at Possible 2026

https://www.linkedin.com/in/justinhayashi/

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A and agency coverage on In/Organic

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

7:50 — Podcast agencies are still priced like services businesses, not talent factories

8:50 — The valuation gap: no shared yardstick for IP and franchise value before it's commercialized

9:20 — MARC: building the FICO score for franchise value — Ayelet's startup to watch

9:52 — The data problem: YouTube gives real analytics, Apple and Spotify give nothing

10:51 — The tech layer underneath the smaller podcast agencies — why it matters for buyers

11:45 — AI tuck-in: Coupa acquires Tonkean — Israeli agentic intake and orchestration platform

12:18 — Israel continues to dominate enterprise AI tuck-ins

13:35 — Solstice raises $21M Series A — AI-native pharma marketing agency, content from months to 10 days

14:20 — InstaAgent: out of Alchemist + YC P26, agent swarm coordination for paid social

15:15 — Connecting the dots: Solstice and InstaAgent are the venture-stage version of the Silicon Valley targeting agencies thesis

16:15 — Advice for corp dev teams at Power Digital, PMG, Stanza: track early stage now

17:04 — What's next: episode 67 with Justin Hayashi of New Engine, and M&A Source conference panel

🔔 Subscribe so you don't miss the big announcement

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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This is what a PE-backed independent agency rollup looks like when it's working.

Travis Johnson — CEO and co-founder of Podean, the largest independent global marketplace-focused agency — is back on In/Organic to walk through the full acquisition path: what each deal was designed to solve, how they've learned to lead with culture before due diligence, why they stopped taking cold calls and built a one-pager instead, and what's still missing from the platform.

At roughly 400 people and growing toward 500, managing $600-700M in retail media spend and driving approximately $5-6B in client sales — Podean may be the most acquisitive independent agency in the US right now. And they're not done.

What we cover: The rationale behind each of the four acquisitions — Commerce Canal, AdAdvance, AdMerge, and CartBloom — why Walmart is growing faster than Amazon and CartBloom fills that gap, the hard lesson of spending six months on a deal that fell apart on culture, how Mountain Gate runs the identification process while Podean runs the relationship, the one-pager filter that stops time-wasting calls before they start, and what the next acquisition is probably going to be.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:26 — Welcome back and a quick apology to the 2,180 YouTube subscribers

1:23 — Travis Johnson reintroduction: Podean, Mountain Gate backing, four deals in nine months

2:44 — Quick refresh: the four acquisitions — Commerce Canal, AdAdvance, AdMerge, CartBloom

3:37 — Podean's strategic thesis: end-to-end, global, social commerce, retail management

4:15 — Breaking down each acquisition: what did it add?

4:43 — Commerce Canal: retail operations depth, logistics, apparel vertical, New York office

5:55 — AdAdvance: media-only depth, Amazon relationships, Streamline tech platform

7:30 — AdMerge: two-thirds ex-Amazon team, global footprint now 21 countries, EmergeView and Emerge Engine

9:30 — CartBloom: ex-Amazon, ex-Walmart founders, specialist Walmart depth in the fastest-growing retail media platform

10:32 — Deal process breakdown: three proprietary, one banker-run (AdMerge)

11:20 — What's still missing: social commerce globally and AI-native tech

12:14 — TikTok Shop growing globally — Ireland, Europe, US numbers keep rising

12:43 — Tech consolidation: from 6 tech people to 30, building AI-native unified platform

14:08 — 400+ headcount, $600-700M retail media spend, $5-6B in client sales

15:35 — "Just drop Codex on the file system and tell it to fix everything"

16:13 — Advice for smaller agencies: don't get distracted, run a solid business first

17:00 — The hard lesson: six months on a deal that fell apart on culture fit

18:02 — Lead with culture first, numbers second — the pivot that changed their process

18:25 — What taking PE money actually means: "You're about to sprint faster than you've ever sprinted"

19:30 — Integration is hard: HR platforms, titles, tools, ways of working all different

20:04 — Mountain Gate's role: strategic roadmap session, identification, deal sourcing

20:38 — Six puzzle pieces. Four filled. Two more to go.

22:13 — The one-pager filter: how to triage inbound without wasting time

24:00 — Number five is coming. Give the exclusive to In/Organic, not AdAge.

🎙️ Guest: Travis Johnson, CEO & Co-Founder, Podean

https://www.linkedin.com/in/travis-johnson77/

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

🔔 Subscribe — we'll have acquisition #5 when it drops

💬 Drop your guesses on the next Podean deal in the comments

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Joe Gadreau watched agency after agency walk away from the hardest — and most important — part of the commerce stack while he was at Salsify. So he went and built it himself.

Recorded live at Salsify's Digital Shelf Summit in Atlanta, Christian sat down with Joe Gadreau, founder and CEO of Lettuce Commerce, for a conversation about what it means to be an AI-native services company in 2024, why the "bill you forever" managed services model is dying, and how the convergence of software and services is reshaping what the next generation of consulting firms actually looks like.

What we cover: Why Joe left one of the first 20 seats at Salsify to start his own thing, the car and fuel analogy that explains why product content is the most overlooked piece of the commerce stack, how Lettuce Commerce is going after legacy SI firms head-on, Sequoia's thesis on the next trillion dollar company masquerading as a services firm, and what a bootstrapped founder thinks about capital, scale, and the right moment to consider outside investment.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:26 — Welcome and guest intro: Joe Gadreau, founder and CEO of Lettuce Commerce

0:44 — Joe's background: athlete tracking technology to employee #20 at Salsify

1:40 — Why Salsify was the right place to build a professional foundation

2:34 — The moment you know it's time to start your own thing

3:13 — The thesis: everyone builds the commerce front end, nobody fuels it with data

4:25 — "Let us help" — where the name Lettuce Commerce actually came from

5:16 — What Lettuce Commerce does: systems integrator meets strategic consultancy

6:30 — Helping clients pick the right technology, not just implement what they chose

7:43 — How Joe thinks about competing with Accenture Song and Amplify

8:00 — AI-native from day one: founded January 2024, the same era as ChatGPT

9:00 — Eating the lunch of legacy services firms built on perpetual managed services revenue

9:41 — The difference between hand-holding and genuine change management

11:22 — Repeat customers who want help with the next stage vs. dependency models

11:52 — The software-services convergence: what does it actually mean for a services business?

12:17 — Sequoia's bold statement: the next trillion dollar company will be a software company masquerading as a services firm

13:03 — Is Lettuce the orchestrator or part of a bigger journey?

13:26 — Bootstrapped and proud — and approaching the point where capital could accelerate ambition

14:34 — Controlling your own destiny while staying open to the right combination

14:57 — Christian's read: a product-led partnership is in Lettuce's not-too-distant future

🔔 Subscribe so you don't miss the big announcement

Connect with Guest, Joe Gaudreau

https://www.linkedin.com/in/joegaudreau/

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Anthropic acquired Stainless, the developer tools company that built SDKs for OpenAI, Google, Cloudflare, Perplexity, and dozens of other AI and fintech platforms. Then they wound down all hosted Stainless products. The shared supplier is no longer neutral. The tollbooth just changed hands.

Christian and Ayelet break down what happened, why it matters for every agency and AI startup in the market, and what the KPMG Q1 2026 M&A data actually says about where deal activity is heading.

One deal. One market update. Fifteen minutes. (Plus some Riverside FM chaos.)

TIMESTAMPS

0:00 — Welcome back, noisy week, Publicis/LiveRamp hangover

0:45 — KPMG Q1 2026 M&A report: deal values up 88.3% to $446B, deal count down

2:30 — Strategic vs. PE deal activity: 864 strategic, 495 PE in Q1 2026

3:23 — Advertising sector: 145 deals in Q1 2026, flat to slightly up

4:00 — Why Christian is predicting a Q2 uptick in strategic activity

4:42 — The deals happening behind closed doors that don't show in the data

5:01 — Deal: Anthropic acquires Stainless — $300M+ for the SDK plumbing of the AI industry

5:45 — What Stainless actually does: API specs into ready-to-use SDKs across languages

6:10 — The competitive denial angle: Stainless built SDKs for OpenAI, Google, Cloudflare, Perplexity

6:30 — What "winding down hosted products" actually means for Stainless customers

7:44 — Deal terms: $300M+ reported, ~2x the December 2024 Series A valuation of $150M

8:00 — Anthropic's acquisition pattern: Wunderkind, Intercepted, Coefficient Bio, now Stainless

9:00 — The through line: small specialized teams making Claude better — except Stainless is different

9:16 — If you're a shared supplier to competing platforms, you are an acquisition target

10:03 — Why this matters for every agency and commerce business building on AI

10:30 — The MCP angle: Model Context Protocol and why connectivity is the next battleground

12:29 — Why Anthropic investing in Stainless is probably also an aggressive MCP build

13:46 — The AI exit multiple conversation: how the timeline is compressing

14:25 — Grapevine AI / New Engine: outsized early exit with real AI capability

15:05 — "Capture the flag" — why traditional grow-then-sell timelines no longer apply

15:21 — Wrap, Memorial Day wishes, and please someone recommend an alternative to Riverside

Link to the KPMG report: https://kpmg.com/us/en/articles/mergers-acquisitions-trends-tech-media-telecom.html

🔔 Live every Friday — subscribe so you don't miss the big announcement

💬 Drop your guesses on the mystery buyer in the comments

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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Joining In/Organic for this special episode: Ari Paparo, 20-year ad tech veteran, host of the Marketecture podcast, and author of Yield: How Google Bought, Built and Bullied Its Way to Advertising Dominance — and Peter (PVSB) Bond, co-host of the CPG Guys podcast (closing in on episode 600) and Head of Industry and Client Engagement at Flywheel, the commerce acceleration division of Omnicom.

This is the one episode this week you can't skip.

What we cover: Is this really an agentic AI story or is that just the packaging? Why LiveRamp's client count is already down from 940 to 800 — and what happens next. Why Omnicom, WPP, and every other holdco is immediately accelerating their own identity builds. The three distinct assets inside LiveRamp and which one actually matters. Why Amazon Marketing Cloud is the elephant in the clean room conversation. What independent agencies and lower middle market ad tech players should actually do in response. And who the M&A targets are for anyone not named Publicis.

Timestamps

0:00 — Breaking news: Publicis announces plan to acquire LiveRamp

1:58 — Deal terms: $2.5B total EV, $2.16B net of cash, 2.8x revenue

2:45 — Guest intros: Ari Paparo (Marketecture) and Peter Bond (CPG Guys / Flywheel)

4:00 — The backstory: IPG acquired Acxiom in 2018 but deliberately excluded LiveRamp

5:30 — Is this an agentic AI story? Ari's honest take

7:30 — The agent execution problem: why data rails matter as much as intelligence

8:43 — The MCP angle: data as enabler vs. data as action

9:32 — Data supremacy and the holdco war — Peter's perspective

11:00 — LiveRamp client attrition: 940 → 800 and Horizon already looking to exit

11:35 — Auren Hoffman's forlorn X post and what's buried in it

12:28 — What does WPP, Omnicom, and every other holdco do now?

13:18 — Publicis's track record: Epsilon, Citrus Ad, Sapient — and whether Profiteur was worth it

14:55 — Breaking down LiveRamp's three assets: Ramp ID, clean room (Habu), and onboarding

16:30 — WPP acquired Infosum. Omnicom has Acxiom/Real ID. Who's missing what?

17:38 — Amazon Marketing Cloud owns 75% of retail media ad dollars — what does that leave LiveRamp?

19:33 — Benoit from Liquid Death: "Not having a clean room strategy in 2026 is malfeasance"

20:35 — What this means for independent agencies and lower middle market ad tech players

22:21 — LiveRamp as a natural monopoly — and why competitors now have a real window

23:35 — The Flywheel parallel: neutrality ends the moment you're inside a holdco

25:48 — M&A targets for the corps dev teams at PMG, Horizon, and the super-independents

27:16 — The Trade Desk's UID2: worth billions as a standalone, invisible inside the DSP

27:36 — The financial model of holdcos is fundamentally transforming — Peter's closing argument

29:12 — Ari's final shout-out: Optimal as the leading independent clean room target

🎙️ Guests: Ari Paparo (Marketecture) and Peter Bond (CPG Guys / Flywheel / Omnicom)

https://www.linkedin.com/in/aripaparo/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/pvsbond/

🔔 Subscribe for weekly M&A and ad tech coverage on In/Organic

www.inorganicpodcast.co

💬 Drop your takes on the Publicis/LiveRamp deal in the comments

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Christian and Ayelet are back for Deal Review Friday — and this one is packed.

Three deals. Five AI tuck-ins. One major tease still in progress. Running a little over 15 minutes. Worth it.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:00 — Welcome, May 15th 2026, and what's on the agenda

0:45 — Accenture update: deal still in progress, silence is golden

1:42 — AI tuck-in #1: Carta acquires Avantia — AI-native legal services + UK international play

3:47 — AI tuck-in #2: MoonPay acquires Dawn Labs — autonomous AI trading agents

5:38 — AI tuck-in #3: Celonis acquires Ikigai Labs — MIT spin-out, AI professor joins as chief scientist

7:30 — AI tuck-in #4: Nominal acquires Fid Labs — AI agents connecting to dev environments and physical hardware

8:20 — AI tuck-in #5: Coupa acquires Rossum — document ingestion layer completes source-to-pay stack

8:39 — Deal #1: Brands at Work acquires Chorus — two London independents bet on integrated model

9:45 — Why experiential has shifted from discretionary to core marketing strategy

11:53 — Two independents, no banker, no PE: why this deal is worth celebrating

13:05 — Deal #2: Smartly finalizes acquisition of INCRMNTAL — LOI to close in 7 weeks

13:30 — What INCRMNTAL actually does and why Smartly needed it

15:26 — Smartly manages $7B in media spend — and now has the measurement layer to match

16:00 — Props to the INCRMNTAL founders and Smartly's Head of Corp Dev

17:16 — Deal #3: OpAd Media acquires Broad Agency — two women-owned independents join forces

18:30 — How Carrie Kerpen brought the two teams together at dinner

19:30 — Ayelet was at the table when it happened

20:30 — Same theme as Brands at Work / Chorus: independents on their own terms

21:01 — Girl dinner confirmed. Christian not invited.

21:57 — Wrap + episode 60 reminder

🔔 Live every Friday — subscribe so you don't miss the big announcement

💬 Drop your guesses on the mystery buyer in the comments

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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Christian and Ayelet are back for Deal Review Friday with breaking news on an imminent Accenture acquisition, two lower middle market deals that tell you exactly what the current M&A environment looks like, and what all of this means for the scaled independents that were planning to go to market in 2027 or 2028.

The dam is breaking. Here's what you need to know.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:00 — Cinco de Mayo, Salsify's Digital Shelf Summit, and puppies

1:53 — 🚨 Breaking news: Accenture is imminently closing a ~$500M US agency acquisition

2:27 — The backstory: E52's Clay analysis and Accenture's $3B AI deployment plan

3:15 — What we know, what we're not saying yet, and why this is step two of a multi-step plan

4:43 — Why this deal will push Tata and others to move faster

5:30 — The forcing function effect: scaled independents planning 2027-28 exits may move sooner

5:56 — Why bilateral deal making is rising and what Accenture's move does to auction dynamics

6:45 — Deal #1: Recharge acquires Skio — $105M cash, 3.3x ARR, direct competitor consolidation

8:08 — What this multiple tells you about SaaS M&A right now

8:35 — The COO announced the price on X — and why that's hilarious

9:17 — Shopify ecosystem turbulence and what it means for this deal

10:14 — Capital efficiency: Skio raised $4-8M and sold for $105M

11:05 — Deal #2: IREN acquires Mirantis — $625M all-stock, AI infrastructure play

11:30 — What Mirantis actually does and why NVIDIA is at the center of this

13:27 — The NVIDIA deal sequence: founding partner in March, $3.4B contract, $2.1B investment

14:30 — Why the timing of these events tells the real M&A story

15:44 — 27 years to a $625M exit — what the AI era does for legacy infrastructure companies

16:04 — Wrap: ep 60 with Brenda Jacobsen dropped, Salsify content coming

🔔 Live every Friday — subscribe so you don't miss the big announcement

💬 Drop your guesses on the mystery buyer in the comments

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

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In this episode of the InOrganic Podcast, we sit down with Brenda Jacobsen, Managing Director at STS Capital Partners, a sell-side M&A advisory firm focused on helping founders and operators find the right strategic buyer — not just the highest bidder. What makes Brenda unique? She's not a banker by training. She's a former operator who built and sold three companies herself, including a regional network of medical clinics and a corporate mindfulness media company. She's been on your side of the table.

Brenda walks us through the full arc of what it means to navigate a business exit — from the first internal conversation with your co-founders, to closing day, and everything in between.

In this episode, we cover:

🧠 Why most partner misalignments happen before you ever talk to a banker

📋 The "Owner's Outcome Exercise" — a simple framework to get founders aligned on what success actually looks like

⏰ When to start having exit conversations (hint: it's earlier than you think)

📉 How to read the hidden clauses in your equity docs that could cost you control of your exit

💰 Current M&A valuation ranges for digital marketing agencies (3–6x EBITDA) and what moves the needle

🤖 Why you need to stop "BS-ing your AI story" — and what buyers actually want to see

🏥 A fascinating case study on data ownership in outsourced radiology and why it changed the deal conversation entirely

👻 How phantom equity can keep your key operators invested all the way through close

❤️ The emotional side of selling — and how the right sell-side advisor acts less like a banker and more like a witness

Whether you're planning to sell in 12 months or 12 years, this conversation is packed with practical, honest advice from someone who has lived both sides of the deal table.

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

🎙️ Guest: Brenda Jacobsen, Managing Director, STS Capital Partners

🌐 Learn more about STS Capital: www.stscapital.com

📌 Subscribe to the InOrganic Podcast for weekly conversations on M&A, growth, and building businesses worth buying.

#MergersAndAcquisitions #BusinessExit #Entrepreneurship #SellYourBusiness #PrivateEquity #MiddleMarket #MAStrategy #BusinessGrowth #Founders #InOrganicPodcast

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Water cooler conversations at the Possible conference are pointing to a major deal announcement in the next two weeks — a strategic buyer nobody has seen coming, going after independent agencies with significant media underspend. Christian and Ayelet are on the story. Stay close.

But first: two deals, two market insights from the Ad Age House session at Possible, and one very clean example of how a bootstrapped independent agency is running corp dev with zero institutional capital behind it.

Two deals. One major tease. Under 16 minutes.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:00 — Post-Possible recovery, thank yous, and let's get into it

0:37 — Market insight #1: Rollups in fragmented categories are the PE thesis right now

2:00 — Why PE backs away when two players already control 40% of a category

2:30 — Market insight #2: AI is breaking reps and warranties in M&A deals

4:00 — The 12-18 month outlook: legacy media consolidation, take privates, dry powder still parked

5:20 — Deal #1: Brkthru acquires Gigawatt — bootstrapped agency runs corp dev in-house

7:00 — Why Breakthrough's January acquisition announcement was genius top-of-funnel

8:00 — The vertical thesis: hospitality and tourism, low-risk test case deal

9:00 — You don't need institutional capital to run an M&A strategy

9:48 — Deal #2: Instacart acquires InstaLeap — grocery tech, international expansion

11:00 — What Instacart actually bought (it's not just international coverage)

12:00 — Storefront Pro vs. InstaLeap: two different operating models for two different markets

13:00 — The 100 retailer relationships across 30 countries are the real asset

13:30 — Instacart's full M&A cadence: 2021 through 2026

14:17 — Props to the corp dev team, PMI advisor, and GP Bullhound sell-side

15:47 — 🚨 The tease: a mystery strategic buyer is coming for independent agencies

🔔 Live every Friday — subscribe so you don't miss the big announcement

💬 Drop your guesses on the mystery buyer in the comments

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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In this episode of In/organic, Christian Hassold sits down with Scot Wingo at Shoptalk to talk about ReFiBuy, AI agents, ecommerce infrastructure, SaaS moats, founder survival, and what early-stage companies should do as AI reshapes software and go-to-market.

Scot is best known as the founder and former CEO of ChannelAdvisor, which went public in 2013 and was later acquired by private equity. He is also an active investor and mentor in the North Carolina startup ecosystem, with exposure to hundreds of early-stage companies.

The conversation covers:

- Why Scot started ReFiBuy after reading about agentic AI

- How AI agents could create the next generation of ecommerce marketplaces

- Why “research, find, buy” may become a new commerce workflow

- What ChannelAdvisor taught Scot about marketplaces, infrastructure, and exits

- Why going public is exciting, but running a public company may not be for every founder

- How founders should think about defensibility and moats in the AI era

- Why proprietary data, workflow depth, and customer feedback matter more than ever

- What early-stage SaaS companies should do when capital is harder to raise

- Why go-to-market is breaking for many traditional software companies

- How founders should evaluate M&A, acquihires, mergers, and strategic exits

- What Scot expects from agentic commerce over the next 12 months

- This episode is for SaaS founders, ecommerce operators, investors, corporate development leaders, and anyone trying to understand how AI agents will change software, marketplaces, and M&A.

Chapters

00:00 Intro from Shoptalk

00:45 Meet Scot Wingo

02:00 From ChannelAdvisor to ReFiBuy

04:00 Why public-company life was not the right fit

06:00 Investing in the North Carolina startup ecosystem

09:00 What ReFiBuy is building

12:00 Agentic commerce and the next marketplace shift

16:00 Why content and thought leadership still matter

20:00 Learning from customers and following the thread

24:00 Startup survival in a tougher funding market

28:00 Why SaaS go-to-market is breaking

32:00 Defensibility and moats in the AI era

37:00 Proprietary data and workflow depth

42:00 M&A options for early-stage startups

47:00 Mergers, acquihires, and strategic exits

52:00 AI valuations and changing SaaS multiples

56:00 Scot’s predictions for agentic commerce

01:00:00 Final thoughts

Subscribe to In/organic for conversations on SaaS M&A, AI disruption, strategic acquisitions, agency M&A, and lower-middle-market dealmaking.

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

Connect with Scot Wingo

https://www.linkedin.com/in/thescotwingo/

Learn More about Refibuy

https://www.linkedin.com/company/refibuy/

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Christian and Ayelet are back for Deal Review Friday with a market data deep dive and two deals that just closed — a partner-first aqui-hire by Amex that's been in the works since 2024, and the final piece of a three-part sequenced build by Viant that's been two years in the making.

Two deals. One market correction. Still under 20 minutes.

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:00 — Happy Friday, conference circuit recap (Jaggly Leonis + Own It Women's Summit)

1:00 — Market insight: Luma Partners says ad tech M&A is down. Are they right?

2:30 — Breaking down the data: sub-$100M vs. $100M+ deal activity by category

3:45 — Ad tech, martech, digital content — what's actually moving and what's not

5:00 — The sub-$50M thesis: where Christian and Ayelet think the real action is

6:10 — Deal #1: Amex acquires Hyper (HyperCard) — agentic AI expense management

7:17 — The Hyper investor roster: Sam Altman, former MasterCard CEO, Netflix co-founder

8:00 — How this fits Amex's expense management platform launch later this year

9:00 — Center (2025) gave them the workflow. Hyper gives them the AI agent layer.

9:45 — Amex's direct play on Concur, Ramp, and Brex

10:10 — Was this an acqui-hire? Christian's take on the deal structure

10:44 — Deal #2: Viant acquires TVision Insights for $40M

12:00 — The trifecta: Iris TV (content) + Locker (identity) + TVision (attention)

13:18 — The data exclusivity question — and why this deal is different from Iris TV

13:58 — Props to Eric Stearns, Viant Head of Corp Dev — first deal in seat

14:22 — Deal economics: 4x revenue, $22.5M cash, clean balance sheet

15:36 — TVision raised at $80M valuation, sold for $40M — the cap table math

16:00 — Wrap + episode drops: Ep. 56 (AI Agents) and Scott Wingo episode incoming

🔔 Subscribe — we're going live every Friday

💬 Drop deals you want us to cover in the comments

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

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Christian and Ayelet are back for Deal Review Friday with three deals that just crossed the wire — including Mountain Gate's fifth add-on in under five weeks, a retail intelligence merger that was clearly part of the thesis from day one, and one of the more creative dual-strategic acquisitions we've seen in a while.

Three deals. One market signal. Fifteen minutes. (Okay, twenty.)

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

0:00 — LinkedIn buffering, as usual

0:48 — Market signal: strategic LOIs up 40% YoY per Spearhead Corp Dev

1:30 — PE deal volume Q1: $216B, up from $190B — but strategics are the real story

2:46 — Deal #1: Harvest Group (Mountain Gate) acquires Cartograph — 35 days after platform close

5:35 — Cartograph's superpower: scaling challenger brands on Amazon

6:44 — Full disclosure: Mountain Gate is not sponsoring this podcast

7:13 — Who advised? Chris Moe peels back the layers

8:30 — Deal #2: Engine + Nuqleous merge to form end-to-end retail intelligence platform

12:18 — CPG point solution fragmentation and why this merger was inevitable

13:26 — Nick Dossier: repeat offender, same playbook, larger scale

14:00 — Crisp lit up this category — and Engine is now the OG competitor

16:24 — Engine's full acquisition history: Evertech, Leftbridge, now Nuqleous

17:18 — Deal #3: Cary sells for $80M on $900K ARR — AngelList + Lettuce split the asset

19:00 — Founder's second exit (first was Teachable at $250M)

20:04 — Wrap: yes, we went over 15 minutes again

🔔 Subscribe — we're going live every Friday

💬 Drop deals you want us to cover in the comments

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast

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No guests, no fluff. Just Christian and Ayelet live with market intel and the deals that closed this week — before everyone else is talking about them.

This week: private debt markets are tightening (and it's freezing $100M+ deals), Podean just keeps buying, Mountain Gate is deploying out of Fund 3 at an alarming pace, and MIQ quietly built a mobile M&A stack nobody noticed.

Three deals, one market signal, under 15 minutes.

What we cover: the private debt compression from 4.5x to 3.0-3.5x EBITDA and what it actually means for deal flow, Podean's third add-on in under six months (UK-based AdMerge), Mountain Gate's fourth platform investment out of Fund 3 (Upswell Marketing), and MIQ's mobile capability gap-fill with Rocket Lab out of Latin America.

TIMESTAMPS

0:00 — Introducing Deal Review Fridays: why we're going live

1:30 — Market signal: private debt compression and its downstream M&A impact

4:11 — Ayelet on the ground: deals still closing sub-$50M EV

4:54 — Deal #1: Podean adds AdMerge (UK) — third add-on, ~$30-35M revenue run rate

7:37 — Deal #2: Mountain Gate platforms Upswell Marketing — Fund 3, fourth investment

9:34 — Mountain Gate's portfolio thesis: multiple distinct platforms in parallel vertical lanes

10:41 — Deal #3: MIQ acquires Rocket Lab — mobile gap fill + LATAM programmatic stack

13:35 — Wrap: what Deal Review Fridays are (and what they're not)

🔔 Subscribe — we're going live every Friday

💬 Drop deals you want us to cover in the comments

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast

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EverWorker is building an AI workforce platform that helps companies launch AI employees in as little as 45 days. Ameya explains why DIY agents often break down inside real organizations, why maintenance and adoption matter more than the first prototype, and how AI-first agencies may gain market share while slower agencies get left behind.

The conversation covers:

- Why building one AI agent is easy, but scaling 30-40 use cases is hard

- How EverWorker turns AI workers into modular business infrastructure

- Why vertical AI agent platforms, agencies, and consulting firms are at risk

- How EverWorker beat a traditional consulting firm in an AI strategy process

- Why early-stage startups and agencies are adopting AI workers now

- What AI-first agencies need to do to stay competitive

Chapter Markers

00:00 Intro from Shoptalk

00:39 Meet Ameya from EverWorker

01:00 What EverWorker does

01:29 Why DIY AI agents are not enough

02:55 The problem with maintaining agents

04:26 Making AI workers easier to manage

05:31 EverWorker’s funding and company stage

06:09 Will EverWorker acquire or be acquired?

06:58 Whose lunch will AI workers eat?

08:25 Could Accenture buy EverWorker?

08:39 How small businesses can start using AI workers

09:06 Why agencies need to become AI-first

10:09 Final thoughts

If you’re a founder, agency owner, SaaS operator, investor, or M&A professional trying to understand how AI agents will change business services, this episode is a practical look at where the market is going.

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast

Connect with Ameya Deshmukh

https://www.linkedin.com/in/ameyadeshmukh10/

Learn more about EverWorker

https://everworker.ai

Subscribe to In/organic for conversations on SaaS M&A, agency M&A, AI disruption, strategic acquisitions, and lower-middle-market dealmaking.

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What we cover:

- Why Scott tried to retire after Frame.io and lasted two days

- How he reframed "fraud prevention" as a customer intelligence problem

- Kissing 150 frogs before finding Yofi — and why the partnership came first

- The exact filters he uses for M&A: product acceleration, GTM fit, buyer alignment, pricing architecture

- Why philosophical alignment matters more than the term sheet

- The rebrand from NoFraud → Wyllo and what the name actually means

- His buy box for the next acquisition (hint: $5M+ revenue, data-first)

- Who writes the $1-2B check for Wyllo in a few years (MasterCard? Visa? A help desk platform?)

⏱️ TIMESTAMPS

1:11 — Welcome & guest intro: Scott Gifis, CEO of Wyllo (formerly NoFraud)

1:53 — From aspiring pro hockey player to 7 early-stage startups

4:53 — Frame.io → Adobe: the $1.3B exit story

5:49 — Why Scott chose commerce after the exit (and why it's the hardest space to win)

8:10 — The contrarian playbook: always call the investors who passed on the last deal

9:20 — Reframing the category: fraud prevention isn't payments, it's trust intelligence

13:51 — What is Wyllo? The CX-first risk intelligence platform explained

16:15 — The checkout product disaster — and what it actually taught him

17:39 — Why the e-commerce tooling market is fundamentally broken

19:10 — The Shopify model: what they got right and where the Wild West begins

21:14 — M&A is like marriage: you can't just swipe right

21:58 — The original thesis: buy all the software (and why it fell apart)

23:47 — Driving alignment without an M&A background: Scott's three filters

25:10 — The GTM fit trap everyone misses: buying center and pricing architecture

26:32 — "Marriages don't die because people fight. They die because they don't."

28:26 — Partner first: why the Yofi relationship started as a go-to-market partnership

31:58 — How Wyllo won despite being the smallest bidder at the table

33:52 — Deal structure breakdown: cash, rollover equity, and the earn-out challenge

36:44 — Why Scott waited three years to rebrand (the brand must earn the promise)

38:28 — Why they chose "Wyllo": roots, flexibility, protection, and the changemaker thesis 39:18 — Buy box for the next acquisition: what Scott is actually looking for

40:30 — The $5M revenue threshold and what it signals about product-market fit

41:11 — "The complexity of GTM has become several levels harder than five years ago"

41:18 — The one capability Scott would go acquire right now if he could

42:32 — Who writes the $1-2B check for Wyllo? The strategic acquirer shortlist

45:50 — Wrap-up and close

🔔 Subscribe for weekly agency and SaaS M&A coverage

📍 Recorded live at ShopTalk, Las Vegas

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with Scott Gifis on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/scottpgifis/

Learn more about Wyllo: https://wyllo.ai/

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The question every banker, founder, and PE partner is asking right now — and we used Clay to actually answer it.

Christian used Clay to run a full analysis of the Forrester Commerce Services Wave Q1 2026 and map out which players have both the strategic rationale AND the balance sheet to acquire a scaled independent. The answer might surprise you (👀 Tata).

Then we break down FIVE deals from Q1 that you need to know about:

• Front Row + Socium Media — textbook Amazon-first capability acquisition
• Podean + AdAdvance — tech + customer base play from the Mountaingate portfolio
• OneMagnify + Optimal — carve-out, vertical depth, and a now ~1,000 person agency
• Shipyard + Fancy AI — the smartest "partner before you buy" move we've seen in a while
• Sol XC + Craft & Commerce — quiet cross-border deal flying under the radar
• 
  

Plus: why WPP + a PE sponsor could flip from "maybe" to "yes" fast, and what the recurring AI-forward theme across all five deals actually signals.

Timeline

01:15 - Celebrating 10,000 YouTube views: growth milestone

02:11 - What strategic buyers are willing to pay for independent agencies

03:10 - The Forrester Commerce Services Wave and agency positioning in the market

05:55 - Analyzing the cash positions of potential acquirers like Tata and Accenture

07:18 - When do strategic players step in to make their move?

09:22 - Highlights of recent acquisitions: Front Row and Socium

10:11 - The strategic fit: Amazon-focused agencies and vertical capabilities

12:13 - Podion’s recent acquisition of AdAdvance and its strategic significance

14:01 - Clarity in deal strategy amid rising deal volume in the first quarter

15:03 - The role of PE firms like Mountain Gate building strong portfolios

16:16 - The importance of strategic clarity and data-backed decision making in M&A

17:05 - The acquisition of Optimal’s performance media by One Magnify

18:16 - Expanding capabilities through strategic acquisitions and vertical specialization

19:41 - The latest on strategic investments: Shipyard’s partnership with Fancy AI

23:16 - A hidden gem: Craft and Commerce’s acquisition by Sol XC and Amazon retail media focus

24:24 - The ongoing hunt for agencies: Opportunities in performance marketing and Amazon services

25:37 - The quest for sponsors and strategic partnerships to support industry growth

26:20 - Final insights: credible buyers are out there, retail media remains hot, and AI integration continues to shape deal flow

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode, Azim Nagree, head of M&A at Herringbone Digital, shares insights on building a successful origination engine, the importance of early and honest communication in M&A, and how agencies can prepare for sale by focusing on retention, growth, and profitability.

Takeaways

• Open and honest conversations early in the process streamline deals.
• Retention rate of 80% is a key indicator of business health.
• Growth of 15-20% and EBITDA of 20-25% are desirable benchmarks.
• AI should improve core business metrics to add value.
• Founders should focus on building a strong foundation before sale.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Milestone Celebration

01:10 Azim Nagree’s Background and Herringbone's Focus

05:42 Herringbone's Acquisition Strategy and Ideal Targets

07:49 Relationship with Private Equity and Deal Support

09:21 Lessons from Deal Experience and Early Communication

13:43 Deal Origination Process and Tech Stack

15:00 Defining the Prospect Universe and Narrowing the Buy Box

16:33 Balancing Organic and Broker Deal Sourcing

18:43 Assessing Seller Readiness and Valuation Expectations

20:01 Using the 'Magic Number' to Evaluate Sellers

23:57 The Triangle of Value: Retention, Growth, Profitability

25:21 Evaluating EBITDA and Adjusted EBITDA

28:57 Retention and Growth Benchmarks for Agencies

29:59 The Leaky Bucket Problem in Agencies

30:05 Identifying Signs of Retention Issues

30:36 Impact of AI on Agency Valuation and Performance

34:09 Common Mistakes Before Selling an Agency

35:36 Advice for Founders Considering Exit

36:47 Managing Communications with Potential Buyers

39:51 Closing Remarks and Key Takeaways

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with Azim Nagree on LinkedIn

Herringbone Digital - https://herringbonedigital.com 

Azim Nagree on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/azimnagree/ 

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Key Topics:

• How Yannick built Shadow Digital from a freelance side hustle into a successful agency
• The pivotal moment when he realized the value of making his business sellable
• The lessons learned from hitting rock bottom during a major agency crisis in 2020
• The unique approach Vesa Digital takes to agency roll-ups and the concept of the VAN (Vesa Agency Network) strategy
• Creative deal structures and the importance of leaving chips on the table during acquisitions
• How Yannick is leveraging his CEO experience to now lead Vesa’s inorganic & M&A efforts
• The impact of self-sourcing deals and avoiding traditional private equity pathways
• Navigating culture fit, valuation, and deal negotiations with founders
• Practical advice for founders about financial literacy, recurring revenue focus, and deal-making mindset

Timestamps:

(0:13) The rapid evolution of Claude AI and setting up local coding interfaces

(1:27) The magic of task stacking versus answer approximation in Claude

(3:05) Introducing Yannick Lorenz and his entry into agency growth and exit

(4:26) Yannick’s background: from Germany to founder in California

(6:10) Building Shadow Digital: from side hustle to agency

(8:38) The turning point: landing a $20,000 deal and scaling

(11:26) Navigating the 2020 crisis and the push toward specialization

(12:24) Scaling rapidly with Webflow before the crash

(13:47) A major realization: building a business to sell and the importance of cash flow

(15:15) How Yannick connected with Vesa during a cold outreach mistake

(17:19) The evaluation process: fit, culture, and professionalism

(20:05) From lifestyle agency to a growth-focused exit plan

(22:14) Strategies for leaving cash in the business before an exit

(23:23) Reflecting on the emotional rollercoaster of entrepreneurship

(25:21) Learning the inorganic & M&A game from top experts

(27:48) Vesa’s current inorganic growth strategy and future plans

(29:55) Creative deal structures in agency acquisitions ($500K–$1M range)

(34:15) Lessons on being an empathetic versus aggressive acquirer

(36:25) Why financial literacy and recurring revenue are vital for deals

(38:35) How interested founders can connect with Yannick for opportunities

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with Yannick Lorenz on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/shadowyaya/

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

• The emergence of AI-native agencies as highlighted by Y Combinator's 2026 request list
• How agencies are evolving to resemble software companies with higher margins and scalability
• The challenges traditional agencies face integrating innovative, tech-led models
• Trends in agency valuations, deal structures, and the influence of private equity
• An in-depth analysis of the recent Grapevine AI acquisition and its significance
• The shifting landscape of deal valuation, cash on close, and deal structure for tech-forward agencies
• The barriers to adopting AI and modern practices within conservative client organizations
• The strategic rationale behind merging creator economies with AI-enabled marketing solutions

00:00 - Building custom Claude bots and the evolution of OpenClaw

02:12 - Silicon Valley’s focus on AI-native agencies

03:00 - How agencies will become more like software companies

03:50 - The landscape of traditional vs. modern, tech-forward agencies

07:02 - Private equity's view on services versus software investments

09:40 - Recent acquisitions: New Engine’s Grapevine AI and other strategic moves

11:32 - What makes Grapevine AI unique in creator-led content

14:10 - The impact of deal structure and valuation rigor in AI agency acquisitions

17:23 - How founders are pushing for tech-led valuations and lower risk models

18:16 - The challenges of adapting legacy agency models to AI-driven futures

20:11 - Industry response and what’s next for agency deal activity

• Grapevine AI
• New Engine
• Y Combinator - 2026 Startups List (scroll to #3)
• LinkedIn - Caroline LaVere

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Takeaways

• Podean was founded to bridge gaps in the retail media landscape.
• Retail media is becoming increasingly important for brands.
• Global consistency is a priority for large brands.
• Podean's growth strategy includes a focus on social commerce.
• The partnership with Mountain Gate Capital aims to enhance Podean's capabilities.
• Navigating the M&A process requires careful preparation and cultural alignment.
• AI is seen as a transformative tool, but its implementation must be thoughtful.
• Future growth for Podean includes strategic acquisitions to enhance service offerings.

Chapters

02:28 Travis Johnson’s Background & Podean

04:55 Retail Media Today & Holdco Limits

08:00 Building a Global Marketplace Business

10:41 Social Commerce & Live Shopping

11:19 Winning Clients from Holdcos

12:47 Early M&A Talks & Learning Private Equity

16:00 Choosing the Platform Model & Mountaingate

19:08 Control, Governance & Valuation Realities

23:57 Strategic Buyers vs. Private Equity

28:26 Commerce Canal: The Right Acquisition

31:13 Closing Two Deals & Integration

39:24 Using AI Without the Hype

45:37 Growth Strategy & What’s Next

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with Travis Johnson

https://www.linkedin.com/in/travis-johnson77/ 

Follow Podean on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/company/podean/ 

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Takeaways

• Acquisitions can solve almost every business challenge.
• Partnership dynamics often require external mediation.
• Strategic thinking is crucial in M&A.
• Building relationships is key to successful acquisitions.
• Acquisitions offer a faster path to business growth.
• Understanding seller motivation is essential in deals.
• Partnership conflicts can hinder business progress.
• Acquisitions can provide liquidity and strategic opportunities.

Chapters

00:46 Tom Shipley’s Path Into M&A

01:38 The First Acquisition That Changed Everything

05:34 Using Acquisitions to Solve Cash and Capability Gaps

08:28 Buy vs. Build: Rethinking Entrepreneurship

09:37 Seller Motivation and Why Deals Exist Everywhere

11:50 Organic Growth vs. Acquisition Math

13:41 Partnership Misalignment as a Growth Blocker

14:21 How M&A Can Resolve Partner Deadlock

19:26 Mergers as a Reset for Growth and Liquidity

28:40 The Valley of Despair for Mid-Market Founders

29:45 Buying the Next Chapter vs. Starting Over

31:50 Where to Find Acquisition Opportunities

37:49 Adding a Zero: Expanding the Mental Model

39:44 DealCon, Reources, and Community

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with Tom Shipley

https://www.linkedin.com/in/t-shipley/

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Takeaways

• Robin Skidmore's entrepreneurial journey began with a car wash at age 12.
• Journey Further was launched in 2017 with a clear roadmap for growth.
• The agency focuses on performance media and aims to be creatively driven.
• Acquisition of Salderson Media was strategic for expanding capabilities.
• Expanding to the U.S. market presented unique challenges and cultural differences.
• Maintaining a strong company culture is crucial for agency success.
• The UK agency market is experiencing consolidation and increased competition.
• AI is transforming the marketing landscape, requiring agencies to adapt.
• Investing in startups allows for a deeper understanding of client challenges.
• Cultural dynamics influence agency operations and client relationships.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Robin Skidmore and Journey Further

02:14 Robin's Entrepreneurial Journey and Epiphany Search

04:52 The Evolution of Journey Further

08:13 Acquisition of Salderson Media and Market Relevance

10:32 Expanding to the U.S. Market: Challenges and Insights

17:31 Cultural Differences in Agency Operations

20:16 Lessons from Epiphany to Journey Further

23:29 The State of the UK Agency Market

26:21 Future Growth Strategies and Inorganic Expansion

30:28 Cultural Dynamics in Agency Growth

34:21 Investments Beyond Agencies: The Pub and Startups

41:22 Maintaining Culture and Addressing AI Challenges

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Takeaways

• AI is driving significant M&A activity in the tech sector.
• Recent acquisitions show high valuation multiples for AI companies.
• The trend of acquiring talent over products is prevalent in AI M&A.
• Digital agencies must adapt to the changing landscape influenced by AI.
• There is a potential consolidation in the agency market due to AI advancements.
• Strategic acquirers are looking for speed to market through AI capabilities.
• The valuation of AI startups is often based on capital raised rather than revenue.
• The market for AI capabilities in agencies is still developing.
• Founders may need to be realistic about their exit multiples in the current environment.
• The future of digital agencies will be shaped by AI innovations.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to AI Trends

01:03 M&A Activity in AI

05:16 Valuation Multiples in AI Acquisitions

11:00 The Talent Acquisition Race

15:18 AI's Impact on Agencies

19:07 Future of Digital Agencies

25:01 Opportunities in AI Acquisitions

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Takeaways

• Carrie started Likeable Media in 2007, one of the first social media agencies.
• The initial focus was not on exiting but on building a profitable business.
• Setting a target exit value can help guide business decisions.
• Timing and personal readiness are crucial when deciding to sell a business.
• Choosing the right M&A advisor can significantly impact the sale process.
• Negotiating earn-outs requires careful consideration of control and reporting.
• Reflecting on the exit process can reveal areas for improvement.
• Building a community for women founders can provide essential support.
• Women entrepreneurs often face unique challenges in the exit process.
• M&A can be a powerful tool for business growth and problem-solving.

Chapters

0:00 Introducing Carrie Kerpen

1:05 Founding Likeable Media 

3:33 Early Growth & Cash Flow Challenges

5:22 Becoming CEO and Focusing on Profitability

6:37 Market Shifts & Productizing the Agency

7:21 Building a Brand through All the Social Ladies

9:07 Financial Stability & the $20M Exit Goal 

10:43 Knowing When It's Time to Sell

12:55 Choosing an M&A Advisor vs. a Banker

15:36 Price vs. Timing After the Exit

18:22 Negotiating & Protecting an Earnout

22:02 Life After the Sale

23:12 What Carrie Would Do Differently

24:51 Acting Like a Platform and Rethinking Capital

25:58 The Exit Gap and The Whisper Group

27:45 Closing Thoughts

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with guest, Carrie Kerpen

https://www.linkedin.com/in/carriekerpen/

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, co-hosts Christian Hassold and Ayelet Shipley chat with Chloe Cotoulas, Partner at Everos Group and an investment banker with a diverse background in advertising and finance. On this episode they discuss Chloe's unique career path, the evolution of holdcos in the advertising industry, and the impact of market trends on large-scale independent agencies. The conversation also explores the future outlook for deal activity in the coming quarters, emphasizing the importance of AI and experiential marketing in shaping the industry.

Takeaways

• Chloe transitioned from a creative background to investment banking.
• The convergence of creativity and business is crucial in today's market.
• Holdcos are facing challenges due to changing market dynamics.
• AI is reshaping the advertising landscape and agency operations.
• Experiential marketing is becoming central to brand strategies.
• The enterprise value of agencies is often misrepresented in the market.
• Private equity is increasingly interested in the advertising ecosystem.
• Founders are reconsidering their exit strategies in light of market changes.
• The importance of financial performance in upcoming deal activity is paramount.
• Prompt engineering is emerging as a valuable skill in the creative industry.

Chapters

00:52 Chloe Cotoulas' Presidential Writing Experience

05:07 Chloe’s Career Path from Creative to Finance

10:04 Holdco Shakeups, IPG–Omnicom, & WPP

17:26 How Market Turmoil Impacts Independents

19:03 New Buyers & Founder Mindset 

22:38 Selling to Holdcos vs. Challenger Networks

24:15 The Rising Trend of Experiential + Social

30:19 Deal Flow Outlook for the Next Two Quarters

32:45 AI Opportunity: Differentiation & Acceleration

33:24 AI Risks, Defensibility, & Prompt Engineering

36:51 Closing Thoughts 

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with guest, Chloe Cotoulas

https://www.linkedin.com/in/chloe-cotoulas-92082861/

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Takeaways

• Thanksgiving cooking hacks can lead to perfect meals.
• The acquisition of Giant Spoon by WPromote is a significant industry move.
• Trust and communication are crucial in the deal process.
• Shared expectations workshops can enhance collaboration.
• Having a partner to navigate complex P&Ls is critical to navigating technical financial discussions in a deal process
• Market reactions can provide insights into industry perceptions.
• The integration process should be planned from the start.
• Maintaining brand identity is important post-acquisition.
• Future goals and objectives are vital for continued growth.

Chapters

00:00 Thanksgiving Reflections and Cooking Hacks

02:12 Major Acquisition Announcement: WPromote and Giant Spoon

05:05 The Search for the Right Agency: A Corporate Development Journey

10:08 Navigating the Deal Process: Trust and Communication

17:31 Building Trust: Shared Expectations Workshop

21:30 Challenges and Insights from the Deal Process

25:05 Market Reactions and Industry Perspectives

29:21 Final Thoughts and Future Goals

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Episode References

Ad Age Deal Announcement

GE’s Opening Day Commercial by Giant Spoon

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In this episode of the In/organic Podcast, co-host Christian Hassold shares insights from the KPMG Technology M&A Conference, discussing the current landscape of mergers and acquisitions, particularly in the tech sector. In this episode, Christian shares highlights from the conference, including the pervasive influence of AI on M&A decisions, the challenges and opportunities presented by the AI investing landscape, and the importance of creative deal structures in navigating the current market dynamics. The episode also covers the “operator's dilemma” faced by CEOs - that is, the rise in peer pressure to do M&A, and what are the best practices are from leading strategics. Finally, Hassold provides an overview of current B2B SaaS deal activity and market trends based on Pitchbook data.

Takeaways

• The KPMG M&A Conference provided valuable insights into current market dynamics.
• AI is a major factor influencing M&A decisions and strategies.
• VCs are increasingly making investments in AI startups without getting governance rights, and not always checking the underlying economics of the business
• The operator's dilemma highlights the challenges that CEOs face in mergers and acquisitions (M&A).
• Corporate development roles are seeing a significant increase in demand.
• Top CEOs simplify their M&A strategies to focus on core problems.
• Deal activity in the tech sector is on the rise, indicating a healthy market.
• Earnouts are becoming a significant component of deal structures.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Context of the Episode

02:50 Insights from the KPMG M&A and Tech Conference

06:04 AI's Pervasive Influence on Tech and M&A

08:54 The AI Investing Landscape

11:40 Deal Structures Sparking Innovation

16:42 The Operator's Dilemma in M&A

21:48 Corporate Development and Deal Activity

24:38 Priorities in M&A for Corporates vs. Private Equity

29:19 Case Studies of Successful M&A Strategies

32:59 Market Update on Deal Activity and Earnouts

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Episode References

KPMG M&A Conference Agenda

KPMG 2025 Deal Market Study (buyer priorities)

Kirkland & Ellis M&A Bring Down Report 2025 (earnout data)

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, co-hosts Ayelet Shipley and Christian Hassold welcome Brian Burt, founder & CEO of Canopy Management. In this episode, we discuss Brian's entrepreneurial journey, with an emphasis on his principles for building the business and expanding through highly accretive tuck-in M&A transactions. Brian also shares the importance of cultural fit in successful integrations. He then discusses the challenges and opportunities presented by AI in the retail media space, emphasizing the need for omnichannel marketing strategies. The conversation underscores the importance of momentum in business and the role of performance-based incentives in sustaining an entrepreneurial spirit within acquired teams.

Takeaways

• Canopy Management has grown without external investment, focusing on mergers and acquisitions for expansion.
• The need for operational efficiency and scalability drove the first acquisition.
• Cultural fit and shared values are crucial in successful acquisitions.
• Integrating new teams requires clear communication and defined outcomes.
• Performance-based incentives help maintain entrepreneurial spirit in acquired teams.
• AI presents both a threat and an opportunity for the agency space.
• Omnichannel marketing is essential for modern e-commerce success.
• Building a strong personal brand aids in building an acquisition funnel
• Momentum in business is key to successful integration and growth.?

Chapters

00:26 Brian Burt’s Background 

02:38 Growing through M&A 

12:31 Culture Fit and Founder Alignment

13:09 Integrating the First Acquisition

16:36 Defining and Executing Acquihires

20:45 Evolving the Playbook

23:46 Incentives Pods, and Integration Strategy

27:44 Scale Synergy and Sustainable Growth

31:28 Market Outlook: Retail Media Omnichannel and AI

37:14 Closing Thoughts and Takeaways

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with guest Brian Burt

https://www.linkedin.com/in/brianburt1/

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

On this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, co-hosts Christian Hassold and Ayelet Shipley are joined by guest Jeff Cohen, newly minted Chief Business Development Officer of Skai, former Principal Evangelist for Amazon Ads, and in general a seasoned operator with an extensive background in commerce and tech. In this episode, the hosts and guest explore the current state and future vision of omnichannel commerce. Their discussion spans the immediate and long-term prospects of retail media agencies and the defensibility of these businesses based on their commonly observed category-specific expertise. As a part of this discussion, they talk about notable retail media agencies including Podean, Cartograph, and Envision Horizons. The conversation emphasizes the need for agencies to adapt and innovate in a rapidly changing market.

Takeaways

• E-commerce is growing at a rate of 6-8%.
• Retail media is experiencing growth rates in the low to mid 20s.
• Omnichannel connectivity is crucial for brands.
• Brands often underutilize Amazon's audience capabilities.
• Organizational silos hinder effective marketing strategies.
• Audience planning is essential for successful media execution.
• Agencies should act as partners, not just service providers.
• The future of retail media agencies is evolving rapidly.
• AI can significantly enhance operational efficiency in marketing.

Chapters

01:01 Introduction & Why Omnichannel Commerce Matters

02:40 Jeff Cohen’s Journey

04:46 The Growth of Commerce Talent

05:58 Defining Omnichannel Commerce

07:39 Are Brands Underutilizing Amazon’s Potential?

11:58 Balancing In-House and Agency Collaboration

14:21 Audience Planning: The Core of Retail Media

18:31 How Retail Media Agencies Differentiate and Mature

22:00 The Future of Agencies with AI & Tech

34:07 Inside Skai: AI Tools and Omnichannel Evolution

37:25 Platform Strategy & The Broader Tech Landscape 

40:40 Closing Reflections & Takeaways

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with guest Jeff Cohen

https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffreycohen/

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode of the In/organic Podcat, co-hosts Christian Hassold and Ayelet Shipley welcome guest Matt Bodnar, founder and managing partner at Eidolon Capital. Matt is a business owner and investor with substantial experience using M&A as a lever to acquire and grow businesses. In this episode, Matt discusses how he has leveraged his intellectual interest in valuations and deal structuring to execute creative and accretive deals. Further, Matt discusses the importance of understanding earnings and multiples in business valuation, the impact of size on valuation, and the challenges of customer concentration. Additionally, he provides strategies for sellers to maximize their exit value, emphasizing the need for thoughtful analysis and potential acquisitions to enhance business value.

Takeaways

• Valuation can be simplified to earnings and multiples.
• Size significantly impacts business valuation multiples.
• Customer concentration can negatively affect valuation.
• Sellers should consider adding businesses to increase value.
• Earnings adjustments can significantly influence business valuation.
• Understanding market perceptions is crucial for sellers.
• Agencies offer unique opportunities for cross-selling and growth.

Chapters

00:00 Coffee Preferences and Brewing Techniques

02:54 Restaurant Business Insights and Challenges

05:42 Valuation Philosophy and Business Insights

14:44 Valuation Fundamentals: Understanding Multiples

22:12 Earnings and Adjustments: The Art of Valuation

34:20 The Size Premium: Why Bigger is Better

38:12 Customer Concentration: Risks and Strategies

41:53 Maximizing Exit Value: Key Strategies for Sellers

Pepperdine Capital Markets Report discussed on the podcast

https://digitalcommons.pepperdine.edu/gsbm_pcm_pcmr/

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with guest Matt Bodnar

https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattbodnar/

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, co-hosts Ayelet Shipley and Christian Hassold discuss the complexities of earnouts in agency acquisitions in the context of discussions covered at DealCon 2025. In this episode, Ayelet and Christian explore the reasons earnouts are used, the difficulties in negotiating them, and the importance of maintaining operational control and alignment between buyers and sellers. The conversation emphasizes the need for clear expectations and mutual understanding to navigate the intricacies of earnouts effectively.

Takeaways

• Earnouts are often used to bridge valuation gaps in acquisitions
• Buyers typically dislike the complexity of earnouts but find them necessary
• According research, significant percentage of earnouts (>55%) are never paid
• Negotiating earnouts should ideally happen early in the deal process
• Operational controls are necessary for buyers and sellers to achieve earnout targets
• Cultural alignment between buyers and sellers is essential for success
• Earnouts should generally not exceed 15-20% of the total transaction value
• Protracted earnout negotiations can lead to deal fatigue, which can pose risk to deal timeline or completion

Chapters

0:26 Introduction to Earnouts

1:05 Why Earnouts Are a Key Topic

1:34 The Purpose and Function of Earnouts

02:21 Common Uses of Earnouts in M&A

3:45 Challenges in Structuring Earnouts

5:58 Pipeline Credit and Control in Earnouts

10:24 Negotiating Earnouts & Deal Fatigue

12:05 Maintaining Seller Control for Earnout Success

15:15 Cultural Alignment in Earnout Negotiations

14:41 Structuring Earnouts Strategically

16:29 Key Takeaways on Earnouts

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This conversation explores the insights and experiences gained at DealCon, an event focused on agency founders and owners looking to grow through mergers and acquisitions (M&A). The speakers discuss the importance of understanding the intricacies of deal-making, the role of capital in acquisitions, and the dynamics of cultural integration. They also touch on the common feelings of imposter syndrome among those in the M&A space and the various paths to success in this field.

Takeaways

• DealCon is a platform for agency founders to learn about M&A.
• Many agency founders are interested in inorganic growth.
• Understanding market multiples is crucial for agency exits.
• Cultural fit is essential in M&A success.
• Pressure testing cultural alignment can prevent future conflicts.
• Access to capital is vital for agency acquisitions.
• Risk-taking is inherent in entrepreneurship and M&A.
• Imposter syndrome is common among M&A practitioners.
• There are alternative paths to success in M&A.
• The human element in M&A is often more challenging than the financial aspects.

Chapters

00:43 Opening & DealCon Overview

01:37 Why Founders Are Chasing Acquisitions

02:42 The Backstory: How DealCon Began

05:14 Access to Capital & Funding Options

07:37 Challenges of M&A

08:24 Culture Fit: The Real Test of M&A

13:47 Risk-Taking Founders vs. Cautious Teams

16:16 Non-traditional Paths & Beating Imposter Syndrome

19:57 Deal Math vs. The Human Element

20:28 Wrapping Up 

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode, co-hosts Ayelet Shipley and Christian Hassold welcome guests Erik Morton, former EVP of Corporate Development for Rithum (formerly CommerceHub & ChannelAdvisor), and Chris Barnes, former SVP of Corporate Development for Syndigo, to discuss the announced acquisition of 1WorldSync by Syndigo. In this episode, the guests discuss the origin of both Syndigo and 1WorldSync, the deal rationale, as well as some of the reasons why the acquired business had some potential barriers to finding the right acquirer over the course of its year long sale process. The discussion highlights the dynamics of M&A in the e-commerce sector, the competitive dynamics between major players like Syndigo, Bazaarvoice, and Salsify, and the prospects of inorganic growth following years of aggressive M&A activity. 

Takeaways

• Syndigo’s growth trajectory from Gladson to a materially sized platform in the commerce ecosystem
• 1WordSync’s origin and significance in the product information space
• The competitive dynamics between 1Worldsync, Syndigo, and Salsify in the commerce market
• The significance of geographical expansion in M&A strategies.
• The importance and benefits of strong alignment between sponsors and holding company executive leadership on M&A strategy

Chapters

0:12 Deal Context  

1:43 Guest Backgrounds 

5:48 Syndigo Founding and Acquisition Strategy  

9:32 Investor View on Syndigo’s M&A Thesis  

13:47 1WorldSync Origins and Strategy  

18:07 PowerReviews and Strategic Misalignment  

22:09 Syndigo Deal Execution and Private Equity Dynamics  

24:04 Running Out of Targets  

25:40 Industrial Logic Behind the Merger  

27:39 Competitive Landscape and Salsify  

30:49 Future Outlook on Marketplaces and IPO  

38:38 Wrap-Up and Final Thoughts

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with our guest Chris Barnes on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-barnes-a0a7022/

Connect with our guest Erik Morton on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/erikimorton/

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In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, hosts Christian Hassold and Ayelet Shipley, along with guest Anthony Costanzo, delve into the topic of becoming a “platform”, that is, an agency that becomes the foundational business for additional add-ons to expand service offerings or grow into new client categories. They discuss the characteristics of successful platforms, including company behaviors, leadership attributes, and the important role of investors. The conversation highlights real-world examples of successful platforms and emphasizes the need to align the vision and investment strategy between founders and investors. The episode concludes with insights into the future of platforms and the opportunities for growth through add-ons.

Takeaways

• The concept of a platform in M&A serves as a foundation for broader investment strategies.
• Many successful platforms exhibit platform behavior before becoming sponsor-backed and expanding rapidly (Croud, Brainlabs, Wpromote)
• Qualities of CEO’s that are prepared to lead a platform often have a good bench of leadership and a C-team that fills in their own capability gaps (CFO, COO, etc)
• There is no shortage of private equity investors willing to back agency platform scaleups, but you need to choose 
• The right investor can not only provide capital, they offer strategic guidance and can help with the search for add-on businesses
• Agency founders/owners should determine the kind of investor they desire (active or passive, for example) and what role they want investors to play in the business (board level only, or operating advisors).
• The future of platforms is promising, with increasing opportunities for growth and consolidation.

Chapters

1:24 Anthony’s Story & Approach to M&A

6:08 What It Means to Be a Platform

8:54 Key Criteria: EBITDA, Clients, Teams

15:46 Traits of Strong Platform Leaders

20:34 The Investor–Founder Relationship

27:17 Should You Really Be a Platform?

31:36 The Reality of Becoming a Platform

36:36 Real-World Examples of Platforms

44:23 Market Trends in Platforms & Add-Ons

47:34 Rethinking the Role of Add-Ons

49:22 Closing & Takeaways

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with our guest Anthony Costanzo

https://www.linkedin.com/in/anthony-costanzo-08062318/

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In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, co-hosts Christian Hassold and Ayelet Shipley discuss the critical aspects of preparing an agency for sale. They explore the importance of understanding sellability, the perspectives of both buyers and sellers, and the traits that make a business attractive to potential buyers. The conversation emphasizes the need for operational excellence, financial management, and emotional readiness when navigating the sale process. Key takeaways include the significance of starting preparations early, the risks associated with client concentration, and the value of having a strong team in place to support the sale.

Key Takeaways

• Start thinking about your exit strategy from day one.
• Agency owners often lack an understanding of sellability timelines.
• A sellable business has clear financials and operations.
• Client concentration can significantly impact business value.
• Diverse client portfolios are more attractive to buyers.
• Operational excellence is crucial for agency success.
• Sales teams should not rely solely on founders for client relationships.
• Emotional readiness is key when selling a business.
• Engage professionals early for financial management.
• Small steps can lead to significant improvements in sellability.

Chapters

00:00 "When Should I Start Thinking About Selling?"

02:15 Signs You Might Be Ready to Sell

06:40 What Buyers Are Actually Looking For

11:47 Traits of a Sellable Business

13:12 Revenue Risk, Red Flags & Value Drivers

22:53 Building the Team: Ops, Finance & Sales

25:55 Founder Clarity: Post-Exit Life & Financial Reality

30:57 What Due Diligence Actually Feels Like

32:41 Starting Small and Other Takeaways

36:53 Wrapping Up 

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode, co-hosts Ayelet Shipley and Christian Hassold discuss the latest trends in digital agency M&A, focusing on recently announced deals, including Accenture's acquisition of Superdigital, Podean’s acquisition of Commerce Canal with backing from Mountiangate, Impact XM’s acquisition of Shelton Flemingand, and Gravity Global's acquisition of Marketing Doctor. As a part of their discussion, they debate the rationale and industrial logic of these acquisitions, as well as what they indicate about agency M&A as a whole. The conversation highlights the evolving nature of the agency market and the impact of technology and consumer preferences on business strategies.

Takeaways

• Accenture's acquisition of Superdigital reflects a shift towards the creator economy.
• Retail media is experiencing significant growth compared to e-commerce.
• Experiential events are becoming crucial for brand engagement.
• Women-owned businesses face challenges in valuation and funding.
• The importance of technology in enhancing experiential events is growing.
• Agencies are increasingly focusing on expansion in international markets.
• The trend of consolidation in retail media agencies is on the rise.
• Live events and personal experiences are key to consumer engagement. 

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

01:33 Soho House Valuation and the Micro-Club Trend

08:10 Accenture Song Acquires Superdigital

11:59 Podean Acquires Commerce Canal

15:54 Impact XM Expands to UK with Shelton Fleming

22:49 Gravity Global Acquires Women-Owned Marketing Doctor

23:26 Gender Equity and M&A: Are Women-Owned Agencies Undervalued?

28:59 DealCon Plug and Wrapping Up

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, Christian Hassold discusses five notable acquisitions in SaaS, specifically those where larger companies acquired smaller or earlier-stage companies. As a part of this discussion, Christian highlights deal values (announced and speculated), the industrial logic of acquirers, and other key details surrounding the acquisitions.

Acquisitions Covered

Vanta + Risky on July 17, 2025

Rokt + Canal on July 17, 2025

Darktrace + Mira Security on July 21, 2025

Verisk + AccuLynx on July 30, 2025 

Descartes + Finale Inventory on August 4, 2025

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

03:17 Preview of the Five SaaS Acquisitions

04:17 Descartes Acquires Finale Inventory

08:41 Verisk Acquires AccuLynx for $2.35B

12:14 Darktrace Acquires Mira Security

15:20 Rokt Acquires Canal

19:31 Vanta Acquires Riskey (Acquihire?)

23:49 Takeaways and M&A Themes

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, hosts Ayelet Shipley and Christian Hassold, co-hosts of the In/organic Podcast, discuss the current state of mergers and acquisitions (M&A) in the agency sector, focusing on Q2 activity. They explore market trends, deal multiples, notable acquisitions, and the importance of strategic fit in the current M&A landscape. The conversation also touches on the valuation of tech-enabled agencies, the luxury market's unique characteristics, and expectations for future market activity in Q3 and Q4.

Takeaways

• Deals still happening, but the market is pickier.
• Timing exits for the next 2021-2022 won’t work
• Seller valuation expectations still mixed bag
• Digital services continue to grow in demand.
• Strategic buyers are looking for very specific needs (culture fit, capabilities, clients, and case studies)
• Q3 and Q4 should see more deal activity based on deal flow signals

Chapters

02:25 Q2 Market Trends & Valuation Multiples

06:24 What Makes a Deal Stand Out in Q2

09:16 Media, AI, and Buyer Control Strategies

11:29 Captiv8 and the SaaS-Driven Valuation Uplift

14:24 Should Agencies Rebrand Themselves as SaaS?

17:35 Luxury Roll-Ups and the Together Group Model

20:29 Market Shift: From Roll-Up Volume to Strategic Fit

24:39 Resetting Expectations Around Multiples

28:33 Q3 & Q4 Deal Flow Outlook

30:45 Previewing Themes for the Next Episode

Connect with Christian and Ayelet

Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

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This is part two of a two-part series where Christian Hassold and Ayelet Shipley demystify the complexities of agency valuations, exploring the interplay between buyer and seller motivations, and discussing real-world scenarios that illustrate various deal structures. They emphasize the importance of understanding the unique dynamics of the agency market, including the factors that influence valuations and the creative structuring of deals to meet the needs of both parties. 

Discussion Highlights

• Reviews a $3.4M revenue, $1.7M EBITDA agency valued at $10.2M (6x multiple). Creativity is needed for deals under $2M EBITDA due to higher perceived risk and sensitivity of margins.
• This deal involved a 50% cash consideration ($5.1M) and 50% rollover ($5.1M). The cash consideration was paid quarterly over three years, performance-based (not an earnout), with payments halted or reduced if revenue drops significantly (below 50% or 50-99% of the agreed-upon value).
• We also discussed a second deal involving a $40M revenue agency with $9M EBITDA commanding a 10x multiple ($90M EV) - a top of market multiple because of high gross retention (>85%) and >80% retainer-based clients. The challenge is managing the risk of large clients churning post-closing when the multiple is top of the market.
• Involved a 15% rollover. A significant earnout (up to an extra $9M) is offered to bridge the gap and incentivize the seller for growth.
• Beyond financial metrics, we discuss factors that influence valuations like the acquiring entity's need for specific capabilities, clients, talent, customer retention, and consistent growth (10-20% year-over-year).

Chapters

0:00 Introduction  

2:06 Scenario D: Structuring a Deal Below $2M EBITDA

3:10 Why Sub-$2M EBITDA Deals Are Hard

4:53 Performance-Based Cash Payouts 

6:18 Keeping Sellers Engaged Through Uncertainty

7:52 Incentivizing Sellers Through Equity and Bonuses

11:21 Scenario C: Challenges of Scaling a Large Agency

12:57 Structuring a $40M, $9M EBITDA Deal at 10x

15:28 Market View on Earnouts in EV

19:25 When Growth and Retention Justify High Multiples

20:50 Market Range for Cash-at-Close Offers

21:20 How Strategic Buyers Compete with HoldCos

22:53 Wrap-Up & Closing Thoughts

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with E27 guest, Ayelet Shipley on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

We did not get into the details in this recording, but the key takaways are:

If you are a first time seller: 1) Be Informed: Retain experienced M&A counsel - that is an attorney who specializes in M&A (which is different from a business lawyer who touches M&A, but is not a transactional lawyer by trade). Most M&A lawyers are already in your network and are willing to offer 1-2 hours of off-book time to help with key considerations before getting too far along in the process. 2) Ask the sellers questions. If you don't understand terms or if there is anything that is unclear, go ahead and ask. For example, if you are offered $10 million for your business, is that all cash, a closing, or something else? If it includes stock in the sellers company, you have a right to ask for some information from the acquiring company ("reverse diligence") in order to qualify the value of the stock in the company relative to the value you are exchanging.

If you are an unsophisticated buyer: 1) Get Ahead of Legal: Don't let the lawyers be the first ones to bring forward terms that will economically impact the deal without having spoken about it first. Example things are escrow, reps & warranties insurance, special indemnities, discounts to EBITDA derived from quality of earnings analysis. When you are 5 steps ahead of key negotiating items in legal, it builds trust and keeps legal costs under control. 2) Agree on the earnout structure and compensation before going to LOI or drafting definitive agreements. This is basic, but the intent is that the seller is a part of the creation of the construct versus a recipient. Even if there is not a lot of room for flexibility, its much better to preview and ask for input than throw over the fence and have lawyers negotiate the terms.

Enjoy!

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In this episode, Christian Hassold and Ayelet Shipley delve into the complexities of agency valuations, exploring the interplay between buyer and seller motivations, and discussing real-world scenarios that illustrate various deal structures. They emphasize the importance of understanding the unique dynamics of the agency market, including the factors that influence valuations and the creative structuring of deals to meet the needs of both parties. In this conversation, Ayelet and Christian delve into the intricacies of business valuation, particularly focusing on earn-outs and creative deal structures. They explore how earn-outs can bridge the gap between current cash and total enterprise value, especially in lower EBITDA scenarios. The discussion also highlights the dynamics of larger deals, emphasizing the importance of timing and the need for sellers to recognize good opportunities in a fluctuating market. The conversation is rich with insights on how to structure deals that meet both buyer and seller needs while navigating the complexities of agency acquisitions.

Takeaways

• A deal occurs in the overlap of buyer and seller needs.

• Creative structuring can lead to better outcomes for sellers.

• The agency market is dynamic with many new entrants and exits.

• People, client relationships, and capabilities are key assets in agency valuations.

• Valuations can vary significantly based on market fit and potential.

• Understanding the motivations of both buyers and sellers is crucial.

• The agency landscape is evolving with increasing deal velocity. Earn-outs can be a strategic tool in business valuation.

• Trust between buyer and seller facilitates smoother transactions.

Chapters

0:48 Introduction

1:59 Why Agencies Are Built and Sold

8:03 How Buyers Assess Value

12:10 Cash Upfront vs. Long-Term Upside

14:28 Real-World Deal Scenarios

15:02 Scenario B: Traditional 80/20 Deal

19:33 Earnout Treatment in Valuation

21:21 Scenario D: Creative Deal for Smaller Agencies

26:27 Performance-Based Payment Adjustment

29:23 Why Larger Deals Are Different

32:41 Wrap-Up

Connect with Christian & Inorganic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with E26 guest, Ayelet Shipley on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

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In this episode, host Christian Hassold chats with Ayelet Shipley, the head of corporate development and deal management for Speed M&A by Jones-Spross. Ayelet shares her unique journey from aspiring therapist to corporate development leader, emphasizing the importance of sales skills and psychological insights in the M&A process. The conversation delves into sourcing opportunities, qualifying conversations, and understanding client expectations, drawing the connections between the similarities of enterprise sales and M&A deal origination.

In this conversation, Ayelet and Christian delve into the intricacies of the acquisition process, focusing on understanding seller motivations, evaluating business fit, and navigating decision-making dynamics. They discuss the importance of asking specific and open-ended questions to understand the intent and motivations of potential sellers and how to identify points of alignment or misalignment. They also discuss the importance of rapport building and the sell-side bankers' valuable role in the process.

Takeaways

• Ayelet transitioned from a potential career in therapy to corporate development after realizing her skills could be applied in business.
• Understanding acquisition candidate pain points is crucial in the discovery process
• The process of sourcing opportunities requires a strategic approach to identify potential targets. Understanding seller motivations is crucial for alignment.
• Setting clear expectations about deal structures is important
• Qualifying questions help determine if a deal is worth pursuing further
• Ayelet emphasizes the importance of her background in psychology and sales as foundational for making her successful in this work.
• Ayelet emphasizes the importance of psychological insights in sales conversations.
• Transparency throughout the process fosters better outcomes.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

00:55 Ayelet's Background in Psychology and Sales

07:15 Goals of Call 1

11:26 Deciding to Advance Past Call One

13:54 Setting Valuation Expectations 

15:30 Goals of Call 2

18:48 Matching Verbal Claims to Financials

21:55 Advancing Further and Disqualifiers

24:48 Scoring to Qualify Deals

25:05 Keeping Evaluation Criteria Simple

28:48 Identifying Decision-Makers 

31:10 Distinguishing Uncommitted Sellers

33:36 Working with Sellside Bankers

39:33 Conclusion

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with E24 guest, Ayelet Shipley on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/

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In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, host Christian Hassold discusses the recent acquisition of ContentServ by Centric Software with their co-founder and former board member Armin Dressler. Their discussion spans the history of Contentserve, its journey from an on prem to SaaS solution, transition of leadership to the current CEO, Michael Kugler, and the details of the M&A process. This episode discusses the acquirer, their rationale and some of the inside baseball on the deal valuation. 

Chapters

0:00 Introduction

2:54 How Contentserv Built Its Market Position

10:01 Key Learnings from how ContentServ evolved

14:02 Insights on Leadership Changes

19:49 Why It Was the Right Time to Sell

23:37 The Sale Process and Participants

26:23 Why Centric Software Made the Acquisition

36:02 Implications for the PIM and Commerce Ecosystem

40:46 Conclusion

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with E24 guest, Armin Dressler on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/armindressler/?originalSubdomain=ch

References

https://www.3ds.com/newsroom/press-releases/dassault-systemes-announces-centric-softwares-acquisition-ai-powered-pxm-solution-contentserv

https://www.investcorp.com/investcorp-agrees-to-sell-software-vendor-contentserv/

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In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, hosts Christian Hassold and guest Erik Morton delve into the planned acquisition of Brightcove by Bending Spoons. They explore the dynamics of the deal, the market context, and the implications for both companies. Brightcove, a pioneer in online video hosting, faced challenges in a competitive landscape that evolved substantially due to digital video creation and storage innovation, notably the free models offered by YouTube and Vimeo. Christian and Erik discuss Bending Spoons' pattern of being an acquirer of distressed businesses and how they typically run the businesses post-acquisition to maximize return on investment. This episode is an interesting look at how tech “Zombies” find a home through strategic acquisition when operating standalone is not a credible option.

Takeaways

• The acquisition of Brightcove by Bending Spoons is part of a broader roll-up strategy that has been executed multiple times prior.
• Bending Spoons has been particularly interested in notable companies that became distressed due to commoditization or lack of differentiation, yet still had loyal enterprise or SMB customer bases.
• The acquisition price reflects Brightcove's current market challenges and growth.
• Public companies face immense pressure to grow, leading to take-private transactions when they cannot without making drastic changes that public markets don’t appreciate.
• The concept of 'zombie' companies is relevant in today's market, highlighting the impact of stagnation on management and employees.
• We will see more transactions like these as Zombie companies both public and private face growth challenges.

Chapter Markers

0:00 Introduction

2:52 Background on Brightcove

5:15 Background on Bending Spoons

07:18 Insights on the Deal Valuation

11:37 Brightcove's Engineering Costs & Financial Health

14:48 Anticipating Radical Changes Post-Acquisition

21:46 Investor Returns and Employee Compensation

28:25 Takeaways 

32:12 Conclusion

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with E20 guest, Erik Morton on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/erikimorton/

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In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, host Christian Hassold delves into a case study on the startup Crisp (gocrisp.com), which has successfully executed four acquisitions over the last 2 years. The discussion covers the company's background, the leadership dynamics, and the strategic rationale behind its inorganic investments. The episode serves as a case study to demonstrate what good M&A looks like in an early to mid stage SaaS company and what features of M&A targets companies should be thinking about at that stage. As a part of the discussion, Christian dives into some of the deal specifics and the economic benefits to Crisp based on opinion and publicly accessible information.

Takeaways

- M&A could be as effective as traditional sales, marketing, and product investments.

- What problem is Crisp solving and why is it important

- Background on Crisps substantial financing and debt rounds

- What kinds of M&A has Crisp executed and why

- How the deals Crisp has executed have likely helped fuel their growth

- What can other startups learn from Crisp's approach to M&A

- Order of the kinds of deals a company might do is a consideration in building the M&A muscle in an early to mid-stage SaaS company

- The startup ecosystem often underestimates the value of M&A

Chapter Markers

0:00 Introduction

03:19 The Case for M&A in Early Stage Startups

05:14 Crisp's Company Profile

08:28 Pre-conditions for M&A in Early Stage Startups

13:37 Breakdown of Crisp's Four Acquisitions

20:37 Crisp's Acquisition Strategy

22:01 Financial Case for Crisp’s M&A

24:28 Analyzing the Order of Crisp's Deals

26:37 Reflecting on Crisp's Strategy

28:10 Conclusion

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Episode References:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/aretraasdahl/

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/crisp-raises-50m-series-b-140500449.html?utm_source=chatgpt.com

https://www.sec.gov/edgar/search/#/ciks=0001818100&entityName=Crisp%252C%2520Inc.%2520(CIK%25200001818100)

chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://ir.youradv.com/static-files/d47814ee-084c-4c53-9b0f-9a9753f9e9cf

Episode Outline

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In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, host Christian Hassled discusses the acquisition of Command AI by Amplitude Software. The conversation delves into the deal's details, including the financial aspects, the rationale behind the acquisition, and the implications for both companies. Christian highlights the challenges faced by early-stage startups in the current economic climate and the strategic decisions that founders must make to exit now or continue burning cash not knowing if the fundraising market will the there for them when they need it. The episode concludes with key learnings from the transaction, emphasizing the importance of founders making the tough decision to sell even when they have a credible product and plenty of runway to keep going.

Takeaways

• Amplitude acquired Command AI for $45M, $20M net of cash
• Amplitude is a public company with a market cap of $1 billion, this is their 5th acquisition in 5 years
• Command AI was an early-stage startup backed by Insight Ventures, among others. The company reports it was flush with cash and agreed to be sold
• The deal reflects a smart strategic move in a tough market for SaaS companies.
• Command AI's technology aligns well with Amplitude's product offerings.
• This deal is interesting because it helps understand how public companies value venture-backed startups in the current economy.
• This deal also examples AI tech consolidation and the relative values for such companies.

Chapter Markers

00:00 Introduction

01:7 Background on Command AI

02:49 Introduction to Amplitude Software

04:51 Deal Details and Controversy Around Price

06:00 Analyzing the Deal Structure and Rationale

09:35 Learnings from the Deal

11:37 Conclusion

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Episode References

https://www.linkedin.com/in/spenserskates/

https://amplitude.com/blog/amplitude-acquires-command-ai

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41849907

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In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, Christian and Erik delve into the complexities of take private transactions, using Smartsheet's recent acquisition as a case study. They discuss the economic challenges facing public companies, the lifecycle of a business transitioning from public to private, and the strategic considerations for boards contemplating such moves. The conversation highlights the importance of fairness opinions and the intricate dynamics of investor strategies in these transactions. In this conversation, Erik and Christian delve into the complexities of take-private transactions, focusing on the negotiation dynamics, the role of advisors, regulatory considerations, the impact on employees, and the financial structuring that influences investor returns. They use the Smartsheet deal as a case study to illustrate these concepts, providing insights into the motivations behind such transactions and the implications for all parties involved.

Takeaways

• Public companies face unique challenges that may lead them to consider going private.
• The lifecycle of a business includes transitioning from public to private ownership.
• Smartsheet's acquisition is a significant case study in the current market.
• Initiating acquisition conversations requires careful preparation and strategy. The Smartsheet deal features a go-shop provision allowing for additional bids.
• Advisors play a crucial role in take-private transactions, including bankers and consultants.
• Regulatory dynamics can complicate interactions between buyers and sellers.
• Employees in public companies face different equity compensation structures when taken private.
• Investor returns are influenced by the capital structure and debt servicing costs.
• The liquidity of equity compensation differs significantly between public and private companies.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

04:04 Understanding Take Private Transactions

08:28 Analyzing the Smartsheet Case Study

15:53 Transaction Dynamics and Investor Strategies

20:44 How Fairness Opinion Works

23:28 Initiating Acquisition Conversations

29:18 Advisors in Take-Private Transactions

31:48 Do's and Dont's for Potential Acquirers

37:33 Impact of Take-Private Transactions on Employees

45:41 Erik Morton's Hypothetical Simple Exit Waterfall

51:38 Conclusion

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with E20 guest, Erik Morton on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/erikimorton/

Episode References

https://investors.smartsheet.com/news/news-details/2024/Smartsheet-to-be-Acquired-by-Blackstone-and-Vista-Equity-Partners-for-8.4-Billion/default.aspx

https://www.wsj.com/articles/smartsheet-to-be-taken-private-by-pe-firms-in-8-4-billion-deal-7296758c

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In this episode of the In/organic Podcast, host Christian Hassold and guest Keith Anderson delve into the evolving landscape of data measurement, focusing on WPP's potential divestment of Kantar. They discuss the implications of this move, the importance of independent measurement in advertising, and the future of Kantar in the market. The conversation also touches on the challenges agencies face in adapting to a rapidly changing media environment and the need for collaboration and innovation within the industry.

Takeaways

• WPP is exploring the sale of its stake in Kantar to streamlines its business and bring more cash onto their balance sheet
• Kantar is known for its consumer panel businesses and global footprint, WPP currently owns 40%, Bain Capital owns 60%.
• Independent measurement is crucial for advertisers but the capabilities on a standalone basis are becoming commodified
• The agency business is facing significant challenges, global agencies must elevate their offerings to remain competitive in a world where clients are seeking to consolidate spend with a single global partner

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

05:23 Understanding WPP and Kantar's Relationship

09:22 WPP's Strategic Reasons for Acquiring Kantar

12:46 Independent Measurement in Performance Marketing

16:47 Bain's Potential Divestment of Kantar

20:45 Analyzing WPP's Tech Strategy & CTO vs CPO

23:54 Kantar's Potential Acquirers

28:12 Agency Evolution and Collaboration in a Changing Market

35:04 Conclusion

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with E19 guest, Keith Anderson on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/keithanderson101/

Episode References

WPP FGS Divestment Announcement: https://www.wpp.com/en/news/2024/08/wpp-to-sell-its-majority-stake-in-fgs-global

Reuters divestment press: https://www.reuters.com/business/wpp-is-considering-sale-stake-bains-kantar-source-2024-01-10/

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In this episode of the In/Organic Podcast, host Christian Hassold explains the “why” behind MasterCard's $2.6 billion acquisition of Recorded Future. Christian’s breakdown of the acquisition story explains Recorded Future’s role in cybersecurity, national security, and how the CIA venture arm, In-Q-Tel landed on their cap table. The discussion includes context on the origins of Recorded Future, its unusually limited capital requirements, and how Recorded Future has likely out performed many other companies that achieved near billion-dollar valuations over the past five years.

Takeaways

• MasterCard acquired Recorded Future for $2.65 billion.
• Recorded Future is a significant player in cybersecurity.
• The CIA's investment highlights the strategic importance of Recorded Future.
• Cybercrime poses a $9 trillion threat globally.
• Recorded Future provides intelligence for both businesses and governments.
• Recorded Future's growth rate was impressive at 25% CAGR.
• The deal represents a 7.8x revenue multiple, indicating strong market confidence.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

02:43 Overview of Mastercard's Acquisition of Recorded Future

03:20 Analyzing Mastercard's Acquisition Strategy

03:56 Use Case: Credit Card & Fraud Transactions

07:31 Use Case: Protecting & Defending Assets

10:02 What Is Recorded Future?

12:33 In-Q-Tel and CIA's Involvement

18:22 What’s Next for Recorded Future?

18:58 Conclusion

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Episode References

https://www.mastercard.com/news/press/2024/september/mastercard-invests-in-continued-defense-of-global-digital-economy-with-acquisition-of-recorded-future/

https://b2b.mastercard.com/news-and-insights/blog/ecommerce-fraud-trends-and-statistics-merchants-need-to-know-in-2024/

https://www.theinformation.com/briefings/insight-sells-cyber-firm-to-mastercard-for-2-65-billion

https://www.statista.com/forecasts/1280009/cost-cybercrime-worldwide

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In this episode of the In/Organic Podcast, host Christian Hassold provides a teardown on the massive $206 million acquisition of Bentonville-based SupplyPike by SPS Commerce (NASDAQ: SPSC). In this episode, Christian provides a deep dive into the deal's details, its structure, and an informed hypothesis on the deal multiple. Christian also explores the backgrounds and business models of both SPS Commerce and Supply Pike, highlighting their roles in facilitating commerce between brands and retailers. Further, he analyzes the strategic rationale behind the acquisition and the implications for investors, founders, and employees. The episode concludes with key takeaways, including the importance of focused leadership and the benefits of inorganic growth for public companies.

Takeaways

• The acquisition of SupplyPike by SPS Commerce for $206 million is a notable deal based on the estimated multiple of >10x ARR. 
• It was also SPS Commerce's largest acquisition by deal size and multiple in its history of acquisitions.
• SupplyPike was a Bentonville, Arkansas-based SaaS company that helped brands recover inaccurate chargebacks and other deductions from retailers like Amazon, Walmart, and Target
• SPS Commerce is a commerce transaction infrastructure company that helps suppliers (brands) retailers and distributors better transact commerce
• The acquisition of SupplyPike by SPS Commerce was logical because of the high fitment of the two companies' business model
• The acquisition expands SPS Commerce's total market opportunity by at least $750M and demonstrates the benefits of inorganic growth for public companies.

Chapters

00:00 Welcome from Nantucket Island

01:02 Summary of the deal, players and deal structure

03:39 What is a competitive banker-run process

04:50 What is SPS Commerce business

06:38 SPS Commerce M&A history and this deals significance

04:54 What is SPS Commerce business

09:18 What is SupplyPike business and background

13:52 Analysis of the deal impact for Investors, the founder and employees

18:11 Learnings from the deal overall

20:45 Wrap up 

Episode References

SPS Commerce Press Release

SPS Commerce Investor Conference Call

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

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In this episode, Christian Hassold, host of In/Organic Podcast provides a mid-year market update for the M&A market in the SaaS industry. He discusses the macro conditions and factors influencing M&A activity, such as interest rates and FTC oversight. He also reviews his prediction on the increase in startups buying startups and analyzes four specific deals completed in the past six months. Overall, M&A activity is slightly up, but valuations are down, and deals are stalled due to disagreements on purchase prices. However, deals are getting done, likely at lower valuations

Takeaways

• M&A activity in the SaaS industry is slightly up, but valuations are down.

• Misalignment on purchase prices are causing deals to get stalled.

• Some deals are still getting done, both by PE's and corporate-sponsors, but at lower valuations

• SaaS Startups are not being acquired at the levels predicted, we examined 4 deals that have gotten done in Q3 to get a sense of the market

Chapters

00:00: Welcome

00:33: Taylor Swifts EU Invasion

02:53: Macro Conditions and Factors Influencing SaaS M&A

07:07: PE-backed and Corporate-backed Deals

10:01: Stalled Deals in SaaS and Market Dynamics 

14:05: Revisiting 2024 Startup M&A Predictions

17:53: Review of 4 Recently Announced Deals

Episode References

All In Podcast EP188

Pitchbook: The State of Enterprise SaaS M&A (Q324)

Carta: Q1 and Historical Startup Shutdowns

Carta: Startup Acquisition Metrics

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

There are plenty of problems to solve in the ecommerce space. As the market gets larger it also gets more complex with new problems to solve arriving almost daily. Throughout my career in ecommerce, I have come across a “mafia” of founders - that is people who see and experience the problems firsthand, build a software solution to solve it, get the business to the right scale for an exit; rinse, and repeat. We are oversimplifying some of the complexities, but it can never be understated how much focus and commitment is required to build and exit a software business in any market AND do it more than once.

In this episode of In/organic, I was joined by Chad Rubin, founder of commerce ecosystem notables including Prospershow, Skubana, Sellers Choice, and more recently Profasee. Every business Chad has built was started to solve a problem he experienced as an online retailer and whereby he brought the solution to market to help thousands of online sellers thrive. In this episode, I explore with Chad the formula for success as a repeat founder and his experiences and learnings along the way of building and exiting thoughtfully.

Takeaways

• Chad's approach to building businesses involves identifying real pains in commerce, experiencing those pains directly, and building companies around them.
• The decision to sell a business involves considering market trends, acquisition behavior, and economic impact, as well as ensuring a successful outcome for stakeholders and employees.
• The sale process requires careful consideration of the vision and execution of the acquiring party, as well as the deal structure and post-sale arrangements.
• Chad's journey highlights the importance of perseverance, non-consensus thinking, and proving oneself right in the face of skepticism from investors and VCs. Life after a successful exit may not bring the expected life-changing outcomes.
• Balancing work and personal life is essential for long-term success and fulfillment.
• Market opportunities in e-commerce are evolving, with a focus on multichannel and niche markets.
• The entrepreneurship journey involves continuous learning and adaptation, focusing on personal growth and well-being.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

02:59 Chad Rubin's background

04:16 Building a business

06:53 Strategic thinking about outcomes

09:00 Learnings from selling a business

12:43 The decision to sell

17:42 Running the sale process

22:56 Insights for founders selling a business

25:42 Experiences as a serial founder and exiter

30:41 Optimizing for platforms of varying maturity levels

34:39 Maximizing the outcome

35:47 The pattern of building and selling

38:47 Advice for aspiring serial founders

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with Chad Rubin on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/itschadrubin/

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Key Takeaways

- Ecosystem mapping is an approach that considers the entire ecosystem surrounding a company, not just its competitors.

- The shift from market mapping to ecosystem mapping is essential for identifying inorganic growth opportunities and understanding the broader value creation within an ecosystem.

- Building a comprehensive ecosystem map involves gathering information from various sources, categorizing companies, and determining whether the companies are direct competition, indirect competition, or a partner.

- A sub-component of ecosystem mapping is identifying potential M&A targets and rank-stacking them in terms of revenue and potential fitment with an acquirer. Rank stacking drives clarity in terms of which M&A targets a company should prioritize from a list of targets.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

02:30 Problem statement and preconditions

05:45 The ecosystem map

08:26 Building an ecosystem map

06:01 Sources of information

14:29 Categorizing companies and estimating revenues

16:40 Examples of ecosystem maps

22:19 Rank stacking process

24:46 Criteria for rank stacking M&A targets

33:39 Complimentary episode on M&A Science

34:41 Summary

36:31 Takeaways

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode, Christian Hassold, host of the In/Organic Podcast provides a detailed understanding of the M&A opportunity for SaaS companies, the common obstacles for setting up the function, what to expect from a corporate development leader, and the role a leadership team can play in M&A success. This episode is a must-listen for founders, CEO's, and CFO's who are considering establishing a corporate development function in a scaling SaaS company.

Download the content from the episode

Episode Highlights

0:00 Intro

1:58 Reasons for Inorganic Scaling in SaaS

5:12 M&A: Large Corporations vs. Scaling SaaS

7:42 Why M&A in Scaling SaaS is Harder to Build

9:31 Common M&A Obstacles in Growth-Stage SaaS

14:46 Role of SaaS Corp Dev Leaders

19:35 Example RACI for Scaling SaaS Corp Dev

24:43 Common M&A Hiring Mistakes

27:04 Takeaways

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/hassold

Visit In/Inorganic: https://inorganicpodcast.co

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In this episode, Kim and I took a break from the rich sessions we enjoyed at the Executive Forum to share our key learnings and insights from a series of panel sessions that included dealmakers and leaders from Deloitte's M&A practice, Bank of America, DLA Piper,  and Generac Power Systems. Our discussion covers the key takeaways from the forum on the future of deal-making in 2024, the macro and micro-economic factors that will influence deal-making in the SaaS ecosystem.

Big thank you to Dan Helfrich, Chair and CEO of Deloitte Consulting for inviting us to the Deloitte Campus and for a great discussion on M&A!

Episode Highlights

00:00 Introduction 

00:29 Setting Up

01:59 Deloitte's CEO: Market Optimism for 2024 

03:14 Deloitte's Chief Economist: Economic Outlook 

04:28 Potential Instability of Relations with China

05:51 Cross-Border Investment Patterns

8:10 Macroeconomics' Impact on SaaS Valuations

10:15 Generative AI in M&A 

11:19 Utilizing Copilot

13:04 Mining Customer Data 

15:11 Session on Gen AI: Takeaway

15:48 Closing 

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on the web: 

https://www.inorganicpodcast.co/

Connect with Kimberly Baird on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/kimberlybaird1/

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In this episode of In/organic, I sat down with Jon Gregg, former President & CEO of Sellpoints which sold to Syndigo, a PE-backed SaaS company, in 2019. In this episode, Jon shares his experience of running a do-it-yourself sale process for his company. He discusses the decision-making process, the goals of the process, and the importance of building a strong team. Jon also explains the different phases of the process and the criteria for finding the right acquirer. He highlights the significance of trust and cultural alignment in the deal and reflects on the signing and closing day. Finally, he shares some lessons learned and offers advice for others considering a DIY sale process.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Background

03:57 Making the Decision to Sell

09:20 Goals of the Process

11:21 Reading In Customers

12:40 Building the Team

15:16 Reading In Non-Executives

20:05 Phases of the Sale Process

26:28 Criteria for Identifying Acquirers

30:09 Example Terms for Post-Deal Performance

35:06 Signing and Closing Experience

37:25 Lessons Learned

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with Jon Gregg on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/jongregg/

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Successful integrations are required to achieve the full value of any acquisition. Most know that the odds are stacked against the acquirer from the start - so how does one move the odds in their favor? How should a SaaS leadership team plan and execute an integration process with an acquired team of less than 100 people and the acquirer is less than 1,000 (roughly)? This is a large company buying a much smaller company and the assumption is the buyer is a first-time acquier. Deal economics certainly impact acquired founder and employee sentiment, but how the actual people integration is run has an outsized impact on realizing the full value of M&A.

In this episode of In/organic, we welcome Mohammed M. Baloch, Head of Integrations at Gainsight, a SaaS company backed by Vista Private Equity. During the discussion, Mohammed describes the key elements of a successful integration plan. He also lays out the key players, roles, and profiles of talent who can support an integration, even if they have never done the work before. We also discuss the role of an integration consultant (which is a must) and how to contemplate their role in the integration process.

Takeaways

• People integration is a critical aspect of post-merger integration and should be given equal importance as the economic goals of the acquisition.
• When selecting an integration lead, look for someone who is well-networked, has a strategic mindset, and possesses strong project management skills.
• Consider outsourcing integration if you don't have a dedicated integration team, and look for a partner who is flexible, experienced, and familiar with your industry.
• Start integration planning as soon as the LOI is signed, and define a clear North Star that outlines the goals and criteria for success in the acquisition.
• Clear communication and a formal onboarding process are vital for successful people integration.
• Consider having acquired employees interview for their jobs to ensure cultural fit and mutual alignment.

Highlights

00:00 Introduction

02:22 Mohammed Baloch's Background and Gainsight

04:01 Setting the Stage

06:08 Key Players in the Integration Process

9:56 Selecting an Integration Lead

11:40 Considerations for Outsourcing Integration

16:15 Defining the North Star

18:40 Enabling Sales Teams for Cross-Selling

19:49 Debate on Tiger Team vs. Full-Team Format

25:36 Ensuring Success in People Integration 

29:52 Interviewing Acquired Employees for Their Jobs

31:22 Advice: Don't Wait, Start Integration Planning

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with Mohammad Baloch on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/mmbaloch/

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On this episode of In/Organic, we are joined by Chris Barnes, former SVP of Corporate Development at Syndigo, a SaaS and services business backed by Summit Partners and The Jordan Company. Syndigo was scaled to hundreds of millions in revenue through a sophisticated roll-up strategy. Under Chris's leadership, the company acquired twelve companies over 5 years. In this episode, we will discuss how Chris and the team at Syndigo ran their process with a lean team.

Takeaways

- Multiple acquisitions can be a strategic approach for SaaS CEOs to solve specific problems or drive platform expansion.

- Identifying and prioritizing acquisition targets requires thorough research and consideration of factors such as market size, growth potential, and cultural fit.

- Successful integration of acquired companies requires a focus on culture, process alignment, and a great customer experience.

- Investor partners can provide valuable resources and expertise in valuation, pricing strategy, and customer / market feedback.

Highlights

00:00 Introduction

01:23 Chris Barnes’ Background

04:53 Syndigo's Acquisition Model

07:21 Key Players on the M&A Team

09:08 Identifying Acquisition Targets

10:55 Prioritizing Acquisitions

12:18 Qualifying Potential Targets

14:03 Managing Multiple Acquisition Outreaches

17:43 Running Plays to Assess Targets

19:24 The Role of the Acquisition Team

22:38 Evaluating Business Growth Potential

25:17 Valuing an Acquisition

27:10 Involvement of Investor Partners

33:02 Lessons Learned

33:45 Limitations and Risks of Multiple Acquisitions

34:52 Key Takeaways

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with Chris Barnes on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-barnes-a0a7022/

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Discussion Topics

• Building an M&A function in a company requires a team that includes an M&A lead and a project manager.
• When selecting an M&A lead, look for someone with intellectual curiosity, an open mind, and the ability to communicate effectively with the rest of the C-suite.
• When deciding whether to build, buy, or partner, consider the market landscape, the cost and complexity of building internally, and the potential value of partnerships or acquisitions.
• Utilize the resources of financial sponsors, such as their financial modeling expertise and access to expert networks.
• Avoid insular thinking by engaging with customers, attending industry events, and seeking input from external sources.
• Use tools like Gong and Chorus to gather data and insights from customer calls and internal meetings.
• Be aware of potential pitfalls, such as lack of pre-planning for M&A integration, not conducting red team/green team exercises, and not celebrating the work done even if a deal falls through.

Highlights

[00:00] Introduction

[02:12] How Loran Started His Career in M&A

[06:40] Building the Inorganic Strategy Team

[08:44] Traits of an M&A Lead

[12:11] Deciding to Build, Buy, or Partner

[17:10] Using Expert Networks and Tools

[18:18] Testing Buy and Partner Scenarios

[20:51] Avoiding Insular Thinking

[23:41] Utilizing Gong and Chorus

[26:06] Using Financial Sponsors' Resources

[32:07] Pitfalls to Avoid

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Connect with Loran Gutt on LinkedIn

https://www.linkedin.com/in/loran-gutt/

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Discussion Topics

• M&A activity among SaaS companies is predicted to increase in 2024.
• Startup acquisitions have been observed to increase since 2019, but there was a slight decrease in 2023 and why 2024 could be different.
• How startup shutdown activity and cash runway inform the prediction of heightened M&A activity.
• It can take founders & CEO’s several months to reach the conclusion to shut down a SaaS business, the faster one reaches that conclusion, the better when it comes to exploring acquisition options.
• A broader view on M&A activity in the market based on data recently shared by Pitchbook. Hint B2B M&A is stable!
• How SaaS companies that may be considering M&A should contemplate and prepare for possible M&A.

Highlights

[00:00] Introduction to M&A activity prediction in 2024

[03:09] Startup M&A activity since 2019

[04:59] Significant increase in startup shutdowns and timing

[06:27] 57% of Startups will run out of cash in less than 18 months

[09:29] Cash is defensibility: don’t wait until the last minute to decide to sell or shutdown

[11:57] M&A activity more broadly with insights from Pitchbook

[15:21] Advice for startup founders and CEOs considering M&A in 2024

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Data Referenced in this Episode

Clouded Judgement: https://cloudedjudgement.substack.com/p/clouded-judgement-12123-net-new-arr

Pitchbook: https://files.pitchbook.com/website/files/pdf/Q4_2023_PitchBook_Analyst_Note_Increased_Antitrust_Scrutiny_and_Complexity_for_MA.pdf

Carta/Peter Walker: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/peterjameswalker_cartadata-startups-founders-activity-7112949181815656448-06cy/ (Carta)

SaaStr: https://www.saastr.com/pilot-57-of-venture-startups-will-need-to-raise-more-in-2024/

Carta: https://carta.com/blog/mergers-acquisitions-outlook-2024/ 

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In this episode, Christian Hassold, host of the In/organic Podcast sat down with Lesley Adamo, Partner & Vice Chair, Tax and Meredith Beuchaw, Partner, Emerging Companies at Lowenstein Sandler, a full-service law firm with a large emerging companies venture capital practice that has extensive experience with fundraising and M&A in early stage companies. In this episode, Lesley and Meredith provide rich insights into what kinds of structures and strategies are getting deals done and how to avoid killing these kinds of deals.

Key Takeaways:

• Stock-based deals are increasingly popular in the current market as a way to acquire startups.
• The mix of cash and stock in deals varies but is heavily weighted on common stock versus preferred, with buyers preferring to use cash only when necessary to get a deal done.
• Valuation differences between buyers and sellers can be resolved by agreeing on a mutually acceptable value or using a multiple that applies to both parties.
• Proper deal structuring and tax advice are crucial to avoid tax issues and ensure a successful transaction.
• Complexity and broken term sheets can be deal killers, and deals are taking longer to negotiate and close in the current market.

Highlights

[00:00] Introduction and Background

[04:09] Different structuring options for M&A (asset vs. stock deals)

[08:47] How little cash can an acquirer get away with (reasons why you need cash at close)

[13:51] Relevance of valuation of stock deals and the significance of 409A’s

[18.48] When in the process of getting tax advice and why

[23:34] Impact of stock consideration and form types for employees

[31:30] How to solve valuation differences in stock-based deals (esp in the current environment where most companies are below pre-money from 2-3 years ago.

[35:21] Common Deal Killers

[36:21] Success Rate of Deals

[37:56] Wrap Up

Connect with Lesley and Meredith on LinkedIn:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lesley-adamo-44481436/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/meredith-beuchaw-31305b37/

Learn more about Lowenstein Sandler practice: https://www.lowenstein.com

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/

In/organic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/inorganic-podcast

In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured

Articles References in this show:

https://news.crunchbase.com/startups/venture-backed-mergers-acquisitions-exits/

https://www.vccafe.com/2023/09/28/startup-death-rates-spike-as-we-approach-q4-2023/

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In this first edition of Ask the Expert, Alyshah Walji was kind enough to come on the pod and take on some burning questions on his mind as an up-and-coming business development leader. His questions span both how to think about the role as well as how to approach partnerships tactically, including how to begin building the M&A funnel early on. Alyshah is the Director of Partnerships at Vividly, a very active member of the Canadian startup community, and a passionate supporter of social causes related to youth, education, and gender. 

Tune in to Episode 5 of In/organic Podcast, and discover new ways of cultivating partnerships to align short-term objectives with long-term vision. 

In This Episode, You Will Learn:

[2:14] Background on Alyshah and his company Vividly

[7:00] How to think about the business development role & function

[9:11] Should you build or buy - assessing what to do and not do to

[16:10] The importance of aligning the leadership team with the company's strategy

[19:50] Prioritization and timing. How to balance short-term revenue goals with long-term strategic partnerships

[22:30] Prioritization of partnerships in a noisy ecosystem

[27:00] Developing partner & M&A pipeline is similar to running an enterprise sales process, here is how

[32:56] Where to go to get M&A advice and resources

Connect with Alyshah:

• LinkedIn
• Twitter

Connect with Christian & In/organic Podcast

• Christian's LinkedIn
• In/organic on LinkedIn
• In/organic on YouTube

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In this episode, Rob Gonzalez, co-founder and CMO of Salsify, a category-defining SaaS company that helps brands win the e-commerce game joins us to share how Salsify approaches their M&A. Drawing on experiences from four acquisitions, including one cross-border acquisition of Paris-based Alkemics, one can gain some great insight into what M&A should and should not be about, according to Rob.

In this episode, Rob joins us to share his opinion on what kind of M&A makes sense for a company that seeks to provide a single consistent experience for its customers. During the discussion, Rob provided examples of how each of Salsify’s four acquisitions added value to the company, customers, and partners. 

Throughout this episode, you'll learn about Rob's thoughts on using acquisitions to integrate third-party tools into a platform's core experience and using strategic partnerships with complementary services to create a competitive advantage. Rob also shares his own opinion on how to approach integrating talent from acquired companies and cultural integrations in cross-border transactions, and much more. 

Tune in to Episode 4 of In/organic Podcast, and discover the best way of aligning your growth and M&A strategies with your product, culture, and talent. 

In This Episode, You Will Learn:

• Rob's background and past experiences (1:20)
• Pairing M&A and growth strategy (5:30)
• How to prioritize the core business in M&A (8:10)
• Betting on the ecosystem vs. owning every piece of the puzzle (12:00)
• The role of talent in M&A (17:30)
• How to approach cross-border deals (21:20)

Connect with Rob:

• LinkedIn
• Twitter

Let's connect: 

• LinkedIn
• Website

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In today's episode, Marcel Hollerbach visits us to talk about how it is to land in the U.S. market from the other side of the pond. Marcel is the Chief Innovation Officer and supervisory board member at Productsup, a founding partner of venture capital fund Cavalry Ventures, the founder of the video streaming platform hiClip, and the Host of the "World of Commerce Podcast."

Throughout this episode, you'll hear about Marcel's experience expanding Productsup to the U.S. market, the lessons learned along the way, and the specifics of how they decided it was the right time to expand internationally, and when they felt they evolved from "figuring things out" to a mature market player in the U.S. market. 

Additionally, Marcel talks about his approach to Senior Leadership hiring, why some European companies fail when expanding to the U.S. market, and more. 

Tune in to Episode 3 of In/organic Podcast and learn how to expand a tech company across timezones. 

In This Episode, You Will Learn:

• About Marcel's background and his broad of the Venture ecosystem (1:30)
• When is the right time to expand internationally? (3:10)
• How to make the right hires for an international expansion (7:50)
• Marcel shares his thoughts on hiring Senior Leadership (14:00)
• Why some European companies fail in the U.S. market (17:20)
• Marcel shares the lessons learned the hard way throughout Productsup's expansion (24:00)

Connect with Marcel:

• LinkedIn
• Listen to the World of Commerce Podcast
• Visit Productsup's website

Let's connect: 

• LinkedIn
• Website

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Today, in our first episode together, I'm joined by Juan Mejia, Managing Director at BrightTower, to explore the sell side of an M&A, unpack a banker's role in it, and analyze the relational component of these operations. Juan started his journey as an IT guy, went in and out of business school, and switched to investment banking, accumulating 20 years of experience working for companies like Morgan Stanley, AGM Partners, Solomon Partners, and Drake Star before BrightTower. In 2022, Juan was awarded the "Boutique M&A Investment Banker of the Year" award at the 4th Annual USA M&A Atlas Awards, Middle Markets. 

Throughout our conversation, Juan talks about his role as an advisor in an M&A, how to determine if a potential client is a good fit, and what SaaS and startup founders on a LOI stage can do to create a strategic advantage with potential buyers. Juan also talks about what SaaS companies should never do during a negotiation to avoid getting sideways with the banker or the process, the phases of a selling process, the boundaries buyers and sellers should know, and much more. 

Tune in to the Episode 2 of In/organic Podcast, and get a glimpse of what happens on the banker's side of an M&A. 

In This Episode, You Will Learn:

• Juan talks about the role of a banker in an M&A (1:50)
• The relational side of Juan's job (4:20)
• How buyers can tell if a potential client is a good fit (11:00)
• The phases of a selling process (12:40)
• The M&A process is often a funnel (16:10)
• How to get strategic advantages with potential buyers (20:50)
• How to avoid getting sideways with a banker (27:10)

Connect with Juan:

• LinkedIn

Let's connect:

• LinkedIn
• Website

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In this episode, Erik Morton joins us to share his approach to building M&A pipeline in a SaaS company. We’ll double-click on the top funnel, including the criteria to consider when deciding what belongs in it or not. We also talk about the importance of building relationships with sell-side advisors, too. Erik is the Strategy SVP at CommerceHub and has over 20 years of experience in e-commerce and SaaS. Interestingly, he started as a software developer and product manager, which adds some superpowers to the way he is able to evaluate potential partner or acqusition opportunities.

Throughout our conversation, you'll hear about Erik's background and the moment he realized the most exciting place in a software business wasn't in finances but in engineering and product. He also shares his thoughts on the M&A funnel, the software development role in SaaS, and how to develop relationships and identify opportunities that can turn into revenue-driving partnerships or M&A opportunities. 

Tune in to Episode 2 of In/Organic Podcast and learn the secrets to building a strong M&A pipeline. 

In This Episode, You Will Learn:

• About Erik's background and his passion for the engineering and product side of software businesses (1:20)
• How to maximize tools and partners to develop a great top funnel (6:00)
• Eriks view on the whole funnel in an M&A context (8:30)
• How Erik deals with organic versus banker-led inbound opportunities (15:40)
• Erik discusess differences in view on what qualifies as bottom funnel (27:50)
• Erik shares lessons learned from over 20 years in the industry (34:00)

Connect with Erik:

• LinkedIn

Let's connect: 

• LinkedIn
• Website

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The In/Organic podcast was born out of years of experience working on M&A and business development initiatives that led to M&A in early-stage SaaS companies. In this series, we talk with founders and industry experts who are or have worked on the front lines of venture-backed M&A and business development.

My name is Christian Hassold, and I have over 24 years of experience as an operator in SaaS companies. After several successful endeavors as a CEO, where I had founded companies, grew them, and led them to successful exits, I decided I no longer wanted to be a CEO. Instead, I shifted my focus to helping CEOs scale their companies through a combination of inorganic and indirect growth initiatives.

In this episode, you will hear my background, and the "why" for launching this podcast.

Tune in and listen to the first episode of In/organic. Join me every two weeks as we shed light on organic, inorganic, and indirect growth strategies for hyperscale SaaS companies.

In This Episode, You Will Learn:

• A bit about Christian's background (1:10)
• Why this podcast was created (3:50)
• What can you expect from In/organic podcast (5:30)

Let's connect: 

• LinkedIn
• Website

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